My assumption is that UNC as the host has to get approval from the NCAA for what ever schedule they propose. I suspect that the NCAA is set in their way with regard to game sequences especially as it may pertain to TV revenues which might mean that they want to stick to hours that viewership would matter. Consequently, what we see may be the best compromise they could arrange.
Here are some excerpts from the Pre-Championship Manual: Second-round games will be played Friday, Nov. 18, not before 2 p.m. local time. Third-round games will be played Sunday, Nov. 20, not before noon local time. .... The game times will be established by the host institution (during the bid process) and approved by the Women’s Soccer Committee. For BYU (and other schools that do not allow games on Sundays), this gets moved up to Thursday and Saturday. I notice two things here: 1. The Saturday game should not be at 11:30 am. The earliest allowable game time is noon. 2. The host gets to establish the game times ... which may (?) mean the specific time for each game to be played at the site -- including the specific time the host team will play, subject to approval by the Committee.
They just announced the start of the Men's game on Thursday at it is at noon. So we have, on Dorrance Field: UNC Men at 12 Stanford vs BYU at 2 UNC Women at 5
They've changed the regional times after announcing the men, now it is: UNC Men at 12 UNC Women at 3 Stanford vs BYU at 6 honestly I think this works for the best for UNC. Crowd noise might take a hit but I think in the regional that extra couple of hours for recovery is way more important.
Smells like gamesmanship. The home team should always play last for all the reasons mentioned earlier. One of those west coast teams will have more aggressive travel plans (to get home) and the earlier time to work that out is a courtesy to the out of town teams. To trade that and forgo the more "prime time slot" and a couple hours of recovery time?? really? Not to mention the home team kids do actually have classes while the visitors are obviously missing several days regardless. Does class time matter in D1? at UNC?
I may be misunderstanding you, but if the games are all on Dorrance field, you need at least 3 hours in between. Right?
Correct, but it was changed ... see the next post. I think the folks doing the schedule for the Men missed that the Carolina Women's game was actually a regional double header. They thought they could schedule the game at noon and the next game wouldn't be until 5. They swiftly corrected it to give some time in between. I'm not quite sure why they suddenly changed the order of the games but I also don't think it's as dramatic an issue as you're making it out to be. It's not like Stanford or BYU were going to be flying in the day of the game. It's give 'n take in a way ... the 11:30 start time on Saturday was going to be a problem for Stanford and BYU regardless of what time the game on Thrusday was going to be, but I think having Thursday's game be at 6 instead of 2 will be better for their internal clocks and jet lag and all that jazz. Plus they're more likely to have a bigger crowd at 6 than they would have at 2. also, I don't see any "reasons mentioned earlier" that suggests that the hosts always have to take the second game or that there's any kind of courtesy involved, spoken or otherwise, for why that's the case.
Fair enough. I assume the field there is not an issue. Anytime I see men playing first I get worried. Esp this time of year. Hope there's not any significant rain coming. I was surprised at the lack of crowd for ODU but these games should be much more competitive. Good Luck!
I assume that you’re not just making things up, that you have checked all that out — each team’s travel arrangements, flight schedules, class commitments, coaches preferences, etc. — and have determined that the only possible reason to put Carolina-Georgia in the 3 pm slot is to give the winner the advantage of three extra hours rest before the next game a day and a half later. Excellent research.
this is what I thought as well, but more it was like questioning the research on whether or not the sky is blue. West coast teams do not fly out to east coast games on the day of the game, and vice versa. That would be insane.
I think the simple answer is that they wanted the UNC teams to play back-to-back to maybe get UNC fans to stay for both games. I would guess though that the fans are going to have to clear the stands between the men's and women's game. I would be interested to know if they are separate tickets. I am sure the 2 women's games can be bought as a doubleheader, but I don't know how they would work the men's game into that.
Something seems to have gotten into UNC over the last year, they now actually make some information available about women’s soccer. Sometimes these days you can find out about players’ injuries and status. And, lo and behold, they’ve announced their recruiting class after signing day rather than waiting six months or so. https://goheels.com/news/2022/11/14/womens-soccer-reveals-top-ranked-recruiting-class.aspx
I think this is more a product of it being the top ranked class ... otherwise they wouldn't have made note of it. The information black hole still exists, all you have to do is look at how it covered the injuries on the team this year. on another note, UGA and BYU traveled today. I suspect Stanford did as well but have not commented on it on their Social Media timelines.
