Agreed on most of your points but i will add that his quality of finishing was so absurdly great in those lesser leagues that had he of scored them all in Europe's top 5 leagues He would've unanimously been perceived as a top 10 all timer IMO He didn't so i have him in my top 20 all time players ever
As @Bruford wrote, I implied no. of goals OR scoring rate. As far as I remember, only Hugo Sanchez before Romario and R9 after him scored at a similar rate. Romario did not take pens iirc. You are right that Barca had far more resources in relative terms than most clubs back then, and that he played for the Barca Dream Team; however, only 3 of those players you listed could play at a time, and the rest of the players had to be Spaniards. This situation is completely different from nowadays (which is what I am comparing with). Teams nowadays can leverage the full potential of their superior resources (and therefore, only a handful of teams win). Back then, the concept of top 5 leagues wasn't really there. You can use Elo ratings to rank leagues. However, back then, it was Serie A that was the place to be. Later it became La Liga. However, teams from other leagues could challenge for European titles. Because of the restrictions, it would've been tougher for stars to win titles than it would be now. Romario did lose interest after the World Cup, stating that he longs to go back to Brazil (he did not go back to merely statpad; later in life, when he was close to a 1000 goals, he travelled to different corners of the world specifically to inflate his scoring). Also, he did not play for Brazil again until 1997. He achieved his goal of winning the World Cup. Continuing to play in Europe wasn't his goal (not everyone has the same goals in life). The difference between the millions he was getting in Brazil and at Barcelona wasn't much (unlike the case nowadays). The comparison with R9 is also not accurate because R9 left Brazil at a much younger age and did not have the same connection with Brazilian fans. Also, the exodus of players from the Brazilian league started after Romario won the World Cup (because of change in rules), which resulted in a weakening of the league. When Romario went back, the league wasn't as weak (if you remember, Brazilian teams completely dismantled treble winning Man U, including by Romario and Edmundo. Such dismantling is not possible nowadays as the gap between the leagues have widened considerably). I acknowledge that Romario was not invested enough unlike some other greats, and he was difficult to manage. That hurt his legacy. He was cut down due to "injury" in 1998; however, there were underlying tensions and like with Benzema this year, Romario could have easily played in the knockout stage of the World Cup. He was also ignored in 2002 (as you said) despite the Brazilian press demanding his inclusion (likely because of his character). Interestingly, if you look at a few Brazilian generations where two players dominated, Pele-Garrincha, Romario-Bebeto, or Ronaldinho-Kaka, one was a model professional (Pele, Bebeto, Kaka) and the other was not (Garrincha, Romario, Ronaldinho).
1- Hugo Sanchez in 89/90 scored 38 goals in a higher rate than Romário. https://noticias.uol.com.br/ultimas...revoltado-romario-sai-atirando-apos-corte.htm Romário cried at the press conference after the cut in 1998. He was there in Europe to play. It doesn't seem to me that he "didn't want to play anymore after winning the 94 worldcup". The article also explains that the injury was caused by a futvolei match.
The article itself corroborate what I was trying to say. He wanted a break for the NT during 95/96, but of course his goal back then was to play WC98 (and also Olympic games´96). However, his request for a break in 95 made his already bad relation with Zagallo got even worse. As a result, Zagallo and Zico did not give him the privilege of going to the cup and waiting for his recovery to play the KOs. He begged for it...a privilege some great players (Zico himself in 86, Zidane in 2002, Romario himself in 1990 etc) had to be included in the WC squad even unfit.
You said "He wasn't interested in playing for the national team during the years after the WC" but the article said that he wanted have a break on NT. But in 98 he said "With my will to play in the Cup, I would overcome anything". The way you put it makes it seem like he never wanted to play for the national team again after winning in 94
What I said: '2- He wasn't interested in playing for the national team during the years after the WC. He said recently he was going through a tough divorce in the period and wasn't mentally fit to play for the national team. I remember an interview when he said he could make a exception for the Olympics games in 96, since Brazil never had won the gold medal in football there and the defeat in Seoul´88 final was his biggest loss in football, according to himself (he scored the first goal in the game, but URSS made a comeback (1-2). https://www1.folha.uol.com.br/fsp/1995/6/09/esporte/11.html In 1997 he was interested in play for the NT again and Ronaldo and him made a great duo. Unfortunately, he got an injury in Carioca state match in 1998 (not in a futvolley game) and missed the WC98.'
