The cost of education depends on who we are talking about. Alyssa Thompson will make more than $80k per year her first four years so she is making out well on top. Plus she will make that much money in one month at the World Cup if she makes the roster. Michelle Cooper will get her degree paid for by Duke with their degree completion program so she is making more money too by leaving college. Power five schools have degree completion programs for athletes who go pro before they graduate. Other schools may have this too. Trinity never wanted to go to college so it is not a lost cost for her and she is making great money instead of going to college. I don’t know what Shaw or the 15 year olds desires are but they will all make more money playing rather than by going to college on a full ride over their first four years in the league.
That's great to hear about Cooper. She is a great player and looks like she got the best of both worlds - getting an earlier start in the NWSL but still getting that opportunity to complete her degree. You never know what you may want to have as an asset in your future.
Finally find time to comment on scrimmage with Clemson a week ago. From my view Clemson looked pretty good and the Heels looked average with occasional spurts of good soccer. Tie score of 2-2. Clemson seemed to be very serious about this game, with a substitution pattern like it was a league game, and UNC was substituting every 10 to 15 minutes looking at different line-ups as far as I could tell. Not available to play for the Heels were Tessa Delarose, Maddie Dahlien, and Mia Olario and playing time was limited to what looked like about 15 minutes in each half for Sydney Cheesman and Allie Sentnor. Consequently, in my eyes, the best player for UNC was clearly Avery Patterson, and then a group who did well were Maycee Bell, Emily Moxley, and Emily Colton, Page Tolentino and both Emmie Allen and Nona Reason looked good in goal. Both Maci Teeter and Sydney Cheesman played well in the little I saw and Bella Sember got a lot of time at center forward but was stymied by the Clemson defense. Tori DellaPeruta, freshly back from playing in Italy, looked kinda jet lagged in terms of her decision making. I couldn't see much of the play across the field and with no roster in hand it was hard to be sure who was who. I certainly missed play maker Sam Mesa and hope that she will be healed soon. All in all, my view is that we have a long way to go to get ready for the fall season and there is no reason that we won't have a very good side . Next fall should be very entertaining.
Saw the U20 roster for the CONCACAF games coming up. UNC has 4 players involved which is pretty good, but Stanford takes the prize with 6 players on the roster. I believe that Duke, and Virginia have 2 each., and FSU has 1.
Thinking about the U20 CONCACAF tournament beginning in a couple of weeks. If this round for the U20s goes like the past few, the CONCACAF will likely yield the US, Canada, and Mexico as the three to go on to the U20 Women's World Cup in 2024. The rest of the CONCACAF countries have not yet developed women's soccer programs to the degree, although Panama and Puerto Rico are making good progress, and a couple of other CONCACAF U20 women's teams are starting to move forward. This distribution of CONCACAF U20 women's soccer is apparently the reason that three top eligible US players (playing in NWSL) are not on this roster. But they will very likely join the team for the U20 World Cup next year which means that at least a few on the present roster will be bumped off. I suspect that Olivia Moultrie and Jaedyn Shaw (both UNC commits until.....) will be on the roster and Alyssa Thompson Might also be on the U20 WC roster, although she may be playing for the US senior team instead (or both?) So, as has been the routine in recent U20 rosters, there may be as many as half a dozen players who are currently on the CONCACAF roster that will not be called up to the U20 WC team which would leave room tor the three pros mentioned above and 2 or 3 players from youth league play or college players who stood out this fall. So... of the 4 UNC players currently on the US U20 CONCACAF roster will any be bumped? I do think that Ally Sentnor will remain, but the other three ( and of course, along with most of the roster) will certainly be looked at closely to see if they will be on the U20 WC roster in 2024.
Casey Stoney said she did not release Shaw for the U20 Concacaf. I assume the same for Moultrie. Thompson's situation is more complicated (with potential WC spot) so I am not sure about her even being asked to go. From US Soccer press release: There are three players in the U-20 WYNT pool currently playing in the National Women’s Soccer League who are age-eligible for this roster – Olivia Moultrie of Portland Thorns FC, Alyssa Thompson of Angel City FC and Jaedyn Shaw of San Diego Wave FC – but all were unavailable for this event. All three played in the 2022 FIFA U-20 Women’s World Cup in Costa Rica and all three have scored in the NWSL this season.
