General Assignments Discussion

Discussion in 'World Cup 2022 - Refereeing' started by MassachusettsRef, Nov 18, 2022.

  1. Mikael_Referee

    Mikael_Referee Member+

    Jun 16, 2019
    England
    Claus is Rapallini's fourth man. Does this mean he is out from further games? The only fourth official to work again as referee was Faghani (URUFRA QF) in 2018. This is quite surprising if so IMO.
     
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  2. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Claus gets a game it’s the winner of this, right? England France seems a bridge too far.
     
  3. Pierre Head

    Pierre Head Member+

    Dec 24, 2005
    No game fee as such. Used to get a per diem allowance in either Swiss Francs or dollars at $100 per day including travel days.
    So a 2-week tournament would be $1400 but a three day one match such as in a WCQ would be $300.

    IIRC in 1994 FIFA stopped the per diem system for tournaments and paid several thousand dollars to each referee. It later got much higher and last I saw it was in the $70,000 region for the WC!

    PH
     
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  4. AremRed

    AremRed Member+

    Sep 23, 2013

    Quote from that article.

    “A successful referee who would officiate all the games, including the final, could earn up to $300,000 during the tournament.”

    What the hell!?
     
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  5. Mikael_Referee

    Mikael_Referee Member+

    Jun 16, 2019
    England
    Surely. Live non-European refs are verrryyy limited from here, and non-UEFA/CONMEBOL options should in reality be with only one man now... ;) (I agree btw - he was very good in CMRBRA!).
     
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  6. Midwest Ref

    Midwest Ref Member

    Jul 25, 2002
    I will echo Pierre Head here. In the late 90s/early 2000's, the per diem went up to 150/175 a day starting when you went to the airport and ending when you got home. For many US refs, it was a loss of money, especially compared to what they could make on their real jobs. For colleagues from Central America, being appointed to a tournament was a financial windfall.
     
  7. balu

    balu Member+

    Oct 18, 2013
    But was he verrrryyyy good? :D
     
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  8. StarTime

    StarTime Member+

    United States
    Oct 18, 2020
    No Ramos?
     
  9. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There were doubts over Ramos’ return to this WC. He’s serviceable and a relatively safe pair of hands, but he’s also not that good. History and politics allow him a KO match but he’s not—or shouldn’t be—a late round option. Elfath would have to fall flat for that to even be a consideration.

    I think the next round is Mateu-EPL-Orsato-Claus with the possibility that Orsato is held for a semi (in which case Marciniak or even Makkelie would find themselves on a QF… it’s all about that England/France game).

    I wouldn’t close the door to Ghorbal completely, given we are considering Claus. But outside that, I don’t see a CAF or AFC option until the playoff.
     
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  10. El Rayo Californiano

    Feb 3, 2014
    Would CONMEBOL push for one of their own if one of the semifinals is Argentina against Brazil?
     
  11. Mikael_Referee

    Mikael_Referee Member+

    Jun 16, 2019
    England
    :D

    More on an 8,5 than 8,6 level in UEFA marking scale, so this would constitute "very" rather than "verrryyy" I'd say :)

    (I don't pollute the forum with too many posts so add sth else here - no, I don't think any CONMEBOL official is able to handle Argentina vs. Brazil clash, Matonte definitely no, Valenzuela still solid no; only Tobar would have been able IMO, and they didn't choose him...)
     
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  12. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As @Mikael_Referee said, no.

    I think the possibility is one argument for saving Orsato. Marciniak feels like the alternative. Or… Elfath.
     
  13. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    BRA/ARG feels like a perfect Orsato match. Although if France is there in the other semi, it does raise a lot of questions about the final.
     
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  14. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If France eliminates England, Taylor or Oliver is back in the mix there (edit: presuming it is Brazil)I also wouldn’t discount Marciniak. Nor, if he nails it today, Elfath.
     
  15. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    Do national referee committees alter their own referees standings based on their World Cup assignments? By which I mean does PRO make elfath the by far A#1 MLS ref based on all his WC assignments if he wasn’t already, he’ll get all top MLS cup games, etc?
     
  16. El Rayo Californiano

    Feb 3, 2014
    From the BBC article:

    Jose Maria Gimenez, Edinson Cavani, Fernando Muslera and Diego Godin all face potential punishments for breaches of Fifa's disciplinary code relating to offensive behaviour and misconduct.
    Of these four, only Gimenez will be around for 2026 World cup qualifying.
     
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  17. jarbitro

    jarbitro Member+

    Mar 13, 2003
    N'Djamena, Tchad
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No. In fact some national committees pride themselves on seeing things differently than FIFA. And, in fairness to them, there is a different skill set and mechanics needed in a country's pro league than in a nation's WCQ matches. Think the difference bw an afternoon at Dick's Sporting Goods Park vs. the Azteca.
    I do think the countries who get their officials the farthest in the WC though do so largely because they bring up officials that they think FIFA will be responsive too. In other words they try to make a concerted effort--not to respond to WC assignments, but to feed WC referees who are what FIFA wants. That's not always the case (nor has it always been the case in MLS for example)
     
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  18. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We're not England. You don't need Elfath to do every LA derby when you have six or seven refs you'd trust on it.
     
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  19. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No.

    Though perhaps two important clarifications/distinctions here.

    USSF already has Elfath at #1. Or, rather, they have been told he's #1 if for some reason Marrufo was. Those are actual tangible rankings that go to FIFA.

    PRO is a different entity regardless. Your league performance is going to help determine where you slot. And big matches and cup finals need to be rotated anyway. So is Elfath #1, #2, #3 or #4 in any given week in MLS? It doesn't really matter.
     
  20. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    I guess that’s true, if the games aren’t as difficult you don’t always need your top guy in it
     
  21. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    So with elfath being #1 in USSF, does USSF ever try to get him doing non-MLS matches like NWSL college etc? Or does a contract with PRO prevent that
     
  22. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    PRO assigns all professional matches in the United States, including NWSL.

    College soccer isn't through USSF.

    The only thing USSF assigns of any note is the US Open Cup, and that's, to some extent, in coordination with PRO. He wouldn't get a match there other than the final.

    The simple answer here is "no." When you're a FIFA referee you officiate in your domestic top division and that's more or less it, with some rare exceptions (e.g., you might rehab an injury in USL--oh, and some countries deliberately have their referees work a few second division matches as a matter of course).
     
  23. GoneSouth

    GoneSouth Member

    Oct 27, 2011
    Is it really realistic to think we will have a knockout round without any referees from AFC, CAF, or OFC? When’s the last time that happened?
     
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  24. code1390

    code1390 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 25, 2007
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ghorbal has a slight chance for a QF maybe? But AFC and OFC seem done.
     

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