Bundesliga and the rest: Domestic and European competition discussion

Discussion in 'Germany: National Teams' started by Epitome990, Sep 28, 2017.

  1. BVBFNM

    BVBFNM Member+

    Apr 3, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Congratulations West Ham and especially Thilo Kehrer on winning the ECL.
     
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  2. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    he's 1st German to win it.

    we shall remember this trivia in 20 years.

    who was 1st German to win Conference League? LOL.
     
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  3. Collected

    Collected Member+

    Jul 19, 2014
     
  4. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    not a loss in the slighest, who cares about all of them especially the French players, LOL. Also almost all of the players listed aren't even closest to the face of 1BL, what a joke of a statement.

    one watches 1BL for the German players everyone else is just decoration.:whistling:

    I hope we see more and more and more Germans play 1BL in future!!!!!:thumbsup:

    have to laugh at how he's crying about 50+1 when the issue with those players is that 1BL is going for dev/sell model. So it has nothing to do with clubs needing money but clubs getting free players or cheap players while young to dev/sell them.....so 1BL itself is one who creates this whole players come play a few years then bail.

    and LMAO we have seen over and over and over how money means nothing. This thinking axing 50+1 and 1BL will suddenly be best, LMAO.

    money money money, got Hertha relegated, constantly Stuttgart in threat of relegation, Augsburg spent a LOT of money to barely survive. Years ago, Wolfsburg was spending left and right and that lead them to relegation battles. Oh and less we forgot about Bayern and their trash transfers and going out early in Cup, CL and barely winning 1BL, LOL.

    1BL has shit scouting, also why so many players flop and why not competitive in Europe. Also always funny how they make so much money in selling players but then they use that money to buy duds, LOL.

    also a LOT of foreign players admit they don't want to live in Germany nor are interested in learning or speaking German long term. Also a lot are not keen on how Germans are more cold-coaches aren't always nice etc, LOL.That is something a lot ignore, the foreign players would rather live in England, Spain, Italy etc. Also any South American would be more at home in Spain than Germany.

    every single season since I joined this forum and we get reports about how unprofessional the French players are and a lot of them can't even follow the rules etc.
     
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  5. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Kramaric for quick example is more of 1BL face than that entire list, LOL.
    Also LOL listing Plastic Leipzig players who come from most hated club in country, riiiiiiight.....
     
  6. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    The trouble is the player market is a seamless european market which isn't controlled by Bundesliga. I think if you could solve the problem by only picking german players, some clubs would try it and be successful.

    The EPL and Nation State money has caused a huge cost inflation right across europe, and that impacts german clubs.

    I don't really think you can fix it by only developing a german bellingham
     
  7. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    real question is why people care so much about EPL and La Liga? One would think 1BL was like 15th league and not top 3-4.

    its like when DFB is like other countries are ahead when its only a few countries.

    just because we aren't top doesn't mean we're bad.

    and yes 1BL clubs could be more competitive with better scouting and keeping core players. This whole dev/sell doesn't allow for consistant squads. And that's where focusing on Germans is far more benefitial but these clubs dev/sell which is never about Germans and then use that money for duds.
     
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  8. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    what I find bizarre is how one sees too many reactions that are weird if one looks at context of past 25 years.

    -this fixation about how 1BL needs to win Euro titles. Did people miss that between 2002 CL to 2010 CL, German clubs were GARBAGE in Europe. Its nothing new its cyclical. I 100% remember that 2003-2009 and how awful 1BL clubs were in Europe and how even Bayern was terrible too.
    -1BL has never been dominate league in Europe, so EPL, La Liga, Serie A overall tended to be better than us although these days Serie A are no longer the threat they used to be back in 90s-00s. Serie A have NOT won CL since 2010 when they beat Bayern....could be chance for Serie A to win their 1st CL in 13 years this weekend....WOW and people seem pissed about 1BL when Serie A is worst off.
    -that we won CL in 2020 and EL in 2022 is basically on track for our consistant record at those levels. Meaning we aren't regular winners in those competition. Our CL track record,

    80=1 Title, 3 Final L.
    90s=1Title, 1 Final L
    00s=1 Title, 1 Final L
    10s=1 Title, 3 Final L although 1/3 was vs the 1 Title
    20s=so far 1 Title

    aka we have averaged 1 Title for every decade from 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, 20s (incomplete decade). With biggest success in 80s and 10s.

