Bad stories

Discussion in 'Referee' started by Law5, Oct 27, 2021.

  1. AZOldRef

    AZOldRef Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Apr 5, 2021
    Tossed a parent this weekend ... after the match he approaches the ref tent with his phone out recording saying he wants to "talk." Uh, no. Didn't I kick you out already? Dude, we don't talk to parents after a game. He chewed the ear off a staff person for a while. Found out the next day he filed a complaint which got all the way to our head ref.
    Parent DEMANDED an apology ... when our top person told him no, he cursed him out. Sigh.
    U14B. Did I mention the parent's team lost? Funny how you never seem to have problems with parents from the winning team.
     
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  2. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    With my former tournament director hat on, we had an irate parent vehemently giving a youth referee his negative opinion of their performance, in the referee area. U13 boys, silver division. We banned him from returning to the facility for the rest of the tournament. Did I mention that he was a board member of the host club? He was not asked to serve another term. Did I mention that this was my daughter's team? (She was the only girl on the team.) Did I mention that he regularly forcefully told his son that his performance on the team was not adequate?

    The guy died about five or six years later while running a marathon.
     
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  3. voiceoflg

    voiceoflg Member+

    Dec 8, 2005
    During a game Sunday, I heard a coach on an adjacent field berating a 15 year old referee, solo U9 7v7. My last game of the day, the same coach is on my field. During all the other games, I kept my cards in my wallet. Before this one, I took them out of the ref wallet and put the yellow in my front right jersey pocket and my red in my back right shorts pocket.

    Interestingly, I never heard a peep out of him. A parent told me the coach doesn't respect teenage referees but never has a problem with older referees.
     
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  4. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Reminds me of a U12 game I did a few years ago. Two rival teams (neighboring towns/schools), and the parents were bad. About 20 minutes in, I position a field marshal behind both sets of parents and told the field marshals to be ready to escort people out.

    After the game, a parent “wants to ask a question.” I told him I don’t talk to parents. He says he will report me. I told him that was fine, as this was also my high school assignor who was putting me on the biggest high school conferences in the area. I ended up emailing the club president and told her about this team. Next weekend, that team was nowhere to be found at their home tournament. Wonder why………
     
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  5. Law5

    Law5 Member+

    Mar 24, 2005
    Beaverton OR
    In middle school age youth games, it's probably not surprising that parents think they can 'ask a question' after the game. They write the checks for their kid to play. There are always a few toxic parents in a club that will also be chewing on the paid coach. When I was president of a fairly successful competitive youth club, it was reported to us that a dad, at his son's team's very first practice, was asking other parents, "What can we do to get rid of this coach?" At least one parent reported this to the coach, the coach to the director of coaching and the kid was given his release from the team and the club. That kind of drama is a total distraction.

    When they get to high school, sometimes there are still parents who think that they can control the coach and, also, have input on the officials' performance. WRONG! As SRI, I occasionally get contacted by a parent, and I know the state high school association guy in charge of soccer also gets some e-mails and calls, about 'this referee.....' Anybody who wants to complain about the referee at that level should be referred to the athletic director. Assignors don't have time for calls from parents about that kind of stuff, and the assignors work for the AD's, not the parents. The parents have no more role to play than a spectator at a MLS game. Yeah, I know it's your kid but they are playing for the school's team. It's the school's game, not the parents.

    There was a local high school parent whose son was a sub on his high school basketball team. Dad thought the kid should be a starter. It being a hoity toity, highly entitled public school, the dad hired a private detective to get dirt on the coach. The coach was let go, even though what the private eye found was unrelated to the school, the team or coaching. I think the school staff was in fear of the dad. The coach is now coaching in the NBA. The kid? Haven't heard anything about him.
     
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  6. Rufusabc

    Rufusabc Member+

    May 27, 2004
    A long time ago, I was at a tournament where the fields were really close. I was centering on one field and I could hear a parent loudly berating the young crew on the other field. It was non-stop. Next time the ball was out on my field, I had the parent removed. The young referee was terrified.
     
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  7. sam_gordon

    sam_gordon Member+

    Feb 27, 2017
    As a parent, I get that some refs refuse to answer questions from parents. Just my opinion, I think that's the wrong stance to take.

    Two examples from this past weekend's showcase... as I approach the field, the game before us is stopped for an injured player. After the player is put on a cart, the teams lined up for a PK. AR2 steps onto the field pointing/calling out "Green <something>. The CR walks over to Green 13 and shows a yellow card. One of the parents asks what the card was for (not accusatory) and AR2 says the player had scuffed up the ground at the spot. No complaints from anyone.