OK. So what is happening here? The above paragraph from the US Soccer announcement points out that all three pros are eligible for the U20 in 2023 and 2024 and It also states that all three played in last years U120 World Cup and adds that all three have scored in the NWSL. That sure as heck sounds like a public promotion that they should be playing for their country in 2024, NO?
Interesting that they omit how poorly the USA played WITH all three. Failed to get out of the group. Maybe the team can do better without them?
Mou According to any objective evaluator of the talent and players available…no one suggests that those players are the problem. Are you going on the record as saying those 3 shouldn’t be on the 21 player roster? They are not good enough? You’d be the only one. I know you pride yourself on being a contrarian, but….I’d recommend you direct your energies in the correct direction. Coaching, lack of cohesive philosophy, style of play, lack of training time with the entire team / group together…..these are the issues that have led to multiple teams not advancing out of the youth WC stages. That problem is not unique to this age group….but you know that already. The players selected have excelled in every level they’ve played in….they are not the problem. I’d guess this cycle will be no different…maybe worse results. Hope not.
I am going on the record saying TEAMS are more than a collection of the best individuals. Spin it any way you want. As far as the excuses/reasons you list. All valid, but no different to every other team in those tournaments. In fact, the US youth teams get more time and resources devoted to developing those things than any other. Every level except youth WCs? Why is there no cohesive philosophy or style of play? What is the problem? One thing that does hurt us is re-entry rules. Most of our players have very little experience in managing different game states.
Or maybe understand that the US philosophy was to play all players at the event. That is why those three did not play all the time, and the lineups changed a lot. They used it as a platform to develop players.
The US teams get more money invested for sure….in logistics. They certainly don’t get more training time together as a unit than the teams they typically lose to at the youth level. Japan, Netherlands, and Spain for example play together probably 10x compared to the US teams at the youth level. I’m sure you know this right? Those players play as teams and have a familiarity and cohesion that the US does not. The US at the youth level is basically an All Star team and that is just not good enough anymore.
To be clear…those countries certainly benefit from having a much smaller footprint. Their youth players are consolidated into a couple top clubs and they train / play / learn / develop together….for years. Japan and Spain certainly have excellent and focused development and coaching. Sure…the US can throw more money to our teams to fly players across the country and video all the trainings and buy cool kits….but that’s certainly no substitute for having your top level players almost always training and competing against each other…..almost year round….for years. Sports is funny like that…money can’t erase hard work and long term development.
Generally, the US youth system rewards individual play disproportionately. I see that reflected in how we play. Collective actions like off the ball movement, accurate passing, unselfish running are not rewarded enough. Early days, but this draft class beats watching.
I agree on all your points. But….this is more about coaching and development IMO. A lot of these players are obviously athletic, but some are also technically proficient enough to play another way….if it was demanded of them. But, it typically is not demanded of them by their coaches at any level, not even at the national team level. So…they never LEARN to play another other way. It’s not that they are incapable of it or refuse to do it.
