I put him on the left wing. That makes him a backup to Pulisic. Aaronson is who he is. Which is why when everybody has been healthy, he hasn't started for the national team. Didn't start a game at the World Cup. But if you want a bundle of energy to work his socks off for the team when you're protecting a lead, or to put pressure on a tiring backline...............he can really be useful. At the CONCACAF level, he's been pretty impactful. Had that three game stretch of WCQers against Canada, Honduras, and Jamaica in which he had some crucial goals and assists. He was a major part of that turnaround in Honduras, without which we'd have been in some trouble. We'll just have to see what kind of tactics and formation a new USMNT coach uses. If he's a guy like Marsch, Aaronson will be a favorite. Maybe the Premier League was a step too far. I don't know. But I like that our guys have the ambition to go for it and try. [By the way, almost all of his goals and assists come against CONCACAF teams. 1 goal and 1 assist against non-CONCACAF teams. People criticize Jesus Ferreira and other players for this, but don't dig into the numbers for the Euro-based players. Just pointing it out. His goal was against Morocco in that lopsided 3-0 win, which is now such a weird-looking game. What does it mean? Like Ferreira, it depends how you want to spin it. Most of his caps have come against CONCACAF teams. On the other hand, against non-CONCACAF teams he's tended to disappear. Elite defenders have dealt with Aaronson in the Premier League and the elite international level.]
Aaronson is a guy who does a lot of things well, but his real standout trait is his motor and willingness to work. He's also pretty good in tight spaces and plays with some aggressiveness. But, he lacks the passing skills needed to be effective beyond pressing and dumping the ball off in the middle of the field. He's not a finisher and doesn't really find shots often which makes him limited up top, and he doesn't get wide and cross well so he can only play the wing if you don't need him to provide much width or traditional wing play. He's an odd package of skills that are hard to find a really good use for. I start to wonder if he's missed his calling a bit by not focusing more on the defensive side of the game. If he was more of a defensive presence in midfield that motor and work rate would be even more valuable and his lack of high level passing or finishing wouldn't be a detriment. He'd be pretty highly skilled in a relative sense as a defensive mid and his passing would become more of a relative strength. But, as it is, he's an offensive guy who mostly brings defensive tools to the attack, pressing and work rate. I think only very specific teams style-wise would be interested in that.
Agree, but I will say this for Brenden: he's great on the turn and in transition. He actually has some pretty good passing ability with a bit of space. But his size and play style aren't super great when the game gets static. He's not limited to Red Bull teams, but he fits them very well.
If I think in hockey terms Aaronson and Arriola are checking forwards. I'd love to see both at the same time when we are up in a game with one of our pressing 9's like Sargent, Pepi or Ferreira.
Sure, leaning into defend from the front with a lead isn't a bad move, but relying too much on guys picked for their ability to press and defend high up top over guys with more offensive ability is a recipe to not score goals. And in hockey the checking line gets rotated out regularly unlike soccer where they can't just be thrown in and pulled back out. Pressing is good, pressing is necessary and a part of many teams. More attackers should step up and work hard and include it in their game. But, pressing is just one thing and you need much more in attack than a guy who runs around a lot and pressures everywhere. That's a guy who can play a situational role, or a guy who can be a cog in the machine or who can fill a hole in the lineup. But personally, I want more from a player who is handed an attacking role than a guy who can hustle and press.
I think Reyna will be mainly in midfield as part of a four-man rotation in this cycle. This leaves Aaronson competing with LDLT as the fifth guy. Later in the cycle some of the younger or not-so-young guys (Pomykal, Ledezma, Booth) might be part of that picture. In terms of wide attacking players, Pulisic and Weah are the incumbents. Aaronson is competing with the likes of Tillman, Paredes and Cowell to be the main backups. The younger Aaronson is an option, as is Sullivan. Sargent and Booth can play there too. Even though Brendan is in the mix both in midfield and as a wide attacking player, he has his work cut out to get playing time. That's a good thing! He's a decent player but we are also getting deeper.