    -the greatest success of 1BL was in 2013 German final between Dortmund and Bayern. There was 19 German players in that final
    -that also led to great NT success also boosted by fact that key players like Khedira, Ozil, Klose didn't play in 1BL. Its actually good to not have all the German players play 1BL anyways. As it allows those players to dev differently.
    -the fixation about German teenagers breakingthrough 1BL when reality most Germans don't breakthrough 1BL until 20s. Putting down late bloomers when late bloomers has always been a thing for Germans.
    -the quality of the next Generation German players will only push for potential for German clubs to get back in the ring but of course this won't happen for X number of years. But potentially its not extremely far away. And yes the cornestone of any and all 1BL clubs=German players.


    -Final note, one sees that CL success in 1BL is 100% tied with NT success. When Bayern won 3 back to back CLs in 1970s, Germany won Euro 72 and WC74, Euro 76 finalist. When Germany had 80s success in CL, Germany won Euro 80, WC90 and back to back WC finals in 82 and 86. Dortmund contingent who won CL97 also involved in Euro 96 with Germany. When Germany had CL 2013 All German finals, Germany won 2014 WC and if not for Gomez injury we would have won Euro 2016 too.

    Bonus Bayern CL winners in 2001 and Bayer CL 2nd place in 2002, led to supposed worst ever German contingent to WC finals in 2002.

    This is why those who don't give a shit about Domestic/German players and breakingthrough and more interested in foreign players seem to miss. That historically our success in CL is linked with NT.

    so I will continue to NOT GIVE A SHIT about non-Germans, LOL.

    sure one wonders why 2020 CL trophy didn't lead to anything but CC17 trophy (although tbf, that era is NOT yet over), but that's also due to how stupid Low became and how stupid Flick has been as coach. And also an erasure of German traits that WERE ALWAYS KEY TO WINNING ANY TROPHY. Those traits disappeared after 2014 WC. And why guys like Wuck and others want to install those traits to next Generation and it has worked as we have seen and Wuck talked about it as if its something we haven't seen much in Germany for YEARS.

    so yeah the key to Germany's success is likely gonna rely on the next Generation. And given quality is there in mass, its more about patience. Also due to not every top talents play in CL club, will require transfers down the line, which would take even more time.
     
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  9. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    wow what a downgrade/flop, Naby Keita is back in 1BL at Bremen this time......
     
  10. BVBFNM

    BVBFNM Member+

    Apr 3, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    I wouldn't say he flopped. It's just that injuries keep adding up.
     
  11. Alex C

    Alex C Member+

    Oct 27, 2015
    Chatham
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I’m surprised he passed the medical.
     
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  12. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    And Serie A continues their drought in CL from 2010-present.

    for a farmer's league
    Oil City XI=Akanji (ex Dortmund), Gundo (German, ex Dortmund), Haaland (ex Dortmund), de Bruyne (ex Wolfsburg)

    Bench=Ortega (German, ex AB)

    Inter Milan had
    XI=Calhanoglu (poached by Turkey, ex Bayer), Dzeko (ex Wolfsburg)
    Sub=Mkhitaryan (ex Dortmund)

    mostly ex Dortmund with 4 ex Dortmund players in final aka 3/4 winning.
     
  13. Boandlkramer

    Boandlkramer Member+

    Apr 9, 2009
    Samma Weltmeister!
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Was anyone actually rooting for Citeh? Gross
     
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  14. BVBFNM

    BVBFNM Member+

    Apr 3, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    No.
     
