St. Louis CITY v. Houston Dynamo, Saturday, June 3

Discussion in 'Houston Dynamo' started by newtex, Jun 1, 2023.

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Result?

Poll closed Jun 3, 2023.
  1. Dynamo win

    2 vote(s)
    100.0%
  2. Dynamo tie

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Dynamo lose

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. St. Louis? Ugh!

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    goal 2 steres is chasing his man on the freekick, can't contest the header much, and then per keystone cops rules the marking breaks down, artur has to slide in to cover an open man leaving the back door man open. to me artur is so bent on shoving the guy he's after that he loses focus on where the ball is.
     
  2. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #27 juvechelsea, Jun 3, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2023
    goal 3 the PK is shaky. i think steres got him a little from behind as opposed to pure shoulder charge but that's nit-picky given the height difference. often enough that's a goal kick.

    that would be 2 on steres underlining my concerns about others as well.

    since i am not going to back down i will point out bartlow doesn't do sh*t to help on the play. he can't decide if he's going to step to his man with the ball on the through pass or chase the runner. so he backpedals off the passer, giving him space to play, but then just kind of jogs away from the play as steres chases. it's similar to some of the goals midweek as everyone is backpedalling from the ball without sorting well who has whom. to me either step to ball and make it hard to pass -- or god forbid win the ball -- or help steres double the runner. or god forbid retreat to the middle instead of drifting to the flag as the play disintegrates.

    and a lot of that has to do with bartlow is glacially slow which is probably why he's not bothered trying to help steres without a jetpack. the play just flies by him.

    i keep harping on personnel because this just looks to me like third rate backs who can't either win the ball or communicate to get assignments sorted if they won't. you need new faces if you want new results. i assume pat is gunshy because he's already signed dozens of backs. to me you need to keep churning til it works or you're trying to pretend you didn't screw up at our detriment in reality. half the problem in houston is we bat a low average then are loathe to admit a mistake.
     
  3. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    to me pat should be gone NOW so we can try and fix this in the summer -- i have zero confidence handing him more money expecting competent personnel work, and i am concerned he will defend what he has done right off the cliff. that then allows you to spend the second half of the season with a new GM and some roster revamp and evaluate if ben can hack it with better players or is an equal half of the problem as other recent hires have been.
     
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  4. quiznatodd_bidness

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Apr 14, 2020
    Season’s over. They’re not going to fire Onstad (not saying they shouldn’t, I’m saying because the way the team is run they won’t). There’s no help coming this summer. This team hasn’t made a summer signing that’s made a difference in at least ten years. Onstad stays on until August of 2024 and the next peabrain comes in to run the team.
     
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  5. DonJuego

    DonJuego Member+

    Aug 19, 2005
    Austin, TX
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not seeing much to convince me we will finish above 50%. If we nip into the playoffs it looks like a useless low seed. Having said that, I don't consider the season over. We still have a strong home record. In a couple years where the Dynamo made the Cup home record was great but road record sucked with no win coming away until the last few games of the season.

    It only takes a couple road wins to turn a season around if your solid at home. Staying solid at home is not easy though -- and I've concerns about what I am seeing in this team. But there is plenty of soccer left.

    In last few seasons the Dynamo would have already dropped 10 points at home by now.
     
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  6. DonJuego

    DonJuego Member+

    Aug 19, 2005
    Austin, TX
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    JuvieChelsey earns his treatment. I guess your working on that, not by criticising a player -- but by making a stupid ass comment blaming a goal on the player least responsible for it. Those are just facts. Get butt hurt all you want.
     
  7. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Putting the two extremely soft penalties we encountered tonight, we did lose 1-0 in a packed stadium to apparently a very solid expansion team. Brightside is our players show more grit and fight. An old hallmark of the early Dynamo teams with Ching, De Ro, Mullan, Rico and Robinson etc. Players that really fought till the final whistle.
    Bad news is our offense is severely lacking. We get chances but just do not convert.
     
  8. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #33 juvechelsea, Jun 4, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2023
    hmmm after VAR review i have decided to qualify my earlier post. 9 goals in 2 games is too many to say ben's running the team competently. i also note most of his wins are against cellar teams which is not really any improvement on recent years. i therefore break spades on wandering towards "out for ben's job." LAFCx2 plus SJ is a schedule buzzsaw but if we continue to put up any more lopsided games like this, do not waste my time and can him with pat post haste. he has a few games to show me he's not useless. they are not going to be easy games. this is how pro soccer works fair or unfair.

    however i think the shabby GM work at this team is the root cause of our problems. if we had a good roster a chimp could coach this to above the red line. if you go value rroster and value coach then the stars have to align just so and they just never do. at minimum, they aren't for pat any more than for matt before him. their successor should not have a first name ending in -at or -att and their last name must have fewer or more than two syllables.
     