    In our game, one of the parents asked what a call was (again, not accusatory) and AR2 wouldn't even acknowledge him.

    I think those that refuse to talk to parents as a rule miss out on an opportunity to educate others. Now, if a spectator has been complaining about calls all day or you can tell in their tone that they want to argue, I totally get not answering. But I think it's a mistake to have a blanket "I won't talk to parents" rule.

    Just my opinion of course.
     
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  8. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    If you are going to have a blanket rule one way or another, "no" is a better rule than "yes."

    Trivial questions during the game that can be answered without interruptions, sure. "Questions" after a controversy during a game? Not a chance.
     
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  9. soccerdad72

    soccerdad72 Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Apr 5, 2021
    I agree - that's a good distinction. A quick question asked along the sideline that can be answered quickly is one thing. Going over to the ref after a game is over is a bad idea. It's only going to lead to a confrontation that won't be good. The game is over - what can be gained by going after the ref at that point?

    I had a quick question yesterday at my son's State Cup game (U17). The other team was subbing maybe 10 minutes into the game, so as the AR was close to where I was sitting, I asked if we were doing unlimited subs (most games at this age are limited by half - no re-entry). Without even having to turn around, the AR answered me and even gave me a couple other tournament-specific rules on substitutes. My wife laughed at me and asked if I was trying to learn the rules - I had just gotten assigned 5 games for the tournament this upcoming weekend (and truthfully, hadn't looked over most of the rules yet).
     
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  10. sam_gordon

    sam_gordon Member+

    Feb 27, 2017
    Actually quite a bit, especially at younger ages. I still remember when my son was U10, he got called for impeding. We were still new to soccer, so I had no idea it was a rule. One of the dads on the sideline tried to explain "it's because he put his hands out, keeping the player from going around him". I actually asked the ref after the game to explain the rule to me and he did. Then I know about the rule in future games and *I* can explain it to other parents if the question comes up (and it has over the years).

    Obviously each situation is different and you'd have to make a judgement call on whether it's a legitimate question or a challenge.
     
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  11. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agree on this. If it’s a quick question in good spirit, I’ll try to answer quickly. The issue is where to draw the line. This line is different by age group, game importance, etc. I just won’t answer questions after a game like this parent wanted. It was clear it wasn’t going to be a question-it was going to be a berating disguised as a question.
     
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  12. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    So this is the t-shirt my son gives me (English & American Lit BA) at move-out from his freshman dorm. At least a handful here should appreciate this...
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. soccerdad72

    soccerdad72 Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Apr 5, 2021
    Hope his freshman year went well. My son now has three semesters left - he’s about to accept his second and third co-op for the summer/fall semesters, then back on campus next spring
     
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  14. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    Oops this shoulda been in Best Stories.

    Well, Erie to Pgh drive was gullywasher-whiteknuckler. So a worst drive wrapped in an awesome retrieval.
     
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  15. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    Mine is off to Croatia for two weeks (finishing a spring class) then hoping to co-op next summer/fall. Fingers crossed, vibes sent.
     
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  16. soccerdad72

    soccerdad72 Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Apr 5, 2021
    Drove Erie to Cleveland tonight as well. Weather really sucked. I hydroplaned more than once.
     
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  17. Pittsburgh Ref

    Pittsburgh Ref Member+

    Oct 7, 2014
    da 'Burgh
    Oh but the construction is all done, so...
     
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  18. soccerref69420

    soccerref69420 Member+

    President of the Antonio Miguel Mateu Lahoz fan cub
    Mar 14, 2020
    Nat'l Team:
    Korea DPR
    Sorry, I'm not going to fall for that "but you're just educating them" stuff.

    There is no reason to answer in the one you listed here. If the spectator sees a challenge that happens and asks you what the call was, it means they didn't feel it was a foul, so what benefit is there to saying that it was a foul? Then they may start asking you about any call they don't agree with since you responded once already.

    I posted a story a month ago where a coach clearly disagreed with a foul the CR called so asked me as AR1 "what I would have called". My answer was repeatedly stating "I have no opinion", which clearly frustrated him. But it's a lose-lose situation, the credibility of either my CR or myself takes a hit if I give an answer. Same thing can happen with a spectator (except their opinion on credibility is useless, but still), explaining calls is a lose-lose situation, so like the next responder stated, it's much better to have a blanket "no" than a blanket "yes".