the reason it is not demanded of them is because our system values wins - irrespective of their REAL value. In all the years my kids spent in soccer, I noticed the objective from a young age on up is to graduate to a team that has a bigger and bigger advantage over its opponents, no matter the developmental implications. Given how early success can drive interest, the athletic kids got ahead early and that made athleticism the most desired trait. Its easy to see. Add in the sub rules, incentives to win early etc and you get a transitional, hyper pressing type of game that favors a certain type of player (we glorify and produce those in abundance - so much so that it becomes more political as to who gets chosen). It places an even higher bar for technique from a younger age because you will be pressed all game by waves of athletes. It places a higher bar on a certain athleticism as well as you will be pressed AND face deeper lines to get in behind. Now the game becomes about picking the best athletes who are technically competent. By the time you get to u-16 ish, I dont beleive many of those players are capable of learning to play another way. they are recruited and utilized based on existing strengths. In general, the USA has no technical foundation on which female players are built and winning National Championships and World Cups without one makes some people beleive it is not necessary/essential to future success. They may well be right given that as we transition from U-17 to U-20 to Senior World Cups, the USA get more successful. I guess the benefits you ascribe to that small footprint erode though time for some other reason. Eventually volume of athletes trumps quality. PS The "better" my kids got at soccer, the easier it became for them to win games. The greater margin for error. They experienced at times, the biggest advantages playing for USYNTs or select teams. Were there games that were challenging? of course, but were they favored in probably 80 pct by the end. Yes. We take stats from ALL games and assess players. We dont dive particularly deep and I am talking all the way thru College. Some of the comments made by analysts on draft day and/or commentators in NWSL play about rookies make it pretty clear that scouting is not high on the list of expenses yet. Our prototypical "star" player is an athletic forward who scores her goals from the left or right channel. She will thrive in space, and the volume of chances she gets at this level vs most opponents will make her efficiency vs the best with limited opportunities a non issue - until it is. its at that point we start wondering why we have no plan B. Because most of the top Colleges/Clubs didn't either. Add in that the NIL/Endorsment $$ now tend to go to that player as well. We reap what we sow.
Very well said and I wholeheartedly agree. Many great points. I think the high press / direct play / create chaos for easy chances style of play is so prevalent because it’s easy to coach. It’s unsophisticated and doesn’t require a whole lot of time to develop the game play movement concepts. And many teams don’t have the requisite technical abilities to play through a press. I think it’s a well know fault in the US that we don’t have enough well trained, top level coaches at any age level. So all this feeds into the negative feedback loop that reinforces that style of play. And yes…I do think that up until now, the smaller countries that have teams that play and train together a lot more consistently and have won at the u17 and u20 World Cup level are overwhelmed by the depth of the USWNT athletes at the senior level. I do believe that time is coming to end though. Anyone that has watched the USWNT play Japan or Spain recently can see that those teams technical skill and tactical awareness is superior. They play modern, beautiful football. All they lack is a true finisher. I think the end product is coming for those teams and soon. Interestingly, though, this discussion (which I think has been a great one, thanks) started by suggesting that the US team might play better without its eligible NWSL players. I don’t think Moultrie or Shaw have a player profile anything like what you described as our typical US Star. Both are decent athletes, but neither are exceptional in that regard. They are more technical players that can play one or 2 touch soccer (although I’ve always thought Moultrie had a tendency to hold the ball too much, she has looked much better in this regard for the Thorns) and both have an eye for the creative pass. Shaw is a pretty versatile player as far as different positions are concerned. Alyssa obviously fits your profile to a T, but her pace is just such an incredible tool…she’s dynamic. Just my 2 cents. I think the u20 team would be better with them on the roster….and that’s not meant as a slight to anyone that is on the current roster. Good luck to them all.
@Siddhartha Agreed on those players not fitting the typical template. I have a theory on that too! We become enamored with players who show something "different" and enjoy success. It shows us that the game can be played differently. The challenge then becomes how do you integrate that into a successful team when the majority of players don't see the game thru the same lens as the outlier? An example. They are both pros, so I have no issue giving names. Sophie Jones is a great example. As a youth player she was as highly decorated as you can get. She plays the game in a very cerebral manner, favoring possession and recycling the ball. Early year at Duke she was highly decorated (in spite of limited stats) and it was clear that the team ran thru her. She made them better. As soon as Michelle Cooper arrived, the style, tempo changed and Jones became less impactful. I dont think results got any better, but Cooper won a ton of awards, endorsements, a higher draft pick etc. I think its harder to find Jones's who last and thru this system. Moultrie is more of a Jones. Will you see the best of Moultrie on a team built for Sophia Smith? I doubt it. Good enough to have moments, sure.From a development standpoint, Shaw would be better playing games elsewhere and coming off the bench at times in the NWSL. I think she needs to work on her play in the middle and defensive third as opposed to becoming a pure CAM/2nd striker. Its too early for me to say whether Thompson is dynamic at this level. Our value system forces a lot of players with winger skills off the touchlines so they can be closer to goal to score. her speed is less on an asset there and her size/strength becomes more important. Can she make wow plays? sure, but i would like to see her played wider more often where crossing and pass shoot decisions become critical. Does Thompson project to be any more dynamic on the field than Smith, Rodman, Pugh et al do/did at a similar age? Idk. Macario is the latest example of a player who fits seamlessly into a Lyon, but in the USA less so. Stanford won, but Madison Haley adjusted her game to make that work better. Smith/Macario was not as fluid as it could have been, but you only saw that vs the better teams and that was rare. Great discussion, but im sure the UNC fans are over it. Happy to continue in a new thread or via DM. Thanks
Qualifiers for the U20's today has Ally Sentnor with a brace, both from the spot. Subbed off before a third PK and a chance for the hat trick. I suspect Sentnor will be UNC's choice from the spot moving forward, if there was any doubt who would fill the big shoes of Hansen.
