Ref shortages this year

Discussion in 'Referee' started by Beau Dure, May 22, 2021.

  1. voiceoflg

    voiceoflg Member+

    Dec 8, 2005
    Thanks for the education. I may need to do this today. MS girls/MS boys/Varsity boys tripleheader this afternoon. My dual partner is a college student who said he gets out of class at 3:50. Kickoff is 4:30. Waze says it will take him 38 minutes to get to the high school. I could start the MS girls game solo, but I want something left in the tank after the 3rd game.
     
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  2. voiceoflg

    voiceoflg Member+

    Dec 8, 2005
    He showed up five minutes before kick. I feel a little sorry for him after last night. He's less than half my age and around half my weight. I offered to take the spectators' side the first game, home team's end, facing the sun. "I have my tinted glasses and hat. You can have your back to the sun." He was very appreciative. We didn't switch sides at half. But we did switch positions between games. So I am in front of the visiting team for game two. Then we switched back for game three, the varsity boys game. Home team leads 9-0 at halftime. All the action was on his end. He ran his butt off. I knew it was going to be lopsided and the home team liked to kick through balls and chase them down. He handled it better than I could, but I wasn't going to let him know that was the real reason I asked to be where I was the 1st and 3rd games.

    Oh, five minutes into the second half came goal #10, mercy rule.
     
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  3. frankieboylampard

    Mar 7, 2016
    USA
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Spain
    play to your strengths. That’s what I use to tell players when I coached.
     
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  4. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    From each according to his abilities, to each according to his knees.
     
  5. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Or ankles, for those of us who have screwed up ankles going back 30+ years . . . :)
     
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  6. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    Instead of a high ankle sprain I have "Hi, ankle sprain!"
     
  7. USSF REF

    USSF REF Guest

    :laugh:I wish there was a joke like this but for Shin Splints!
     
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  8. ptref

    ptref Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Aug 5, 2015
    Bowling Green, KY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was talking to a local club coach the other day. One of his teams, boys U17, is in National League PRO this season. They had a league game recently at a neutral site (KY team vs OH team, played in IN). He told me that they only had one referee for the game. They had to use club ARs. I couldn’t believe what he was telling me. How do you only have one referee for a game in one the highest youth competitions in the country? Makes me wonder who was responsible for assigning the game and why they couldn’t get a full crew.
     
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  9. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    I'm surprised that a ref on a good level game would even bother with club ARs and not just go completely solo.

    It could be due to a lack of competent referees, assignor laziness, or maybe even if the competition would be trying to put a lot of requirements on the refs (travel distance, time spent, etc.) without fair reimbursement so refs don't even want to participate. I've had to do MLS Next games in a solo or dual setup as well, and their lack of amenities and poor ref treatment makes me not want to do much with them.

    Also, I have seen it but have never quite understood what this whole "USYS" stuff is and how they go into regionals and national championships. So these teams are random club teams across the entire country but are equivalent in skill to NPL, ECNL, GA, EA, MLS NEXT teams and they determine who the best team in the country is?
     
  10. sam_gordon

    sam_gordon Member+

    Feb 27, 2017
    I don't understand the confusion. As I understand it, each USYS state has an "Open" end of season "State" tournament and an end of season "President's Cup" tournament. Any team can register for either (not both) tournaments. I believe there's a rule that 50%+ of your roster needs to reside in the state you're registering in.

    The winner of each State level tournament gets an automatic bid to regionals. At least for MRL, I believe the top two teams in that league that don't qualify via the state tournament also get bids to the "Open" regionals.

    The winners of the regional competitions go on to Nationals.
     
  11. GoDawgsGo

    GoDawgsGo Member+

    Nov 11, 2010
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And they've been doing that since before any of those other leagues existed. Not sure about the confusion either.



    On the bright side I'm starting my own nationwide elite platinum superstar allstar league next year. All the DI coaches will be at all the showcases. Tell all your clubs to get ready and open their checkbooks.
     
  12. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    :ROFLMAO:

    Reminds me of club basketball! My son was a solid rotation HS varsity player, nothing more. And he played at clubs consistent with that. I'd laugh at the "coaches section" on the courts they were on--never once saw a coach sitting there. And yet I would hear parents at those games talking about how important it was their kid get a scholarship.
     
  13. GoDawgsGo

    GoDawgsGo Member+

    Nov 11, 2010
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I referee a lot of college games. I talk with coaches a lot about their perspective. Having a million leagues and showcases is making their recruiting more difficult. Even DIs have budgets for travel and recruiting. Too many showcases and can't be everywhere. To be fair that was a huge knock against USYS and their format. Regionals and Nationals was so small it didn't help coaches see lots of players, just a few. USYS didn't change with the times and now it's an alphabet soup and a money grab. Other sports aren't any different though. It's all become about tournaments and showcases. $$$ for organizers and hotels and cities. Everyone can be elite or platinum in this model.

