Ukraine v Russia II

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by crazypete13, Apr 20, 2022.

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  1. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The sanctions are already slowing down the war, why wouldn't reducing Russia's primary source of revenue slow it down further. Russia is already struggling to maintain its economy and cutting into the price they can get for their oil is absolutely going to have an impact on that. Again, that doesn't mean every country is going to comply with the cap, but they also know that Russia will not want to completely neuter themselves economically and will demand price reductions below market rate.
     
  2. Robert Borden

    Robert Borden Member+

    Chelsea
    Canada
    Apr 19, 2017
    Toronto, Ontario
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    It should in theory but we don't know if it will reduce their energy revenue in practice. That's what we've been saying for months and on the contrary, they made more money while Europe's energy crisis is getting worse

    "I can't deny that," Hochstein told the Senate Subcommittee on Europe and Regional Security Cooperation in response to a question about whether Moscow was making more money now off its crude oil and gas sales than a couple of months before the war started.

    -U.S. energy security envoy Amos Hochstein
     
  3. The main problem for the would be sanction dodgers is that transportation of the oil is a huge problem. You can sell to India and China to the hilt, but transportation volumes for a huge part is western owned. So you transport Russian oil, but you can't insure your ship and your cargo. Given these dodgers are targets for the Ukrain, you really think twice to do such a dumb thing.
     
  4. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
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    Seattle Sounders
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    United States
    Yes.. Do you know WHY Russia was making more money after the war started despite selling less oil and natural gas and WHY that isn't true now?
     
  5. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
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    United States
    One of the links Robert included said that Russia had purchased 100 used oil tankers, so I would assume this means they will be insuring the ship and cargo themselves.
     
  6. I think 100 is a drop in the ocean. There are around 4000 tankers operating in the world, of which 20% are supertankers and half of those are supersupertankers.
    So, given the amount of oil Russia has to move, they need more than a hundred.
     
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  7. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
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    I don't disagree with any of your points. Just noting that Russia is purchasing used oil tankers on the open market. I would assume that they will continue to do so now that the EU is locking their prices and they don't have enough pipeline capacity to feed China's and India's demand for their oil.

    It absolutely won't replace their lost capacity from the pipelines to the EU, but its something? ;)
     
  8. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    Russia is also running out of storage capability. Buying tankers won't solve that but it is a quick way to do something about the problem.
     
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  9. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
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    I did mention that their storage was mostly/all full in a previous post, but you may have skipped it due to who I was responding to. ;)

    That being said, 100 tankers will "help" in that this is 100 tankers they didn't have before. So their ability to deliver oil by ship has, in theory, increased by whatever size those tankers are.

    HOWEVER, just because they added 100 tankers, it does not mean they actually increase Russia's ability to ship oil by 100 tankers. There are a ton of factors that impact how much oil an oil export port can... export. How much of an increase will be determined by things like the capacity of the pipeline(s) feeding the port, how many slips they have to dock ships, etc.
     
  10. rslfanboy

    rslfanboy Member+

    Jul 24, 2007
    Section 26
    Increased storage capacity at least.
     
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  11. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
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    United States
    Ukraine hit two of the airfields that Russia is using for the bombers they are using to launch cruise missiles at Ukraine. Ukraine is claiming they damaged 2 of the bombers and there are pictures confirming damage to at least one of the bombers. Russia, on the other hand, is claiming that they shot down the drones and that any damage was caused by "debris".



    These airfields are hundreds of kilometers inside of Russia, so, again, we are brought to the old meme of "What air defenses doing??"
     
  12. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
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    Seattle Sounders
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    It's the same issue. If the export ports are already at capacity, adding 100 oil tankers just to have them float out at sea as storage doesn't help them. Also, I doubt 100 oil tankers is a significant increase to their existing storage capacity. It's certainly an increase, but significant?
     
  13. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
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    United States
    Couple of updates on the Bakhmut front.

    1. Russia is actually making advances in the area. Bakhmut still stands, but Russia has claimed (and geo-locators have confirmed) that they have pushed Ukrainian forces out of several villages south of Bakhmut. However, that does not mean Russia occupies those villages, they've just advanced the "Grey zone" between Russian and Ukrainian defensive lines around those villages.



