U20 World Cup 2023

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Ombak, Mar 26, 2023.

  1. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    My prediction turned out to be wrong. The Koreans played well and built a 2-0 lead before the final score.

    It is worth remembering that the Republic of Korea was the runner-up in the 2019 FIFA U-20 World Cup - the last edition of the tournament before the Covid-19 shutdowns that paralyzed the world. As such, it should not be surprising the Koreans are in the quarterfinals.

    Incidentally, Korea met Ecuador in 2019 as well; the Koreans eliminated Ecuador with a 1-0 win in the semifinals.
     
  2. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Brazil x Israel starts in 20 mins.

    Brazil will be without 2 suspended defenders (Robert and Arthur) and 2 injured (GK Mycael and LB Kaiki).

    Line-up: Kaique, André, Jean, Douglas Mendes, Guilherme Biro; Andrey Santos, Marlon Gomes, Marquinhos; Sávio, Matheus Martins, Marcos Leonardo.
     
  3. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Bad match for Brazil so far, unable to handle the high pressure by Israel. Israel have threatened on a couple of crosses or set pieces. 25 mins in 0x0.
     
  4. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Half-time 0x0. Israel still pressuring and better, but a couple of occasions Brazil were able to make the best chances of the game.

    Still, something needs to change for Brazil in the second half.

    Brazil are putting in a lot of poor passes even without the pressure and if Israel had a final pass or some penetration, we'd probably be down at the half.
     
  5. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Brazil 1x0 early in the second half (10 mins). First-time shot by Marcos Leonardo, perfectly placed.

    Israel may not be able to keep up the pressure and hopefully Brazil clean up the passing. If we do, should be a very different second half.
     
  6. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Israel tie it right back up on a great header. 1x1 15 mins into the second half.
     
  7. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    1x1 at 90 minutes, we're going to overtime. Brazil has had chances, good subs came on, but far from what I hoped.
     
  8. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Nice goal right at the start of overtime. Passing down the right gets into the box, Andrey backheels it and Matheus Nascimento finishes. 2x1 91 mins.
     
  9. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    And Israel ties it seconds after their kickoff. Amazing how both goals came right after we scored. Very poor from Brazil.

    2x2 94 mins.
     
  10. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Israel scores at the end of first half OT. Turgeman was their most skilled player but didn't get chances earlier. In the box he dribbles two players and scores a golaço.

    3x2. Second half of OT now.
     
  11. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    PK for Israel now, 6 mins into 2nd half of OT.

    Keeper saves and ref gives a PK on the follow-up as the keeper comes out to try and block the second attempt.

    Second one is missed by Israel, still 3x2, 5 minutes plus added time left.
     
  12. Estuardo A. Lopez

    Jul 9, 2014
    Club:
    AC Milan
    I guess Brazil likes to die at the quarterfinals.
     
  13. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Brazil eliminated. Even though the first half ended 0x0 it feels like the game was lost there. Israel were not as dominant afterwards but were always the more composed, more mature team. They answered both goals immediately and won with a great individual effort on the third.

    Ramon I think will get the brunt of this and deservedly so. A bit embarrassing for him that instead of rushing to Spain to coach Brazil in the friendly right after the U20 final (or third place match) he now has a whole week off instead.
     
  14. Estuardo A. Lopez

    Jul 9, 2014
    Club:
    AC Milan
    This was so frustrating.
    The SA U20 Championships gave me a totally different feeling about Brazil. The final game against Uruguay was fantastic because it showed Brazil in total command, something I never felt at the World Cup.
    On a side note, what happened to Andrey?
     
  15. Estuardo A. Lopez

    Jul 9, 2014
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Its so frustrating because just like at the senior World Cup in Russia (against Belgium) and Qatar (against Croatia) I always felt that Brazil could have done better, that Brazil did not leave everything on the field.
     
  16. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    It is frustrating, but I hesitate to compare it to the senior World Cup because this is literally a different category.

    We didn't qualify in 2019 and 2017. Before that we were second (2015), not qualified (2013) and champions for the fifth time (2011).

    This also isn't exactly the end of the cycle. Now it's time to think about the U23s for the 2024 Olympics, which players from here will form the base of that team (Andrey, Robert, Vitor Roque for example), which players will be added (André, Danilo, Vanderson and many other options).

    The question of course is who will coach. I do think coaching is an issue. Ramon probably would have been given the job automatically if he won or even made the top 4. Now, who knows.

    Also, when we finally hire a senior team coach we are supposed to be hiring a national teams director/coordinator too. Will they play a role in defining how the U23 proceed?
     
    Estuardo A. Lopez repped this.
  17. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Andrey's best game was probably against Tunisia but that was largely with some space to run on counter attacks. Overall Brazil were not good after going down a man.

    Andrey has been in poor form (relatively speaking) at Vasco too before the tournament. It happens. He definitely needs to learn from it, especially as the team leader.

    I think the standouts were Sávio and Marquinhos, who came on as subs against Italy and were starters after that. They made us a lot more dangerous. Also Marlon Gomes, Marcos Leonardo and Arthur.
     
  18. aerez

    aerez Member+

    River Plate
    Argentina
    Jul 8, 2006
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    When did the Olympics suddently become the U23? or the next phase?
    I remember back before 2005, it wasn't even considered in the discussion. It was just another tournament with other football players from another competition?