  9. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #34 juvechelsea, Jun 4, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2023
    you missed the arm wrapped on the first one. 30 tries the arm bar after they are split.

    they lack quality enough to compete so i could give a f*ck less making excuses how hard they played. 6-2 followed by 3-0 to an expansion team. get me different players. if you want grit make them players combining technique, defense, and the desired grit.

    the core isn't good enough to carry this -- sebas, HH, coco -- and the supporting cast is mostly bench level eg baird artur bartlow micael on and on. people can make fun of me for going after non-team-approved HH but what this team needs rat this moment is someone who can score a hat trick by themselves regardless how the trash supporting cast plays. which is our only chance to keep up if we ship 3. HH does the odd classy thing but can't really carry this very far, like DQ last year. it is a recipe for posting how clever that thing he did was while we lose 2-0 or 3-0. i want the result and 90 minutes of dominant play, not to applaud the odd class effort.

    i expect the brass will ditch sebas but not HH because we adore nibbling around the edges like the Titanic is "almost there if we just let it" and don't seem to grasp why the elis 2017 team succeeded where the rest have not. we do not seem willing to consider that the vast majority of this is that rotten and the idea that you can keep HH and then put pat in charge of supplying some awesome supporting cast is laughable. he can barely find helpful starts much less actual stars to lift this. you therefore have to attack the leading elements and IMO shift to more productive ones. in the absence of net filling, i don't think we quietly get such great defense that a low production big salary 8 is justifiable. we need the actual steak up top, and IMO more than one. sebas plus one.

    or we can keep trying to fix things with peripheral U22s making $300k with no production history. as opposed to clearing out the DPs and big earners who can't win. the results of that approach speak for themselves.

    hadebe then gets reassessed when healthy. no point putting a hurt player on the block anyway.
     
  10. 7seven7

    7seven7 Member+

    May 5, 2008
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm the one with a "hurt butt"?? okie dokie lol
     
  11. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    2 players A and B step to an attacker. the attacker splits both, player A pulls him down, PK, goal. are you really suggesting player B had nothing to do with it? f*cking laughable. if a dribbler did that to me i would be embarrassed even if i didn't give up the kick personally.

    show any actual defender the footage i have pointed to and ask them if they thought he did a good job. more pointedly ask them if based on what they are seeing, these players are the "endgame" for this being a playoff team. i think that's the even better question. people can try and make fake debates out of responsibility on sequences I WOULD BE EMBARRASSED IF I DID IN SELECT OR COLLEGE. like i was told not to do x as a U16 and watch a pro do it. fine. it's even more fake to defend all these guys like this is the team. and the thing is when we nibble at the roster like we do, it might be a year and a half from when we see sebas has issues to when this team does anything about it. so if i both see errors and don't see the long term use of a player, i will start talking now. we might do something about it in 24 or 25 at which point maybe one honest person on here will admit i was right, and the rest will either devil's advocate a clear decision or make the argument then but not acknowledge the previous authors in their bibliography, then act like i am wrong all the time.

    brian is trying to make some lame triangulation where maybe just maybe they somehow limp into the playoffs this year so don't touch it, while CYA'ing with the odd comment that this wasn't that talented to begin with. to me "only a moron" stands pat on poor personnel when his gut feeling seems to be this is marginal at best. but he only thinks that when he's being honest and not trying to show me up. we essentially agree this thing lacks talent and is thus marginal at best to do anything. the difference is i live there. he then accuses me of straddling. i'm not the one saying it's not good enough while playing to the crowd when we name specific players to dump. eggs have to be broken for the omelette. based on what i see, more than sebas. "any moron" should see that from 6-2, 3-0, etc.

    we have tried limping to the playoffs for about a half decade and repeatedly not just come up short but been distant from the line. quit p*ssy-footing around. clear out the driftwood and aggressively chase the playoffs. in bulk. not a guy or two. two new DPs.
     
  12. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    i think some of you are incredibly gullible. you act like this is building somewhere don't touch it. we routinely start players with the following ages

    37 29 32 31 33 29 28 27 27 27 27 27

    is that team set up for "now" or for "later?" maybe pat TELLS you it's for later -- to placate your anger -- but those ages are MEANT to achieve whatever they do NOW. there is no tomorrow for HH and clark. only a moron sees them as the 2025 foundation when pat pretends he has it all fixed. in 3-5 years are any of HH clark steres swiatchenko etc. going to even be around? this is a "win now" team that doesn't "win now." the one area where we might kind of be youthful and have a 3-5 year horizon is the sputtering frontline. every line behind that is set up for today but not winning the day. if this is win now we are sh*tty for a present day team so you better get off your tookus for this season. you need to do it now because clark HH etc. have little tread left and will pop back out of the team soon enough and back to square one. if this is a 3-5 year project i need to start seeing raines playing more and more consistent acquisition of good youthful talent that sees the field where there is any possibility of a long term foundation. as it stands this is being sold as a long term project while many of the ket players could play TORSO ball, a patent contradiction.

    this is BAD for a NOW team. this is OLD for a TOMORROW team. pick an endgame and chase it like you mean it.

    last point, how many years are we going to lose to expansion teams and how long before you catch on what that means in terms of basic organizational competence?
     
