Senior Team Discussion

Discussion in 'Italy: National Teams' started by Vieri's Left Foot, Dec 3, 2023.

  1. azzurri06

    azzurri06 Member

    Apr 4, 2007
    san francisco
    Take both SES and Orsolini. As stated, they both have something to offer. Drop Zaccagni.

    Drop a GK.

    Drop one of these:
    Darmian
    Di Lorenzo
    Cambiaso

    Drop a mid:
    Fratessi
    Folorunsho
    Ricci

    And then go win it
     
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  2. calabrese8

    calabrese8 Member+

    Feb 9, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    i'm not sure if people are ready to have the unpopular conversation..but Di Lorenzo should be dropped. Tactically he doesn't fit at all if we play a 3. Plus we already have Darmian Bellanova Cambiaso who can all play on the right side of a 3.
     
  3. indestructible

    indestructible Member+

    SSC Napoli
    Jan 14, 2007
    Mercato Professor
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Really doubt Di Lorenzo gets dropped. He is the best right back if we want to revert to a back 4.
     
  4. calabrese8

    calabrese8 Member+

    Feb 9, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Yes that I agree with. However, what is the likely hood Spalletti will use a back 4 (thats only known by him at this time). I dislike Di Lo in a 3 man setup (whether it be RCB or RWB/RM).

    I'd argue if not very likely.. in a pinch he could have Darmian or Bellanova play wide right in a back 4. Not ideal but again maybe its not in his plans.
     
  5. Non Venite in Puglia

    Juventus
    Italy
    Feb 26, 2021
    I’ve said this before on this thread—this isn’t PlayStation. You can’t come up with revolutionary formations and starting line ups a month before the tournament and expect to be successful. For as much as I like Calafiori, you can’t expect him to come in and immediately start against Albania. At the end of the day, this is a team sport, and those that Spalletti has ridden with until now will likely be the ones he rides with to start the tournament.

    Most realistic Starting 11 (if Spalletti sticks with the 3-4-2-1 formation) to begin the tournament is below:

    Donnarumma

    Darmian - Acerbi - Bastoni

    Cambiaso - Barella - Jorginho - Dimarco

    Pellegrini - Chiesa

    Scamacca/Retegui
     
  6. Gino22

    Gino22 Member

    Juventus
    Italy
    Apr 14, 2023
    Very happy with Fagioli in the squad. Even if he doesn’t go to Germany it’s good to see he is in the CTs plans
     
  7. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    Forgot to mention Politano's omission.

    To me it was clear that it should be Orsolini and Politano both going.

    Politano out entirely and Orsolini seems borderline to make it.

    Spalletti never did fully trust him even at Napoli.
     
  8. Mean Machine

    Mean Machine Member+

    May 23, 2018
    I am all for this! He is not tactically flexible at all, and I feel he was somewhat at fault for our loss vs England at Wembley
     
  9. Mean Machine

    Mean Machine Member+

    May 23, 2018
    Great lineup, but I really want to see Califiori and Bellanova there as well. Darmian is great, but he's been playing as a wing back more this season (still he can play both places which is great). However, I feel Calafiori might be better there, and Bellanova for Cambiaso. But both great options.
     
  10. Non Venite in Puglia

    Juventus
    Italy
    Feb 26, 2021
    I think starting the tournament with Inter’s defensive block that went to the Champions League final last year would be the smartest approach. Forcing Calafiori into the starting line up just to fill the RCB position (in a 3-4-2-1 formation) wouldn’t be wise or fair to him. He is left footed, like Acerbi and Bastoni, so having three left footed center backs would unnecessarily force him to play with his weaker foot. Nonetheless, with his passing ability and composure on the ball, I think Calafiori can easily slot in for Acerbi at some point in the tournament, which would give Italy a different look in possession. Calafiori is super versatile and can also deputize Bastoni and/or Dimarco. Before this year, he played predominantly as a left back, so if Spalletti were to use a 4-3-3, Calafiori could cover the LB role (Dimarco is much more effective in an advanced wingback role). It is thanks to Motta that Calafiori has been able to showcase his ability to cover so many different roles, even playing in midfield at times, and he will surely find playing time during the tournament.