    Do you guys know when it started becoming more serious? Because even in Argentina I'm realizing like it's part of the "next system"
     
  19. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I had to look it up. The U23 limit for the Olympics has been since 1992. In 1996 they added the 3 overage spots.

    Brazil did well in the 80s and 92 but didn't win. So all the way back in 1996 it was already somewhat important, as we wanted that last missing title. But whether the approach was organized or serious depended on each cycle.

    But as far as the "next step" it's been like that since then, the difference is in how organized (or disorganized) everyone is in moving through the age groups and integrating the youth programs into the overall project.
     
  20. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    I finally caught highlights. Defensive inattention on the second Israeli goal, and credit to the Israelis for a great third goal. Disappointing - but the Israelis appear to play a European brand of soccer. They didn't fear Brazil and pressed Brazil from the get-go. It still sucks as Brazil was winning twice and theoretically could have won this match.

    Not a waste, though. Brazil still won the South American U20 and there's talent there for the future. Attention now turns to the 2024 Olympic qualifying process and of course, to the senior NT.

    In the other matches: Italy destroyed Colombia 3-1. Let's remember that Colombia is the one team in CONMEBOL U-20 competition Brazil faced and did not defeat in this past January's qualifying event. South Korea with that winning goal in overtime over the Nigerians - good for them. They are after all 2019's second-place team; can the Koreans go all the way? If yes, they'll have to face Italy. And just this afternoon, Team USA's amazing run ends at the hands of.... Uruguay, that eternal spoiler. Uruguay again with the darkhorse mantle.

    Israel vs. Uruguay and Italy vs. Korea. We will have a new FIFA U-20 World Cup champion.
     
  21. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I'm pretty impressed with Korea reaching two top 4s in a row.

    If you want to feel old (well, if you're old enough) consider that none of the players in the Italy x South Korea match were born yet when those two teams met in the infamous 2002 World Cup match.

    Uruguay were favorites over Brazil in the South American tournament at one point. Brazil's win in that final match was a little unexpected. Now they're the only CONMEBOL rep left.

    Uruguay x Italy would be a marquee match-up from a traditional perspective, but I'm fond of Korea, so hoping for a Korea x Uruguay final.
     
    ganapordiego repped this.
  22. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Final will be Uruguay x Italy, Sunday at 6pm local time (5pm Eastern US). I'll probably watch some of that. Uruguay were arguably the favorites in the CONMEBOL tournament, but we beat them in the end. They're down a few players and really embodying garra charua in this tournament.

    Italy are more fun to watch at this level and with some exciting players and interesting relational tactics.

    The third-place match will be earlier in the day (2:30pm local) between Korea and Israel.
     
  23. reefz

    reefz New Member

    Jun 10, 2011
    Club:
    Santos FC
    Uruguay for the win and be Champions!!!!!
     
  24. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Uruguay won. It's their first ever U20 World Cup title.

    It also means that all men's World titles right now are held by South American teams.

    U17 - Brazil
    U20 - Uruguay
    U23 (Olympics) - Brazil
    WC - Argentina

    Of course, WC to the others is apples and oranges, but it does speak to the talent produced by the region and even the coaching (despite the current cynicism about Brazilian coaches overall).
     
  25. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Well, with the U20 WC wrapped up, the next big cycle for this age group is the U23 next year: South American tournament in January/February (Venezuela, dates TBC) and, for only 2 teams that qualify, the 2024 Olympics in Paris (July/August 2024).

    In between, the Pan Am games will be played this year (Oct/Nov in Chile). Brazil has qualified (through the U20 tournament) and the tournament is U22 but is not as significant due to the timing and prestige.

    It will be interesting to see who might join the national team for the U23 cycle. A lot of interesting names are eligible (must be born Jan 1 2001 or later). Here are some:

    Goalkeepers
    Matheus Cunha (FLA) 2001
    Adriel (GRE) 2001

    Right-backs
    Vanderson (Monaco) 2001
    Vinicius Tobias (2004). He was eligible but not released for U20 WC - but with Real Madrid letting him return to Shakhtar, he is very likely to be available in Jan/Feb.

    Defenders
    Natan (Red Bull Bragantino) 2001 - This is one area where the U20s might have all 3 or 4 spots covered with players like Robert, Jean, Douglas and Beraldo or Kaiky. Not many I found in the 2001/2002 years that would challenge them.

    Left-backs
    Welington (São Paulo) 2001
    Lucas Pires (Santos) 2001
    Luan Candido (Red Bull Bragantino) 2001

    Midfielders
    André (FLU) 2001
    Danilo (Nottingham Forest) 2001
    João Gomes (Wolverhampton Wanderers) 2001
    Matheus Martinelli (FLU) 2001

    Forwards
    Probably the other area where the U20 have most positions covered, depending on whether players are released or not, but some interesting names that are eligible:
    Yuri Alberto (COR) 2001
    Rodrygo (Real Madrid) 2001 - Yep, technically age eligible, though obviously not going to be released for the CONMEBOL tournament.
    João Pedro (Brighton)

    If the U23s qualify to the Olympics, then there's a fresh struggle to release players for that tournament. Also 3 over-age players can be added at that point.
     

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