    2. Russia's assaults on Bakhmut do continue, but the "assaults" are being carried out by one or two squads of infantry. I'm not sure if you can even call them squads. The videos Ukraine is releasing of the "assaults" can have as few as 2 soldiers probing Ukrainian lines and rarely exceed 10.



    3. Now that Kherson has fallen, Ukraine has relocated a majority of they howitzers and HIMARS to the eastern front. This has resulted, on some days, that Ukraine is hitting Russians on the Bakhmut front more than Russia is. Scary



     
  14. @Belgian guy
    :ROFLMAO:
    In the Ukrain a Flemish oldie song, of which the Ukranian understand not one single word, has become a top hit song.
    The reason?
    One word repeated constantly sounds like a Ukranian word.
    https://www.ad.nl/buitenland/vlaams...e-muzikale-middelvinger-naar-poetin~a0782214/
    This weekend the Dutch television reported from Ukrain the song "Goeiemorgen" is used as a stick up finger to Pootin, just after the moment the 75 yo singer of it told he would never sing it again. Tiktok is innundated with takes with it.
    View attachment 228112
     
  15. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Every little bit helps. You can't turn off a oil field like a faucet. It's an expensive proposition to stop and to restart pumping, and the latter requires expertise that Russia does not have. And doing this might damage the field, reducing the total oil you get out.

    This isn't a solution, it's a delay tactic. But Russia has to try, because the alternative is disaster.
     
  16. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
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    United States
    Another drone strike on a Russian airbase Deep inside Russia.



    also, an interesting thread on the Ukrainian drone. The poster also speculates that Ukraine may be using transponders from Russian aircraft to fool Russian air defenses into thinking the drones are friendly.

     
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  17. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
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    Seattle Sounders
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    Eh.. a better way those ships would help Russia’s storage problem would be for them to be used to deliver oil to other countries. Russia is years away from building new pipelines to China and India and there isn’t enough storage anywhere for Russia to keep from having to slow/stop extraction if they wait until then..
     
  18. Belgian guy

    Belgian guy Member+

    Club Brugge
    Belgium
    Aug 19, 2002
    Belgium
    Club:
    Club Brugge KV
    Saw that earlier this weekend.

    Nicole of the Nicole & Hugo duo just died as well.
     
  19. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    The problem is Russia has an infrastructure designed to get large amounts of oil and gas to Europe. The amounts India and China are able to buy isn't enough. So they need a place to stick it, just until they win the war, lose the war, or send the world to nuclear armageddon.

    In any case, the project is already in trouble. Turkey won't let any of the tankers into the Black Sea because they are not insured.
     
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  20. spejic

    spejic Cautionary example

    Mar 1, 1999
    San Rafael, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    A Ukrainian farmer fixed his wheelbarrow... with one of the front wheels from a crashed Russian KA-52 helicopter.

    wheelbarrow s.jpg
     
  21. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    It's almost as if sanctions work
     
  22. roby

    roby Member+

    SIRLOIN SALOON FC, PITTSFIELD MA
    Feb 27, 2005
    So Cal
    "You guys are wrong"...says the Canadian monitor! :coffee:
     
  23. I just saw it. She died at 76 after a hip fracture, which odly kills so many old people. My late father's last living sibling end of november celebrated her 90iest birthday and unfortunately a week later after a fall fractured her pelvis. We fear it's soon the end.
     
  24. American Brummie

    Jun 19, 2009
    There Be Dragons Here
    Club:
    Birmingham City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How many times do we have to tell Canadian Monitor that the sanctions are designed to keep Russia from importing things, not to keep them from exporting things.

    It doesn't matter how much revenue Russia has if they cannot buy anything.

    Seriously. How many more times do we have to explain this? Someone give me a number.
     
  25. The Devil's Architect

    Feb 10, 2000
    The American Steppe
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It doesn't matter the number of times you tell him, it's that none of you type slowly enough for him
     
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