  13. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    which players constitute the long term (3-5 years) foundation of this soccer team? who are we building around that gets the job done?

    exactly.
     
  14. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I did like the grit and fight, we need more of that. But it isn't synced up with any sort of excellence in play or cohesion in many other areas of the field. I will admit i missed big chunks of the game to watch hockey and baseball.

    Road - 0-6-2 thus far, and 1 of those "2" draws we were badly outplayed at RBNY. On Dynamo reddit someone posted our road record since 2016 and it is 11 wins in 111 games, or about 10%. Prior to that from 2006-16 it was 25%, not great, but still passable. Think about it, if you tuned into Apple TV to watch 17 Dynamo road games this year, you would expect them to win once or twice in those 17 games. That's not a great payback on time investment for fans

    I'll go back a bit to the Vancouver game - how do you allow two goals within 30 seconds of the beginning of each half? That's like youth league stuff
     
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  15. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What will keep Onstad on another year is the expanded playoffs taking top 9 in each conference will leave almost every team alive for a playoff spot into September ("yeah, you know Glenn, if we can take 9 points out of our final 5 games we have a good chance to qualify"). And probably a heavy emphasis on the USOC to try and cover for league performance deficiencies.

    I'll move this discussion over to the roster thread, but what exactly are we trying to build? My analogy is like we are collecting a hodgepodge of Lego minifigures from various themed sets (like one Bobo Fett, another from an Indiana Jones set, etc) and trying to turn them into some sort of cohesive package.
     
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  16. 7seven7

    7seven7 Member+

    May 5, 2008
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agree. We've been the team of a lovable bunch of mutts for years now and it looks like this year is no different. Work rate, grit, heart, determination, etc all look good on a poster hanging in the hallway but what really gets the job done is talent. And in that department, we are bereft.
     
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  17. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think there is a happy balance. Look, when we hired Olsen I wasn't envisioning 4-2 Total Soccer wins happening. He's a blood and guts 1-0 wins guy. But he should be raising the overall level of competitiveness (which I think on average he has).

    our roster construction is odd. We have like what, 6 left backs on this roster? Our attacking talent is thin, yes the hardest and most expensive to find but other teams seem to uncover these guys and/or pay them.
     
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  18. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #43 CeltTexan, Jun 4, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2023
    Haven't our team under Olsen now in 2023 surrendered 2 goals at home? What are the comparable stats from the past 10 seasons.

    Our actual wins record from 2006-2016 might ring up as 25%, however I do recall at out our last home games at The Rob, the not losing at home stat was .713. Which is just incredible. So again, how many wins and draws do we have at Name Here Park from 2016-2022? And what that stat is this season in 2023?

    Look, our players have surrendered 9 goals in the last two league matches, very bad defense, but we've defeated Austin twice so far this season and stolen a late point away from Dallas spoiling their home win over us. Olsen has found a way to get a good team out in Cup play where we are in the Quarterfinals and Clark is playing like a giant betweenthe sticks!
    I was expecting much less than this on all fronts so we know our club is on the rise. We know we need better midfield cohesion and certainly strikers that create on their own.
     
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  19. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #44 juvechelsea, Jun 4, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2023
    it's not "constructed." that is an indulgent description. pat didn't anticipate losing lundqvist but that was going to be a poor decision if he kept him. pat signed a couple dudes over the winter including someone with an ACL. ACL guy wasn't ready he signs two more. realizes he's screwed up signs another. pat is sufficiently incompetent can't literally sign 2 winners and put his feet up. that is not planned or built. that's you mis-hammer some nails and the crossbar doesn't look steady so you nail some more. is it fixed now? not sure. you want to live in that house? maybe hire another construction worker/contractor.

    to be fair, i want some degree of honesty, transparency, and fixing of our leadership mistakes. that would justify maybe a third guy. we sign clown after clown. at that point the sheer numbers start accumulating. if that happens you look incompetent and it's time to move on. the clear picture is you can't tell talent from anything. maybe hire a former field player to scout if field players can play. we keep hiring keepers?

    there are very few adds this year that have solved a problem -- perhaps bassi. as in we found someone who fills a gap and could be built around. beyond that, replacement level work.