    Let's try to count: how many youth national champions will there be this year in any given age group? 5? 10? Used to be one - USYS. Every state is a bit different in their clubs abandoning USYS but USYS in my state is literally rec level garbage at State Cup with barely any teams even entering. Used to be a top state that always had teams in finals at Regionals and going to Nationals.

    USSF is letting US Club and USL (OMs) sanction anything to someone with a check that clears.
     
  14. Advantage

    Advantage Member

    Apr 25, 2022
    The USYS model is straightforward (State Cup qualifies to Regionals qualifies to Nationals)

    Where it gets a bit more confusing is with teams earning auto-qualification through National League and National League PRO. My understanding (which may be wrong) is NL regular season winners can auto-qualify to regionals while NL PRO regular season winners can auto-qualify for Nationals. Teams who made it to Nationals then qualify for PRO the next year?
     
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  15. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    #840 Pittsburgh Ref, Mar 22, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2023
    Apologies if this came through from other answers but I think it might not have~

    USSF national association members include US Youth Soccer and US Club (and AYSO and US Adult Soccer and some others). The 55 State Associations are also USSF members, and since once upon a time USYS was very nearly the body for youth soccer (except AYSO in some places), much administrative authority falls from USSF onto youth players via the State Associations--e.g. referee programs and a lot of the sanctioning that goes on for community and rec clubs. As mentioned, the various State Cup and President's Cup competitions feed USYS regionals and nationals.

    US Club was created several years ago as a way for clubs to get around what seemed like onerous requirements on clubs. Things like rostering and interstate tournament travel are...more relaxed in US Club than in USYS, sort of a more "move fast and break things" approach. US Club in turn sanctions several alphabet soup leagues including NPL, ECNL, who oversee leagues and tournaments that feed the US Club Soccer championships. In response to US Club USYSA has touted things like being "the oldest national championship."

    USSSA (US Specialty Sports Association) is an "Other Affiliate" of USSF, a lower rung than USYS and US Club (and AYSO and US Adult Soccer). USSSA sanctions GA and EA, and under them are leagues and showcases and their own championship structure.

    MLS (a Professional League member of USSF, like USL) sponsors and sanctions MLS Next. Yadda yadda feeds championships yadda yadda.

    Hope this helps. God I am a nerd.

    e2a: tying this back to ref shortage~ since USYS (through the State Associations) administratively owns referee recruitment (!) and training/certification, effectively all these other governing bodies represent increased demand for a static (in a good year) supply of refs. So if I'm looking to cover community travel club games, but ABC Soccer Haircut League has some teams in town that weekend, guess where the coverage tends to go.
     
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  16. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    Ah, technically correct until the last paragraph. USSF policies call for the appointment of a State Referee Administrator, by joint agreement of the state youth association president and the state adult association president. The SRA and State Referee Committee (which includes the youth and adults) administer the USSF Referee Program in that state. There really is no one specifically 'tasked' with recruiting referees. The youth and adults expect that will be done by the SRC but the ardor to do so will vary. No USSF policy or procedure says that the SRA/SRC are responsible for there being 'enough' referees. In the real world, sometimes local assignors will try to recruit teenagers to become referees.

    Not an assignor myself (other than the eight high school games a year that I assign), but I have worked with a lot of assignors, particularly when I was SRA. It is my opinion that there will never be 'enough' referees to cover all USSF affiliated games. Why so pessimistic? I think I'm just economically realistic. Games tend to be lumpy. The vast majority of games are on the weekend. Sometimes, there are times of the year (variable depending on climate) where there are a lot of games being played. Youth tournaments clogging the calendar, in addition to adult games and some or all of the alphabet leagues playing their championships, etc. And sometimes there aren't many games. Those busy days need a large number of referees to cover their games. But, in economic terms, the marginal referee (not in terms of skill but as the next person to sign up) will only have games to do two or three weekends a year. How much will they make that weekend, versus the cost of the entry level class, registration, uniform, transportation, etc.? Not enough income, after expenses, to justify doing it. So some of those busy times games end up with solo referees or games with one AR. The leagues/tournaments could lure people to referee on just those busiest times of the year by paying more money. But that would require that they pay everyone more and paying, say, $5.00 more a game for all games, versus having some games with one or two referees doesn't seem like a very good trade off to the leagues/tournaments. And some leagues/tournaments will only pay for one referee to start with. I mean, do you really need three USSF referees for a U8 game?
     