*Regis Philbin voice* ... is that your final answer? seems to me @Nooneimportant was probably right and they wanted a UNC back to back but probably were pressured to change it by powers that be. Hope the Heels get the huge 6pm crowd. Turn out.
My understanding is that the UNC men's team was surprised on Monday afternoon to get a spot in the NCAA men's tournament this year given their mediocre 8-5-5 record. UNC had negotiated with the NCAA over the weekend to set up the 2:00 and 5:00 games for the Women Thursday and then "surprise", on Monday they had to add another game on Thursday. Hence, the announcement on Tuesday about the changed starting times for the three games with the earliest starting at noon per NCAA rules. I doubt that there will be last minute changes! Note: The men's NCAA tournament in recent years has always been played on a Thursday-Saturday schedule, and the women played on Friday-Sunday. BYU changes the picture because they do not play on Sundays. It was a coincidence that BYU was at Chapel Hill this weekend on the Thursday=Saturday schedule.
Well, a solid win tonight for the Heels against Georgia. With Allie Sentnor's second goal we went up 3-0 at the 56 minute mark and cruised along until Anson, thinking of playing BYU on Saturday morning, decided to rest most of the starters for the remainder of the game with 14 minutes to go, and whoops, the Bulldogs scored and looked rejuvenated. So it was time to put the first string back in for the last 10 minutes . Problem solved. Earlier in the day I watched the Stanford/BYU game close up. The teams overall appeared to be equal in skills and focus, with Stanford having an advantage of several faster and taller players. 55 shots between both teams for the game with Stanford shooting 33 and BYU 22. However, BYU kept an advantage of shots on frame. With the score 1-1 at the end of two overtimes, BYU prevailed on 5-4 shots from the mark. One thing that awed me was the passing games for both teams. The quickness of decisions for both long and short passes was amazing, as was the precision and weight of the passes and the sense that they had eyes in the back of their heads for many no-look passes that were right on target. I must admit that I am concerned for our game with BYU on Saturday. BYU is not the same team we beat 2-0 in the August pre-season match. They are much better. And with our numbers of injuries to key players, we are not the healthy team we were then. Honestly, if we play the way we did tonight and BYU plays they way they did today, I think that we'd be looking at about a 4-1 loss. On the other hand, soccer is sometimes a quixotic game where team personalities change from game to game, so hope springs eternal. Go Heels!
Sentnor is looking to me like she wants to have a Dunn 2012 NCAA tournament, though she is already at 4 goals whereas I think Dunn had 5 that year in 6 games. Enjoyed the game very much last night. I have not been watching as closely as I have in the past, but they looked strong to me. Lots of chances and finished 3 with very nice goals. It seems more likely to me to be a tight game with BYU than a 4-1 loss. Recall that the went MANY years without ever losing by more than ONE goal, so losing by 2 is rare and losing by 3 surely in the history of the program can be counted on one hand , likely without using the thumb or pinky! Anything can happen. Sure would like to have Maycee Bell on the field!! Sentnor seems destined for true greatness. Depending on when Herman Trophy ballots are cast, she could even be a contender for that if she continues to score like she has. Recall that Dunn in 2012 won the Herman trophy after playing back most of the season then switching to attacking mid for the NCAA tourney and going on a scoring binge that Sentnor may surpass, though not that any voters are comparing her to Dunn 2012 This has probably been discussed as I have not been on the forum this year, but I love that Tori Hansen has become the player and leader she is. The player who missed the key PK in the 2019 NCAA final is now perhaps an All American and the undisputed PK taker for UNC. Lovely story to me of how UNC grows players and people and helps them bounce back from moments that could have become career defining.