    As for Bellanova, I think his pace and ability to stretch the defense would best be served later in matches when the opponent begins to tire. Cambiaso is a tactically smart player that can slot into midfield and help Barella and Jorginho when Italy doesn’t have the ball. Our central midfielders are not too physical and they will definitely need a hand chasing and tracking on the defensive side of the ball.
     
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  11. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    Locatelli had a bad season but so did Zaniolo, even worse than Loca did, and he would have gone, so I don't buy it. Did Ricci outperform Locatelli?

    Loca is one of the most senior players on this team that lacks experience. Many comment how Chiesa looks different for Italy compared to Juve. So why doesn't the same apply to Locatelli?

    As for Nicolò Fagioli. I love how this gives him a boost and lifts his morale. I can see the value in calling him in the Preliminary 30 if you want him going forward in future cycles, but I just can't justify giving him a place here. Only players like Barella, Chiesa or prime Bonucci could miss the entire season and then be called. Fagioli just doesn't have the tenure in Azzurro to be given the benefit of the doubt. Citing Gigi Allemandi from 1934, who I've now read about is proof of this given he was the incumbent and was part of successful Inter teams. Being fit and match fit are different animals. It's not just fitness (even if he undoubtedly is), it's timing, rhythm. Also, if people on here believed Italy lacked physicality in MF before, any Italy had was with Locatelli. That goes out the door. Flororunsho and Cristante do have some but a fair amount less than Locatelli does.

    This is a difficult Group with Spain, Croatia, and Albania. Especially match 2 & 3. Italy could very well be amongst the most inexperienced teams.

    The fears of Ciro Immobile being called also put to rest. Chapter closed.
     
  12. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    Rome-born Michael Flororunsho

    From Owngoal Nigeria:


    “Folorunsho was keen on playing at the AFCON and I tried to make it happen by texting the coach, he didn’t reply. When I called he picked and I introduced myself as a representative of Folorunsho and after a brief chat he promised to get back to me”.

    ‘Days went by and I called him but he didn’t pick and didn’t return my calls. It was two weeks later that the list of Nigeria for the tournament was made public. That’s how we got to where we are at the moment”.
     
  13. indestructible

    indestructible Member+

    SSC Napoli
    Jan 14, 2007
    Mercato Professor
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I don’t think the ability of Italy to change shape if we need a goal is outside the realm of possibility. Taking out a cb and adding an extra attacker or mod is perfectly within Spalletti’s repertoire. Guys like Bellanova and Darmian excel in in 3-5-2. It’s good to have balance
     
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  14. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    Earlier comment of dropping Frattesi.

    Not a chance of it happening. Vice-Barella as at Inter. Also, you want to keep your tattoo covered, sensitive, despondent but brilliant-on-his-day Center Forward content? You keep his best friend around.
     
  15. indestructible

    indestructible Member+

    SSC Napoli
    Jan 14, 2007
    Mercato Professor
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I somewhat disagree with you. It’s true that it would be foolish to revolutionize the starting the lineup from scratch, but at the same time it would be equally foolish to ignore a player that is hot. I don’t think Spalletti is the type to say “it works for Inter, I’m just going to copy and paste and hope for the best.” Spalletti has his own ideas and we’re going to see that.

    I’m reminded of Euro 2008. Donadoni thought he would just start the Milan midfield of Pirlo, Ambrosini and Gattuso because they won the CL a year prior. They got completely run over and dominated by the Dutch in the first game.
     
  16. indestructible

    indestructible Member+

    SSC Napoli
    Jan 14, 2007
    Mercato Professor
    Club:
    SSC Napoli
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Scanning social media, Fagioli set off a firestorm. People are really upset he is there
     
  17. nunzio23

    nunzio23 Member

    Juventus
    Italy
    Jul 16, 2021
    I like Fagioli but i cannot justify taking him over Locatelli even if the latter did have a not so up to par season. Of course I blame the terrorist Allegri for that, but Locatelli is easily in the top 5 most talented Italian midfielders. Who is playing the middle to sub for Jorgi now? I guess Cristante...

    And has been said, Politano's emission is comical. Easily the most impressive right sided winger in Italy as far as form / stats. Spaletti has never fully trusted him though.
     
  18. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    With these Callups, and the rumor that neither Orsolini or Zaccagni have a place secured, I think can rule out a 4-3-3.

    If Fagioli does go, then we are looking at what? A vice-Pellegrini? I love the kid and if he has a good camp, then take him. I'll gladly eat my words.