    the dodge at this point is to note our moderate payroll (used to be just plain bad), or say they don't all turn out. true, but batting average. this is this bad because we add very few impact players and instead get tons of journeymen and outright trash. the game is to say we are working on it but the leadership f*cking up the last one generally get to pick the next one too and they don't get magically better. you can't find one impact guy a window and assemble 11 studs in any hurry.

    i point back to the table, there are plenty of other low to medium payroll teams in our conference and while they cluster bottom some rise above it. what doesn't get looked at is why. it's usually tough disciplined tactics meeting sharp personnel work.

    right now the deal is we want to play 1-0 but we can't pitch the shutout with the injuries and we can't get the second goal often enough to get the result that way.
     
  20. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    i don't expect ben is fired rapidly but i also feel like we have a standard timeline on such things that hasn't ever actually worked. we wait til it's so late we are rushing to hire someone new for the next season. we half bake the next hire. we keep the GM. rinse. repeat. some folks on here will defend it, argue it's logical, ad hominem me some more. then same bs next season. so maybe quit wasting time and repeating ourselves. maybe grow a pair while the season could be salvaged.

    re the people referring to home record, they are neglecting WHO we beat here. then-struggling AUS***=8W (but having burned one more game than us). NYC = 13E. LAG=14W (dead last).MIA=15E (dead last). if we play harder teams at home, have you considered maybe the home record is prone to the same correction???^^^

    we have the worst road record of any team in MLS. period. arguing schizophrenia is misleading as the reality is you don't play half schedules. you play a sum total of both. put together we are below the red line. record <.500. negative GD. bottom few offense. the defense that was leading corrected to mid-table and that's before the upcoming LAFC and SJ three games.

    we have a history of these kind of corrections.

    last, the most recent games are not just tough luck 1-0 but like we are run off the park. 3-0, 6-2. what you are doing isn't working.

    ^^^for comparison SJ who superficially has a very similar home and away like us, has home wins on LAFC, VAN, and us. surely you see how that might have more staying power over time than beating up on bad teams.

    ***AUS started the season sh*tty with an awful defense but compared to our usual summer swoon they have quietly passed us back up. it's a marathon and not a sprint. we are like boricua 800 runners who race out to the first lap lead then crater money on the table on the final lap. worse, i think they get a little ego about the fast start like they have done sh*t. first few games into a season and no playoffs in 6 years you ain't done sh*t til we clinch.
     
  21. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    grit, i appreciate this is a tougher unit and scheme than say ramos' bunch but i thought that was a disgrace and performing grit is basic professionalism -- and necessary tactics on our budget. i also feel like a false dichotomy has been set up where attacking precision is placed at odds with defensive grit. this badly needs better setup play and some snipers. i think it's unfortunate that sebas has been framed in terms of laziness because whoever he replaces will need his technical qualities or even better mated with the work ethic we want.

    last, sorry, but 3-0 and 6-2 says you aren't even really doing grit right. you make like some moments but on the goals what i saw looked disorganized, poor in the air, backpedalling when someone should be stepping to the ball. it might be tough at times but it's hardly a 90' consistent final product hence my defensive criticisms. it means well but is poorly executed and so consistently so it's obviously personnel.

    and at a point the inability of the personnel guy to supply sufficient personnel to execute schemes should mean the personnel guy's job.
     
  22. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    last, i explained midweek how opponent GF explains game results even better than table standing. against teams with around a goal a game or worse, we are competitive. against teams significantly over a goal a game we have issues every time. those weaker offenses tend to correlate to bad teams but we have some ties on bad offenses that somehow are good table teams.

    the grit only works within limited bounds against weaker offenses. as the teams improve on offense we can't hold them enough or have enough firepower to keep up/ahead.
     
  23. Brian Gilchriest

    Eintracht Frankfurt
    United States
    Oct 3, 2020
    Coco needs to step up. He does really well in the middle third, but the final pass he gets right 1/10 times it seems. I actually think there's good cohesion defensively and has been all year, in in the defending and middle thirds going forward, but final third has been a mess all year. Aliyu is actually helping bring that together because he makes smart runs and can do something with the ball at his feet.

    We've played a ton of games in a short span. We've had midweek games in like 6 of the last 7 weeks. Add to that insane travel schedule and it wouldn't be easy for anyone.
     
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  24. Heft

    Heft BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 20, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    A frustrating player to watch. A superb athlete that is always in the right place, being involved, but passing to nobody, or takes one too many touches.
     
  25. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Not saying he should replace Coco, but this is the reason I like Thor. He just blasts the ball the moment he gets a chance. We've seen this tepid attitude towards shooting for years now. They are looking for the perfect shot, and that rarely comes.
     
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