Honestly, when it comes to pure strikers, I have a soft spot for players that score lots of unspectacular goals (players that people label as more of “poachers”), rather than ones that score the most spectacular looking goals. In essence, while it may initially seem counterintuitive, I think the unspectacular goalscorers tend to have their scoring be more reliable against stronger teams. This is because I think the spectacular stuff tends to get snuffed out pretty reliably by the best defenders, whereas even the best defenders can’t totally stop someone who just is somehow always at the right place at the right time. For example, Zlatan Ibrahimovic is a great player who is a scorer of many spectacular goals. And he could win league titles over and over. But he found it difficult to do well in the Champions League. Meanwhile, Gerd Muller was not a scorer of many spectacular goals, but his goalscoring scaled really well both in the European Cup and in NT competition. With all that said, I think my choice for best striker in their prime is Gerd Muller. In his prime, he was scoring ridiculously, winning everything there is to win (for teams that really did not play well without him), consistently scored in big games, and actually was an underrated creator (averaging almost 0.4 assists per 90 mins in a five-year span, according to Trachta’s data). I just think it’s so hard to stop a player like him who is always at the right place at the right time, and can quickly turn any random touch in the box into a goal. I have a lot more info on Muller here: https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/gerd-müller-is-a-top-20-player.2028206/
Correct, PSV won 1988 europe cup/champions league the year before Romario was signed. Eredivisie was top 5 strongest league in the world at that time.
Lets not forget he scored against the best defenders of his era. Baresi/Maldini. but of course he wasn't without flaws. football was different. or say, football changed LOL.
Benfica, Napoli, even rumours of R.Madrid lobbying to sign him. He went to PSV in the end. some great players need decades to leave a mark, Romario needed only 2 season to leave his.
Zagallo and Zico took over, and there was a lot of friction between them and Romario. In part because Romario was still a prima donna with inflated grandiosity of himself. I cannot blame Zagallo nor Zico for having dropped him all those years (and Scolari thereafter). I didn't like it, but I think it was proper for the sake of sportsmanship and to preserve morale in the rest of the squad. The guy was a pain to manage and a bit arrogant towards his teammates. But also, the new managers wanted to try out new blood of younger players with prime R9 as the main striker. History needs to be incl in our revision. This is a factor most contemporary media omit today. I remember Lula first run as president and how the currency REAL was fixed to the USD$, it made it attractive for Romario (and other Bazilian players) to move back to his homeland. Flamengo paid a lot of money to release him, and Cruyff and the rest of Barca were tired of Romario (and Laudrup). So seems like a win-win deal for both parties. Dream Team was already over the hill and the experienced players were leaving anyways. Hagi's signing made Romario less important as well. Even later, in 2000, Vasco destroyed Fergusson's/Gibbs Manchester United, remember? And who scored and assisted the winning goals? Yes, you are right, the little man! I must insist, I have argued with many here since 2013 on the Romario vs R9 thread. Romario's reputation had suffered from bad luck (and his inflated ego) for being one of those players whose peak came right at the time when football was transforming from the "modern" to the "post-modern" era, with the internet and social media taking over. The way social media now dictated the audience's perception of the game. R9 (a player I regard in the same tier as Romario) came at the perfect time when the internet and the US audience came of age. We should not omit marketing when revising old players from past eras. Before WC94, it was a different sport. Post-WC94, we have social media and a US market taking over. A post-prime and aged Romario being a prima donna, big-mouthed, inflated ego, and a bad boy (like Cantona, Maradona, etc.), was not marketable as a young R9 (young and humble guy sponsors and journalists would endorse!). People were tired of the likes of Maradona, Romario and Cantona. These guys were troublemakers and, thus, not good for business in the long run. Sponsors and clubs/national teams wanted nice guys you could rely on investing all those bucks, not prima donnas who would walk out on you last minute! I believe this, and the fact that he left Europe for a Brazilian league that didn't get much media attention, is why the younger audience rates him so low today. But his team and personal achievements speak for themself nonetheless. He was the top scorer in all the leagues he ever played and, for a long time (until Messi WC22), the last player since Maradona to win the golden ball while also winning the WC. The saddest thing I experienced as a young fan following Romario (and R9) was seeing the potential of Romario-R9 duo in WC98 and WC02. Copa America 1997 and confed cup was a glance, a hint, a foreshadowing of what might have been Romario/R9 duo that never was, as the main strikers in those world cups. coulda shoulda woulda, but I am sure if an experienced Romario was on that team in the field, it might have taken some weight off R9 shoulder and prevented his nervous breakdown in the final of WC98. I can only imagine what respectable it might have been to see a duo like that. just think about this! @carlito @leadleader @orzora