Well sure, anyone who gets a cup of coffee for the national team is more than that at some level. These guys are all good and it's about degrees. What we have to worry about is his effectiveness compared to his peers on the national team. There, he's got some tools, can fill a role and serve as a backup or a hard-working piece of the puzzle depending on the team's needs and how we play moving forward. But personally, I wouldn't want us having to rely on him for much of our offensive as he's not really shown that aptitude internationally or with clubs outside being more of an offensive contributor in Salzburg where he was playing a very specific style against overmatched opposition. Even in MLS he wasn't on the scoresheet all that much with 7 goals in 57 games. That's fine for a guy who works hard and does a job somewhere on the field, but it's not guy you want as a key part of your attack numbers. I actually think the comparison to Arrriola is a decent way to look at him. A guy who will work hard and help you, cover a ton of ground, defend from the front, be a tremendous pest and take what he's given in attack. Like an Arriola who is better in tight spaces and leans more centrally rather than running the wing. But I'm still waiting to see more than that from him. Maybe I'm missing it, but his numbers don't point to a guy who is offensively productive over time and his skill set doesn't scream out as a contributor to a more nuanced game outside of his pressing and his work rate.
To me Aaronson doesn’t have the touch to be in the middle. I like him as a reserve. Reyna should only be somewhere in the middle.
The way I see it is that sooner or later he’s going to be passed by unless he adds more of an attacking element to his game. Our pool is progressing to the point where most are going to be challenged, and that is a good thing. If Marsch takes over it could help him. If it’s anyone else, Brenden is probably going to have to add new elements to his game if he wants to remain viable throughout the cycle IMO. I think the rich man’s Ariolla comp has some merit.
I don't think it is a terrible comp; I just think maybe we differ on Arriola's value? If Brenden can add Arriola's strength, keep the work rate, and really develop his intelligence on runs to combine with his current skill plus a little refinement, I think that's actually a really, really good player. I think people way underestimate the space and chances that Arriola's movement and work rate created for us. It's not just of value defensively, the dude was constantly pulling people out of position to chase. He's not even that bad of a finisher -- he's just not good on the ball at all and he's not very good in helping when he comes back. Take Paul Arriola, add in Brenden's ability to play on the half turn, a notch better ruthlessness in the final third and some improvement on passing that may happen over the next four years and I absolutely think that's a fantastic player. I don't know if that's a starting EPL attacker for a team safe from relegation, but I don't know if Tim Weah is one either. Actually, I'm pretty sure he's not. I'm not worried about him improving. His work ethic has always been a strength. The big questions will be can he actually fill out at all, and does he get the coaching and opportunity to work on the right things.
I think he has an awful lot to offer that will get better with maturity and experience. Exactly where he fits in and if he gets passed by one of the up and comers (very possible imo) I'm not sure. I know it was then and this is now, but for perspective, Tim Ream hadn't even broken into MLS when he was 22 and he just finished an excellent season in EPL.
Brenden's a low touch player so he's going to struggle on an events based scoring scale when he doesn't get a goal or assist. He produced about the same xG and xA as Jack Harrison, Mason Mount or Pulisic and I don't see anyone calling them unfit for the PL. He was about 70ish in totals and per 90 for xG and xA. If he'd hit one less post or got credit for the own goal he forced, he's into the 60s. I don't know what people thought a 21 year old AM on a team that only survived relegation on the last day and then sold its 2 best players was going to do especially after Rodrigo got hurt and Jesse got fired.
I don't know where you see that. He's very tidy on the ball. I would knock his power and pace before his touch.
I think that's a fair point. What were people's expectations? For me, I expected him to be a starter and integral. He started out that way but then played poorly and was rightfully benched. I guess that misses my expectations, but maybe my expectations were too high. He is still very young and physically immature, I didn't really account for that in the best league in the world.
