Alert: Transfer Window Talk!

Discussion in 'Manchester United' started by benni..., Oct 14, 2021.

  1. MizzouMUFC

    MizzouMUFC Member+

    Apr 10, 2010
    Places
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    The issue is, why are we buying guys we have to transform or coax out former form? We’ve barely spent this summer. We shouldn’t be forced into bargain buys in such an important position especially when considering our current options there. But here we are again, doing just that, because of the rare combination of ineptitude and transfer budget lies that only United seem to have.
     
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  2. Sofabloke

    Sofabloke Member+

    Dec 24, 2003
    Mu
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    ^ This

    ^ & This
     
  3. Ruud v.Nistelrooy 10

    Staff Member

    Jamaica
    Jun 4, 2006
    Antilla
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Jamaica
    much like most of the last 10 years i also don't understand these last minute bargain bin moves either.

    again, loan these guys if they are experiments. we're already resigned to paying their wages anyway at this point due to weak bargaining position (yet again) and if they somehow pan out then they can still be bought for cheap or free. at least try to take them on loan.

    and what the hell happened to not just about signing players but the signing right ones? where's that gone? are the board just shoving players EtH's way now and saying make do?
     
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  4. MizzouMUFC

    MizzouMUFC Member+

    Apr 10, 2010
    Places
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    This window as spiraled fast due to not having proper backup options and being hyper focused on one target. It’s a mistake Woodward consistently made and now Arnold/Murtough are making the same mistake.

    Now we’re past the point of no return for this window. The word is out that we’re clueless and using a scattergun technique. Any decent player with a half competent agent would tell their client to stay the hell away from United unless they pay the big bucks. So now we’ll panic buy whoever is available, overpaying in transfer and wages, and they likely won’t fit or aren’t good enough and we’ll be talking about them in 3 years wondering why we can’t move them.

    Ever the optimist, aren’t I.
     
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  5. Naboomagnoli

    Naboomagnoli Member+

    May 31, 2007
    We would be coaxing out old form from De Jong if we signed him, too. We would want him to bring his 2018/19 form from the Eredivisie, just as with Rabiot and his 2018/19 form from Ligue Un.

    I don’t disagree with this point more broadly though. Ultimately our scouting department is very obviously broken, with no responsiveness to changing requirements. They obviously just have 2 or 3 favourite targets that they obsess over and fail to see past, or rest on their laurels from previous analysis. Even with Rabiot, it’s old ghosts from the head scouts who have just left, while the new infrastructure hasn’t bedded in at all. So it leaves Ten Hag having to bring his own contact list, or, in the case of Rabiot, sifting through the horrible list we’ve given him and seeing if he identifies any potential in there.

    On top of all this, we were utterly horrible last season, we have no CL, and most players with a bright future are understandably hesitating / picking other clubs over us. We’re at the point where the burden of proof is on us to show we’re turning a corner, and it will take at least a season before we are able to win out on the higher profile talents out there.
     
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  6. Sofabloke

    Sofabloke Member+

    Dec 24, 2003
    Mu
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    There is a world of difference between de Jong form and Rabiot form - as exposed through the mirror of fan sentiment.

    Juve fans want Rabiot gone, Barca fans just want de Jong used properly as he clearly still has it.

     
  7. Naboomagnoli

    Naboomagnoli Member+

    May 31, 2007
    Absolutely. De Jong still shows more quality in his role because ultimately he’s an Ajax graduate at Barca, a club defined by the stewardship of an Ajax graduate. Rabiot has been nothing like the player who was originally signed by Juve, not least because Juve play nothing like the same way as PSG. Juve fans have never seen the same player as PSG fans.

    For example, Rabiot had more attempted passes in his half season at PSG (1048) than he did all last season at Juve (1041). That’s comparing 11.8 90s to 25.4 at Juve.

    His touch distribution per 90 shows the difference too:
    5B44E2E7-6DDB-4A8B-B90C-7D05E018F391.jpeg

    I have no real opinion on whether he’d work out for us because I’m still trying to understand his lack of impact at Juve. I don’t really like it as a move, as a gut reaction, but I don’t think analysing him purely based on Juve classes as due diligence. And I’m not swayed by fan sentiment in the slightest - it’s abundantly clear that 99.9% of football fans don’t have the faintest idea what they’re talking about.
     