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  15. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    damn just realized
    -CL=Inter Milan Final L
    -EL=Roma Final L
    -Conference League=Fiorentina Final L

    has to be a record, LOL.
     
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  16. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I want City and Real to win every title for the next 10 years and burn club football to the ground
     
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  17. Brandko

    Brandko Member+

    Dec 12, 2013
    Rapha Guerreiro to Bayern to be made official. This follows the confirmation of Konrad Laimer from Leipzig joining Bayern recently
     
  18. BVBFNM

    BVBFNM Member+

    Apr 3, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Dunno why, but unlike Chelsea, M. City's CL win feels so hollow.
     
  19. Brandko

    Brandko Member+

    Dec 12, 2013
    The Underdog element plays a part in it. In the 2020-21 season where Chelsea won the CL, they were able to beat City who won the EPL rather comfortably. Chelsea advancing past Real Madrid in the semis also added to the build up

    Man City this season pretty much cruised their way through the CL knockout stages, and won a rather dry finals match vs Inter
     
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  20. BVBFNM

    BVBFNM Member+

    Apr 3, 2016
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Chelsea were also heavy underdogs in the 2012 final.
     
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  21. Collected

    Collected Member+

    Jul 19, 2014
    They could potentially lose the U20 World Cup final and the UEFA Nations League final as well lol It’s most likely not going to happen but it would be hilarious if it did. Just imagine the memes.
     
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  22. johnny6

    johnny6 Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    Jun 29, 2011
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    And what "finals" have you guys qualified for recently?
     
  23. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    #10448 Ger90, Jun 11, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2023
    bro take it easy, we aren't mocking Serie A or Italian footy. People here have a loathing of EPL and La Liga though that's 100% true.

    I mean we had it worst with Bayer Neverkusen in 2002
    2nd place in 1BL, 2nd place in DFB Cup, 2nd place in CL final, 2nd place in World Cup 2002.....ha beat that, LMAO.

    almost our entire 2000s era players were almost winners. And tbh, people 100% do laugh about the Bayer Neverkusen era, because its crazy how they were so close to winning everything. Just like how Serie A almost won 3 Euro trophies in 1 season. The laughing is more about how crazy it is.

    and to answer you question
    -CL 2020=Trophy
    -U21 Euro 2021=Trophy
    -EL 2022=Trophy
    -U17 Euro 2023=Trophy

    we are 4/4 for our recent finals or ones in 2020s, with 2 titles in Europe, so we've had success. And as mentioned above in my post, 1BL averages 1 CL per decade so as of now we have won the MIN for 2020s era.

    Italy/Serie A so far
    -Euro 2020=Trophy
    -Conference League 2022=Trophy
    That's it but if you add the 3 Ls, that's only 2/5 from finals.

    Your next final is U20 WC and potentially Nations League with Senior NT. But 2 Ls there and you risk 2/7, which is really poor. Have to win these.

    I hope Italy U20 wins the U20 WC though as I do want Italy to get back to strengh and make rivalry stronger. And you guys have shot at winning U19 Euro and U21 Euro too.

    and do everyone here a favor and eliminate Spain in Nations League SF!!!!! Nobody wants to see obnoxious Spain win anything, let their drought continue.
     
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  24. johnny6

    johnny6 Member+

    AC Milan
    Italy
    Jun 29, 2011
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Italy isn't winning shit, they're already being dominated by Uruguay and not a chance in hell we're beating Spain.

    I hope I'm wrong but that's how things go with these inconsistent teams. Definitely agree with your la Liga and EPL assessment though, if anything we'll always have that mutual understanding
     
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  25. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    and Italy U20 also lose a final, not the year of finals for Italian football. 4th L in past like 10 days.

    Congrats to Uruguay for a country of population of 3.4M people winning their 1st ever U20 WC. Although doubt this will lead to any WC trophy. The failed to win even with Suarez, Cavani, Forlan etc.
     

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