I don't know that he was ever really benched. He played 36/38 games and missed at least one to injury iirc. Finished with 2372 minutes. I just don't think he's a lead dog in the EPL at this point in his career but that's not a problem for the USMNT. A mediocre EPL starter is pretty tall timber in the world of soccer.
In some ways I totally disagree. The offensive things Aaronson does best are react quickly and combine that with good ball control. He has been trained to think and react very quickly in transition moments and if he is playing quickly on the turn he can create space. If he plays quickly in transition the gaps are there and the attack builds momentum. Asked to think or face up a defender wide he doesn’t have the equivalent level of 2nd and 3rd level vision, he doesn’t have the pure pace and power to get a step, he doesn’t have the pure ball striking to nail the service or long shot. Off the ball it’s still a work in progress but he obviously has the capacity to be an effective runner.
I think he gets caught in possession in the middle too often to rate his ball control as highly as you. He's not as 'head up' a player in the middle as he needs to be, imo. He's not looking for the next play instead he's looking at the ball for control and wasting time. He's not bad, per se, I don't think that, but at the Prem level it's not quick enough. He is good on the turn as others have said but is he better than other options who also have some other critical skills? I don't think so. I think his best action on the ball is when he can get the ball in space and dribble towards goal. I disagree he can't beat someone 1v1, he does that fine it not expertly. Beyond that, I love his potential as weak side runner, he has the lungs to get all kinds of chances just from crashing the box.
The Daily Fail weighs in USA star Brenden Aaronson was statistically the WORST player in the entire Premier League this season - amid reports he wants to leave Leeds in the wake of their relegation https://t.co/09RF4TtxQb— Mail Sport (@MailSport) May 30, 2023
I read this thread and I wonder why anyone cares? Aaronson is an average pro soccer player and that is all he will ever be. It does not take 12 pages of nonsense to come to that conclusion. Being "average" makes him an ideal choice for the US Men's national team, a collection of average soccer players coached by average coaches. I am quite sure he will gravitate to a team suitable for him just like Leeds or the USA men's national team.
When thinking about attributes you need to breakdown failures and successes into the component parts that lead to outcomes. BA is physically slight so when it comes to employing physicality to keep control or shrug off challenges he’s not going to excel. Being effective in the middle also requires being able to track more variables and being able to decided where to go, when to go, and how to get there. I think you essentially touched on that. To me he is quick, and his ability to control the ball executing at pace is very good. He just goes into a lot of high risk situations due to the RB style he has been trained in. But his failures are not disproportionally from not being able to get the ball to do what he wants, they’re from doing difficult things or the wrong thing or losing out physically. Compared to W/AMs Aaronson was 15th percentile in dribbling success rate (57th in attempts, 43rd in successes). He’s 36th percentile in times tackled when attempting a dribble and 32nd in times tackled percentage. Dribbling success (in how Opta defines it) is strongly correlated with pure pace. I think a lot of this driven by Red Bull philosophy (where and how the ball is lost is more important than wether). So he’s going into a lot more low % situations than the typical guy but I do not know how we can say he’s good beating guys 1v1 faced up. He’s good when the defense is scrambling. He’s good spotting moments to burst forward from midfield. He’s active. On the ball iso’d with a defender and space the average outcome for BA is going to be worse than Pulisic, Weah, Reyna, Dest, Balogun. I did not think BA’s start of the season was as good or predicted as much future success as others did. His underlyings weren’t horrible but a huge chunk came from nicking the ball off a goal keeper and walking it into the empty net. Does that mean he is horrible and will never be good, no. He just has to learn to apply his workrate and skills better.
He's an average EPL starter. That puts him in a group of maybe a couple thousand in a world with over 100k pros.
I'd bet a decent amount of money that Leeds's internal stats don't think he was the worst player in the league.
Statistically the worst..... Well, as Mark Twin once said, there are three types of lies. There's lies. There's damn lies. And then there is statistics.