    Flororunsho is versatile enough to play multiple positions. He would likely be for Cristante. I think Flororunsho wins a spot over Ricci.
     
  19. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    Some Context

    Rabiot had a garbage season as well alongside Locatelli and still Deschamps called him to the France team. I'd argue more Juve fans want Rabiot out more than Locatelli. Being an ex Juve player and Manager, it surely couldn't be because Deschamps is out of touch what's happened the last 3 seasons.

    That said, Flororunsho has had a fine season, better than Locatelli, have to admit from what I've seen. The Ricci callup though? Unless Spalletti didn't want to bring Locatelli for Camp knowing his preference was Flororunsho.
     
  20. nunzio23

    nunzio23 Member

    Juventus
    Italy
    Jul 16, 2021
    Flororunsho is an attacking mid and definitely offers depth up front if you only go with so many forwards but Locatelli is far more skilled in the midfield and in front of the defense. There's room for both imo in the right combinations. It's just baffling to me that he was excluded...he was excellent at the last Euros
     
  21. Non Venite in Puglia

    Juventus
    Italy
    Feb 26, 2021
    The two “hot” players you may be referencing are Calafiori and Scamacca. My thoughts on both below:

    I explained in a subsequent comment, regarding Calafiori, that I think a player like him, who has had a phenomenal season, can ultimately grow into the tournament and find a starting spot by the KO rounds (knock on wood that Italy qualifies). I also explained in my subsequent comment that I don’t think his position would ultimately be the RCB role in Spalletti’s 3-4-2-1 because I don’t think it would be wise to play him on his weaker foot just to have him in the starting line up right away. In a 3-4-2-1, the RCB position for Italy will be one of three players: Darmian, Mancini, or Scalvini. Those are the options selected by Spalletti. The possibilities open to Calafiori are Acerbi’s CB position (most likely scenario), Bastoni’s LCB position (unlikely in a 3-4-2-1), or DiMarco’s LWB position (more likely in a 4-3-3 set up, where Calafiori would play as the LB). In the event there is an emergency, Calafiori might find himself playing in midfield, but this scenario is extremely unlikely in my opinion.

    In terms of Scamacca, Spalletti excluded him in March due to some behavioral issues that took place in November during the critical matches with Ukraine. However, unlike the other positions in the squad, the CF position has been a revolving door with Spalletti—Immobile, Raspadori, Retegui, and Scamacca have all seen time. Given the circumstances, I agree you go with the hot player up top to start the tournament.

    As for the remainder of the squad, I don’t see the benefit in throwing X,Y, and Z players into the mix just to see what happens.
     
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  22. Vieri#9

    Vieri#9 Member

    Real Madrid
    Italy
    Oct 22, 2023
    My quick thoughts on the list:

    Di Gregorio shouldve been called up but he would be #3 so really no play time.

    Locatelli and Jack shouldve been there. Especially Locatelli he would be the perfect midfield sub with Frattesi. This really is shocking, now I guess Cristante will get more play time but his play is so uninspiring. Locatelli always performed well with the national team, it should always go by that with talented players. Cristante was lucky he didnt cost us in the damn Ukraine game.

    Other than that, I really like the rest of the list. If Locatelli was there, it wouldve been perfect to me. So sad for him.
     
  23. Vieri#9

    Vieri#9 Member

    Real Madrid
    Italy
    Oct 22, 2023
    Scalvini plays both RCB and LCB for Atalanta. Darmian and Kayode have played both side back positions as well. You can try Calafiori at RCB in if he cant start at LCB. Shit just look at his beautiful right footed chip goal, its not like he cant use his opposite foot anyway.

    It will be really interesting to see how we incorporate Bastoni, Calafiori, Buongiorno, and Scalvini into future lineups.
     
  24. AGomes

    AGomes Member+

    Juventus
    Brazil
    Aug 29, 2023
    No he didn't almost cost Italy. Only a drunk Referee would have called that a PK.

    That was a dive by Mudryk. Cristante's foot was planted, studs down, no contact with any part of the leg. It was a big uproar given the occasion but never a PK.

    Agree on Di Gregorio. Should be the #3.
     
  25. calabrese8

    calabrese8 Member+

    Feb 9, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Fagioli will be the vice Jorginho. He's not a true regista but definitely has the traits to do it especially as one of the midfield 2 in a 3-4-2-1.
     

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