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  17. mathguy ref

    mathguy ref Member+

    Nov 15, 2016
    TX
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I must say that our SRA/SRC seem to place to burden of finding enough referees and by extension making referees almost solely at the feet of the assignors. And by burden I also mean blame.
     
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  18. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    To be fair I think it's the one word "recruitment" in that last paragraph. Which i kind of hinted at/against.
     
  19. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    My main thrust is that any contribution to the ref cadre comes though the USYS/SA pipeline. Assignors especially. The fancy leagues don't do anything but consume.
     
  20. GoDawgsGo

    GoDawgsGo Member+

    Nov 11, 2010
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And most assignors begrudgingly do it to satisfy their own needs, when the clubs they work for should be the heavy lifting for them.
     
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  21. mathguy ref

    mathguy ref Member+

    Nov 15, 2016
    TX
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Yep. The clubs consume the refs. If they want them they should be the ones who find them to be trained and pay them well enough to retain them. Not to mention not yell at them to retain them. Of course thats not what 99% of them do.
     
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  22. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    If it's not the SRA's job to recruit, then whose job is it?

    Assignors nationwide have clearly failed in this aspect as well as very few feel it's their job to develop relationships as they did in the early days when I first started doing this.
     
  23. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    This may be similar to experiences among assignors near you~

    I'm on the board of my community club, and at one point or another I've done nearly all the jobs. I'm connected with lots of people in our club either because of themselves, their parents, or their kids. I recruit people retail-style in our club (coaches, older kids, parents), with help from the club in social media blasts, Web posts, etc. These people see me and my urchins doing their (kids') games, and between familiarity and repetition I manage to snag some. Some of those stick around, and some of those get to where they want to add the competitive-club games to their weekends. Heck I do too.

    Thing is, none of those money clubs are pumping their members to become referees, they are reliant on the informal but inexorable metmorphosis of community refs into refs errant. Sure some of the competitive coaches ref, but it came from their time in community clubs. There's no flow the other way, and generally if there's anything said about refs it's in the way of commiseration about how we spoil the game, etc. We are Other, and why (if ever they were encouraged), would people want to be subject to what they heap on us?

    *****

    Organizational priorities trickle down. When my older son started AYSO in LA, back in 2004, the recruitment spiel included a clear statement that new referees are necessary because we can't play without them. The volunteer model there is obviously a big difference, and removes some of the consumerism with which paid refs are treated, but how simple and effective that statement is. It got me!

    Travel season starts 4/2, and I'm sallying into battle with like 18 refs and 25 teams. Hopefully I get some in-progress recerts to become finished recerts, and as always I'll be on the hotline with other assignors. I'll do what I can with what I have and the fewer under- or un-covered games I have, the better. When things work out and I get slots covered with appropriate (or appropriately stretched) refs, it's a win and I'll take it.
     
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  24. Rufusabc

    Rufusabc Member+

    May 27, 2004
    When I started 18 years ago, the local club was in the top league in the area. (It would now be considered about 5th tier). But, at the time, the league called for every club to supply 3 referees to the pool. That’s how I joined as one of the 3. We eventually had around 10 or so just from our club. I moved away, and NONE of the various leagues I referee for now have that requirement.
     
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  25. Gary V

    Gary V Member+

    Feb 4, 2003
    SE Mich.
    When my sons started playing (nearly 3 decades ago now!) I didn't give a thought to where the refs came from. They were simply there at the field, like the grass, flags and nets.

    My sons' coach was also a ref, and we talked several times along the sidelines as I served as a kind of unofficial asst coach. It was only then that I found out what being a ref meant.

    Forward a few years to U13, my sons wanted to certify. They thought that the $8 or so they would get for a U12 rec line was big bucks. And it probably was for them - minimum wage was only about $5. Cash on the field was more than you could get for flipping burgers. Since I had to take them to the cert class, I decided to sign up too.

    At the time the boys' club would refund the fee for the cert class if you did 5 games - I think I remember the number correctly, or maybe it was 10 games. Anyway, we signed up for the minimum. Yes, signed up - went to a school gym where the schedule was printed out on sheets on tables and you put your name in on games you could do. I found that I liked it, and went on for 16 years. My boys kept it up through high school, but it didn't work with their college schedules. Later my younger daughter also certified, but she had so much else going on in her life that she couldn't get enough games to get good, and she quit after about 2 years (and got even more busy after that, so I guess that was a good thing for her).

    Giving incentives for people to become referees is the only way there will be more of them. And giving support for referees is the only way we will retain them.
     
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