⬆️ *but in twice as many games as Gabriel Batistuta pic.twitter.com/tk9A0ead9N— Opta Analyst (@OptaAnalyst) December 9, 2022
Sturridge arguably had all the tools to be one of the best strikers of his generation If it wasn't for injuries that is I thought he was better than Harry Kane around 2014 but that was when I also thought James Rodriguez was going to be the undisputed best player of his generation above the likes of hazard,Neymar,Pogba etc It's easy to forget that he is on paper a two time champions league winner(once for Chelsea and once for Liverpool) which is something extraordinary for a player with his career I'll have to look into it but i dont think any other player has won the champions league with two different English clubs Something for him to brag about I guess lol
It’s not easy making a case for someone who played the majority of his career in second rate leagues but then I shouldn’t even have to as his own contemporaries held him in the highest esteem Be it Ronaldinho,Thierry Henry,Cristiano Ronaldo Even SAF held him in the highest regard He was one of the very few strikers in the 2000s decade to score 50+ goals in a single season (the other being Jardel I think) Pick of the bunch was probably this legendary goal vs rangers (when they were nowhere near as shit as they are now)
@PDG1978 Will zlatan Ibrahimovic get a winners medal if Milan manage to go all the way? Van basten had a winners medal I think for the 1993/94 CL despite not playing either Ibrahimovic winning his first CL at 41 years old will be quite something
It seems like the up-to-date rule is the winning club receives 40 medals to give out to who they want? I guess he could get one then in that case? Maybe the 'Giussepe Meazza stadium' derby is still less likely to provide the winners compared to Man City vs Real Madrid this season though? It would be a welcome change I guess for Serie A to have the winning team again though.
I agree purely for the fact that it’s been ages that an Italian team has won but even then Napoli was the only team there I followed this season domestically and in the Europe As much as it pains me to say Manchester City look right now completely unstoppable and Erling Haaland who is fated to have a unsuccessful international career deserves a champions league for the unbelievable season he is having He deserves it IMO There are others too like KDB who have done some much for football and are still missing the big trophy I don’t know what your thoughts are on Haaland but for me I can’t claim to have seen anybody quite like him He is probably as good at finishing as anybody has been at anything in football I’d love to to know if pre war legends like peyroteo and bican mirrored his playing style
I guess Erling could be the closest to what Usain Bolt imagined he might be able to be like, or what Usain Bolt might have been like with above average game understanding and finishing and at least average (for top level) ball control ? Although I think actually 60m running experts might have more of an advantage in football compared to 100m ones anyway (maybe Erling actually has better initial acceleration than Bolt? - of course Bolt would have been past his peak sprinting level when he attempted to become a football player anyway though). Bican may have been a little bit more of a dribbler than Haaland I think, but it's hard to be sure. I guess he was a bit less 'beast like' in his general physique but he was certainly tall and a very quick runner I know (and his shooting accuracy seems potentially better in some respects because of stories about knocking bottles off crossbars very reliably and suchlike...but in football of course what effectively matters is just getting the ball into the net and I agree Haaland has a very good knack of that generally). Peyroteo I'm probably a bit less clued up on than Bican even.
Usain bolt I think was participating in those soccer aid games in England during his physical prime They are cringe events but for a good cause I guess Is haaland the most clinical finisher you have seen in the English game? Pre war and post war Dixie dean I read scored 40 goals in one season with his..head In 1927–28 he scored 60 league goals in 39 appearances (still a record in England). According to ‘The Title: The Story of the First Division’ (2017) by Scott Murray, 40 of these goals were headers. https://www.quora.com/Which-football-player-has-the-most-headed-goals-ever He was a complete forward too and not only a finisher It was a different time though and I’m not sure something like this would be possible in today’s game
Hard to say maybe - I guess for players like him, or Lineker too, the pace factor plays a part in increasing the goals tally because they can latch onto more through balls and suchlike than a slower player who is an expert finisher. Clive Allen scored a lot of goals in 1986/87 (though playing in an attacking team with good creative providers) Van Nistelrooy could be an option I guess. We didn't live through Jimmy Greaves's career of course, but he'd seem like a contender too. Tommy Lawton could be possibly (he also scored a lot of headers I believe). Shearer....Fowler possibly....
If you're looking for someone most similar in the modern era, it would be someone like Christian Vieiri. Without going into what Vieiri would look like today, I do think they play similarly, but Haaland looks more physically gifted than the Italian and better finisher too perhaps.