    If you parents want to be "educated", then take a referee class and learn the rules so you can sit on the sideline and explain to your fellow parents about a call on the field. It's not the referees' jobs to explain their calls to you to educate you. Maybe you can ask me how much time is left or something like that. If you try to ask me "what a call was", enjoy looking at my back.
     
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  19. socal lurker

    socal lurker Member+

    May 30, 2009
    For me, it depends on the call. On a clear foul, I'm not wasting my time, as you're right that it isn't a real question. Where it's a quirky call and they actually may not know what happened, I'm fine giving a brief response--when the tenor is appropriate. E.g., a slow developing OS that occurs in the "wrong" half of the field ("she was off when it was kicked"), an odd double touch, etc.
     
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  20. ejschwartz

    ejschwartz Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Oct 17, 2021
    I'm happy to educate anyone who has a legitimate interest in learning about the laws, or even what a referee is thinking or looking for. As a player, I learned from referees and coaches. And sometimes (as we know) coaches do not fully understand the laws and say inconsistent things. So having a referee explain the laws and what they were looking for was very helpful.

    Personally, I find it's easy to distinguish between people who are earnestly trying to learn and those who are looking for a confrontation or fishing for ammunition to complain further. I also think that every time we have a civil conversation with someone in the soccer community it's a reminder that referees are people and not robots, and society generally frowns upon yelling at people.
     
  21. IASocFan

    IASocFan Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 13, 2000
    IOWA
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Besides the ability and desire to answer a question, there is also the requirement to focus your attention on current play and where you need to position yourself.
     
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  22. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia

    In today's climate, I can TOTALLY understand why someone would just walk by and not want to do a "Question and Answer" session to a stranger.

    Having said that, I did a U17 game this weekend and while walking through the exit on my way to the parking lot, a parent said "Ref, can I ask you a question?" With other folks nearby, and a game where the fans were fine, I made a joke and said "sure".

    He wanted to know why I didn't have any AR's. It might be hard for many to believe here, but many parents honestly don't know the reason and I gave a very brief explanation why the situation exists. Apparently there may have been two or three plays where the ball was out by inches for a throw-in but I had no AR's on a large field and can't make the call if I'm not 100% sure.

    The guy seemed to appreciate I took time to provide an explanation and said he wouldn't want to be in my shoes and asked since he saw a 3-man crew in the previous match. If I had walked by and ignored (which is obviously my right), I am an a-hole and perhaps you get to hear about it in the stands the next time you officiate their team. I was not officiating a Champions League Match as folks sometimes take themselves WAY too seriously.

    However, if someone else had walked straight to their car in my situation, I would totally understand. I enjoy talking with people and felt I can actually turn the situation into a positive by doing so.
     
  23. Ickshter

    Ickshter Member+

    Manchester City
    Mar 14, 2014
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would say that most of this discussion is related to YHTBT. I usually can tell when I am being approached by someone I can usually know how it is going to go before a word is spoken. I don't think there is anything wrong with being open to give people another point of view.

    I have a story from a match last week in a HSGV match. I am AR2 at a low level match. I have bleachers behind me with roughly 25-30 sets of parents of both sides. There was a play with a ball hit up high, Defender plays the ball off their thigh (hard to tell if deliberate or not, not that it even matters though). Ball goes directly back to the GK who picks up the ball. We play on as a guy yells from the bleachers "You can't pass the ball back to the keeper!" I don't turn around I just yell: "It has to be passed back by foot! If you are going to yell at us at least know the rules!" I get a good chuckle from the parents and the guy yells back "Thank you!". Never heard any more shout outs from the parents about calls made on the pitch. So YMMV but at times I have no problem in dialogue with some parents.
     
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  24. davidjd

    davidjd Member+

    Jun 30, 2000
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    AND very often which small child, sub, or parent's legs you need to try to avoid just enough not to hurt yourself.
     
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  25. AZOldRef

    AZOldRef Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Apr 5, 2021
    Agree with the sentiment. I think I can tell if someone has a legitimate non-confrontational question vs. someone looking for a battle. If a quick word on an unusual call or common misconception can help move things along, fine.

    Frequent example - keeper ball in hand, drops close (but inside) PA line, punts ball, feet cross the line. Parents start to stir - "over the line, over the line!" I quietly say, "it's the ball, not the feet, if they drop it before crossing the line it's fine." Most parents nod and we're done. Seems easier than just ignoring parents.

    If a parent is provoking an argument, different story.
     
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