Players, parents, recruits, alumnae and donors, Another excellent academic semester for the Women’s Soccer Tar Heels. Also four starters from last fall that were felled by injury in various ways and at different times are grinding their way back to full health. So we should all be excited to see the return of Maycee Bell, Talia Dellaperuta, Kaleigh Herr and Sam Meza this preseason. And again to give full credit to Damon Nahas, Nathan Thackery, Heather O’Reilly and Alex Kimball who helped us navigate an extraordinary run to an ACC Regular Season Championship and within 16 seconds of a National Championship DESPITE losing those wonderful players (in one case for the entire season) … this was a REAL achievement. With COVID behind us AND with the Carolina Courage giving me a FIELD PASS, I have thoroughly enjoyed certainly seeing former Tar Heels Emily Fox and Brianna Pinto at Wake Med Park with the Carolina Courage but also recently chatting with reigning World Champion and former Tar Heel Allie Long (Gotham); and other former Tar Heels that have come through with Angel City (Paige Nielsen) and the Washington Spirit (Amber Brooks) … and look below at Crystal Dunn tied for the league lead in goals. Also it is so exciting to see Kealia Ohai and her husband JJ Watt jumping into Burnley. And speaking of English Teams and a Chapel Hill connection: WE ARE HOSTING CHELSEA AND WREXHAM in Kenan Football Stadium Wednesday July 19th. We sold out our 50,500 seat stadium in three days. And tonight at 7 pm EST on FS1 the US U-20’s with four Tar Heels (Sentnor, Dahlein, Dellarose and King) will play Panama for the right to represent CONCACAF in the U-20 World Cup. We could not be prouder. Speaking of being proud: Frannie Reuland, a former Tar Heel who graduated with a PERFECT 4.0 GPA, is the second Tar Heel Women’s Soccer Player along with Kelly McFarlane to win the extraordinary Knight Hennessy Scholarship to attend graduate school at Stanford. As an athletic department we are not sitting still: Women’s Tennis just won the National Championship and below is Carolina Athletics Updated Strategic Plan. And finally, a Creative Q&A with Teresa Amabile. All of us in Paradise hope you have a wonderful summer!! Anson Crystal Dunn continues to score https://www.instagram.com/reel/CshUm13AJxR/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== Jess McDonald Hype Speech I hope no one shows my grandmother lol https://t.co/SA03cgN4yU— Jessica McDonald (@J_Mac1422) May 4, 2023 Surprises can teach us A LOT https://www.fool.com/retirement/2023/05/06/surprises-can-teach-us-a-lot/ England’s Injuries https://www.socceramerica.com/publi...ns-world-cup-englands-injury-toll-mounts.html JJ Watt & Burnley https://theathletic.com/4495752/2023/05/08/jj-watt-burnley-guide/ Chloe Ricketts Chloe Ricketts with her first start tonight ✅ pic.twitter.com/6INva8YRdn— Washington Spirit (@WashSpirit) May 11, 2023 U-20 Roster- (Tessa Dellarose, Ally Sentnor, Maddie Dahlieen, Savy King) https://she www.socceramerica.com/publications/article/96074/roster-usa-names-team-for-concacaf-womens-u-20-c.html https://knight-hennessy.stanford.edu/people/fran-reuland Alexandra Kimball (AK) UNC Women’s Soccer Director of Team Development akimballsoccer@gmail.com & alexk@live.unc.edu 919-370-2465