Watching that first game myself I thought I didn't want to play Stanford because they were the better team, but also I wanted to play Stanford because UNC had already proven themselves against BYU. I didn't see anything new from the Cougars beyond a general improvement to their game you would expect late in the season. So I think that's going to be one we disagree on @Soccerhunter ... yes it's not the same BYU team, but it's also not the same UNC team. The Tar Heels also have gotten a lot more proficient in possession and grinding teams with movement both forward and back and side to side. I think if they play the same way they did vs ODU and UGA, at least up until the Heels took their foot off the gas at 3-0, they can beat any team in the country. If they play the same way they did, the Heels might enjoy an even more dominant advantage in possession and chance statistics than Stanford did against the Cougars. I sense a lot of negative feelings from fans here and in the stands towards UNC's increased desire this year to cherish the ball... their willingness to go backwards and reset things. This is how you take advantage of the kind of incredible depth UNC has this year and it is well suited for this team, even if it isn't as fast paced and exciting as it could be. They've always won this year when they've stuck to this game plan, and they've gotten a whole lot better at doing it late in the season. They also had a hard lesson in the ACC final of what happens when you look past it too much. I still think the Duke game got the Heels heads in the wrong places getting ready for that game. It was the worst possible style of opponents they could have played back to back. "We were too slow against Duke we need to move faster." ... and FSU is the worst possible team in the country you want to move "fast" against. The "bad" Carolina that we've seen this year is a direct result of UNC attacking too "fast" and forcefully upfield when they win the ball, promptly losing the ball on a turnover or a half chance that isn't as good as it could be with a little patience. With an extra pass. With the willingness to go back and knock it about to pull the opposition out and make them chase. Otherwise, you spend more time defending and less time moving the opposition around, and the value of your depth and fresh legs is mitigated. One could also spend a long time discussing the psychological impact of seeing the ball less and less, how it makes you lose rhythm in possession, how it makes you feel "tight on the ball" as I like to call it. "Holding on to your sticks too tightly" or something along that line is the hockey equivalent. There's more pressure on your shoulder as a player to do something when you're getting the ball less and less. We saw a lot of poor touches and heavy passes from UGA that I attribute directly to that. Offensively, beyond allowing teammates to get up and back in a timely manner, it also opens up a lot of faux fast break chances that the Tar Heels have scored on a lot this year. Just thinking of Dahliens goal vs ODU and Sentnor's opener vs UGA, they were sort of "generated" transition chances where the Tar Heels pulled the opposition out and then hit them quickly on a break through midfield. Hansen in particular has been very good at picking players out in this manner. This is where you can really utilize the speed and skill of players like Dahlien and Sentnor, when they have a chance to drive and attack a back line that is scrambling to keep their t's dotted and i's crossed... or, wait ... oop, she's passed me. I think about that long popular quote from Anson Dorrance about what the opposition hates to play against the most and I've always just half agreed with him. It is frustrating, when you have the ball, to deal with an opponent that comes at you in waves. That's the source of power behind the UNC press that has served them so well in the past. But that's only half the game, and the rest of country has gotten a lot better at the other half while it feels like UNC has relied too much on the press. The other half is what the opposition hates to play against *when they DON'T have the ball* ... It *sucks* as a player when your team can't get a touch of the ball and you're constantly defending and chasing, and I think the argument can be made that it's more impactful than a relentless high press.
I had two folks standing at the rail behind me during the game in the second half and they carried on some fascinating conversations about this team that I expect on this board. Your post reminds me of part of the conversation and makes me wonder if it was you. Two biggest things I agreed with and disagreed with from those conversations: Tori Hansen is absolutely the MVP and Captain of this team for me right now and I would agree 100%, and it was mentioned in the conversation how she's redeemed herself from the spot after the disappointing take against Stanford in the final. She's definitely become the best spot shooter UNC has seen in quite some time. On the other hand, Dahlien was mentioned and the speaker was talking about how she just needed to gain a little confidence, and I think that's ... half wrong glass half empty. Dahlien's problem when she first came in was that she had too much confidence. Her first game she was a buzz saw, tried all kinds of flicks and tricks, even attempted a bicycle kick on a corner, and then burned out and had to sub off quickly. It wasn't about confidence, but reigning that confidence in and deciding when best to utilize that confidence. She's being pulled back so as not to burn herself out and they're coaching her to pick the right times when to go, as evidence in Anson's quote about her when she was co-MVP against ODU. A particular play vs UGA where this came to the forefront was when Dahlien rounded the defensive corner and drove to the goal. She was at a very sharp angle but still probably could have called her own number. Instead she decided to make a really good lay off pass to Tori Dellaperuta. I don't think either decision would have been the wrong one but if Tori hadn't slowed her run (as the other speaker had noted) it would have been a really good look, similar to how her sister had scored but from much closer range at the spot. The confidence is there, she's just trying to learn how and when to use it best and is a little erratic as a result. That's the con, but the pros outweighs it. Dahlien is able to stay on field much longer, pose a threat with her speed much more frequently, and has really improved defensively in checking back with the increased stamina. I love listening to conversations at the games from folks who probably frequent this board, and I hope you or whoever it was didn't mind me eavesdropping.