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  8. jeff070

    jeff070 Member+

    Dec 31, 2004
    PA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Lebanon
    To be fair to Fred we are asking to dominate the midfield on his own. He is not Scholes. Only Scholes could control a midfield on his own. Not even Xavi did.
     
  9. jeff070

    jeff070 Member+

    Dec 31, 2004
    PA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Lebanon
    I watched a more than a few Juve games. They struggled as a team but he was never the bang on starting player. He was always put in to accommodate others rather than lead the midfield. At least at PSG and here he would have that role to control the middle.
     
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  10. Naboomagnoli

    Naboomagnoli Member+

    May 31, 2007
    It’s a big ask no doubt. But it’s not so much that he has to do it on his own, he has the fullbacks tucking in and he has two CBs he should be working with, he has 8s who should be making themselves available. It’s more that, the job we’re asking him to do with the ball requires cognitive abilities he doesn’t have, technical precision he doesn’t have, an ability to play on the half turn that he doesn’t exhibit.

    I don’t think he flat out can’t do it - just that he’s not versed in possession play like that at all, and if he’s up against a well drilled side then he becomes a genuine pressing trigger in a position where we need him to be anything but.
     
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  11. Naboomagnoli

    Naboomagnoli Member+

    May 31, 2007
    Again per FBRef, PSG in those above stats had season possession stats of 66% & 64%; Juve had 58, 57 and then 51.7%. He played a number of games at LM in a 4-4-2 from what I can see.
     
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  12. jeff070

    jeff070 Member+

    Dec 31, 2004
    PA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Lebanon
    Rabiot and Fred can work well together.
     
  13. MizzouMUFC

    MizzouMUFC Member+

    Apr 10, 2010
    Places
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Do we even have a scouting department right now? We heard about the major dismissals earlier this summer but did we ever hear about replacements? I don’t remember hearing anything past the rumors of us wanting Mitchell. By all accounts, our current scouting department is just ETH.
     
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  14. SF19

    SF19 Member+

    Jun 8, 2013
    ^ Fletcher was watching Sarr the other day when he scored that half-field goal.
     
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  15. Sofabloke

    Sofabloke Member+

    Dec 24, 2003
    Mu
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    The various heads of department went but all the scouts and analysts didnt I believe. Gaz Nev said 50 odd in an interview feels a bit high, but who knows?
     
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  16. jeff070

    jeff070 Member+

    Dec 31, 2004
    PA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Lebanon
    Some reporter is saying we agreed with FDJ's agent.
     
  17. Naboomagnoli

    Naboomagnoli Member+

    May 31, 2007
    We’ve hired some new recruitment analysts I think, but I think our scout reports are still based on whatever we found in Jim Lawlor’s My Documents.
     
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  18. Anonymous_United

    Manchester United
    Brazil
    Jul 13, 2018
    Rabiot is asking for €10million per year, saw few tweets. Absolute Panic.
     
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  19. jeff070

    jeff070 Member+

    Dec 31, 2004
    PA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Lebanon
    The problem I have with Rabiot is he is not in it to rejuvenate the club, he is in it to play and get paid. He has no loyalty.
     
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  20. Chaz Striker

    Chaz Striker Member+

    Jul 26, 2005
    Denver
    Also, we can very easily get Bale'd ourselves with moves like this. The only thing preventing him from pulling something like that is if he enjoys playing for France. Bale was a always a shoo-in for Wales.
     
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  21. SF19

    SF19 Member+

    Jun 8, 2013
    With the way we are run right now, it's going to be this way. The Glazers make no attempt to build any kind of bond with any of the players.
     
  22. United 16

    United 16 Member+

    Manchester United
    Mar 25, 2016
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
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  23. MizzouMUFC

    MizzouMUFC Member+

    Apr 10, 2010
    Places
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I think there’s a real possibility that Murtough and Arnold are worse at this than Woodward.

    Holy shit is that scary.
     
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  24. Naboomagnoli

    Naboomagnoli Member+

    May 31, 2007
    #1999 Naboomagnoli, Aug 10, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2022
    I’ve only just seen this. It’s embarrassing that you were still trying at this stage, with something this tired and unenlightening, as if these discussions haven’t been put to bed weeks ago when the first public training session in Thailand was streamed live. Just unedifying.
     
  25. JC7rox

    JC7rox Member+

    Manchester United FC, LAFC
    Jun 11, 2004
    West Coast, Cali!
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    So what’s up, guys? Is the end nigh?
     

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