Pre-match: Leaving It Late: Final CONCACAF Qualifying Window (March 2022)

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by NietzscheIsDead, Mar 7, 2022.

  1. TOAzer

    TOAzer Member+

    The Man With No Club
    May 29, 2016
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Pulisic trembles, and Tuchel smiles, before the majestic excellence of the gazelle Arriola. Not even an exaggeration.
     
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  2. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    That wasn’t the point I was making.
     
  3. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    huh. I'd just discount anybody saying Nips and Jesus haven't been playing well to start the MLS season. It's not like they're Salah and Mane, but they've been good for FCD... and seem to be improving as their fitness and collective understanding improve with more game time together.

    and it's not like the US has a ton of healthy options going untapped out there.

    I could see making the argument that Nips is at the end of the line of a group of talented guys who play wide in that roster... so whose spot might be better used for another type of player (unless Aaronson is truly out). but Nips does have experience- at this level, in big games, and playing for GGG- and has shown himself ready to kill himself defensively... but unfortunately also ready to kill most of his final balls.

    I'm a bit surprised Sarge didn't make it based on his consistent PL starting and work at RB (at least that's where he ends up on the field most games for Norwich). But tbh, Morris seems to have regained his first step and pace... and even though he's looked rusty, he's flashed those explosive qualities that give him an edge over Sarge, IMO.

    But up front... who else is there out there that's such a slam-dunk that should take Jesus or Nips' places? Maybe an in-form Djordje deserves a look? But is he an obvious improvement?

    Defensively... I'm a RB fan, and Long's inclusion is a travishmockery, tbh. Brooks has routinely made slow-mo or over-committing mistakes vs regional quicker opposition that are lethal, especially away... so I get being concerned about bringing him in. That said, his distribution is fantastic- and the US is going to need somebody to play it from the back, skip lines and vary the attack so it doesn't rely on Musah/Acosta/LDLT for everything. Zimm has some of that, but nowhere near as good as Brooks. And it's not like Brooks is a down and out slob- the dude is starting regularly in the Bundie and is a key player for his team and still great in the air and on the tackle.
     
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  4. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not going to lie - I'm incredibly worried we are not going to automatically qualify. The injuries we are seeing are putting the team into a dangerous situation.

    Since the start of qualifying, I've been saying that the US couldn't afford to "grow into the system", as qualifying is too short of an event. Here we are. This team has underachieved for 11 games, and we are left in a situation with precious little margin for error. I take no pride or joy in being right about this, but had the US done what Canada done - maximized the talent on the team with good coaching - we wouldn't be in this position.

    We are in a situation where a good coach is really needed, and I have little confidence in Gregg Berhalter being able to get this team over the line. I hope I'm wrong, but this is not looking good.
     
  5. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I hear what you're saying. I'll add that Canada also had to go through prelim qualifying and that gave the coach and team time to gel in important games.

    I'm not a big GGG fan, but not as big a detractor as most others. He had a swing anna miss with a couple lineup and roster choices. He's also put, IMO, the right guys out there and at times they've underperformed... which I suppose some could put on the coach, but I put on the players (who are very young).

    Not saying you're wrong, but out of curiosity- what do you see a different coach doing differently in limited time with the team that GGG hasn't to maximize the talent?
     
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  6. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Putting a simpler, more instinctive plan in place. The international game does not lend itself well to complex and intricate systems. Players just aren’t together enough to build the cohesion necessary to execute a system like what Berhalter wants.

    I hate going back to Canada, but Herdmann gets the international game. His system is simple to execute, and it gets his best players in their best positions. Berhalter has done a very good job with the defense, but the attack has underachieved. The attack is still too “read and react” as opposed to being more instinctive.
     
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  7. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thanks. Agree with all of that.

    Couple thoughts...
    From what I've seen, Canada plays a direct countering style which plays to their strengths- blazing fast, talented wide players and forwards who can attack in limited numbers and create and score from limited chances. Their remaining players are all adequate and willing to run through walls to serve the team, helping provide solid defensive shape at all times.

    The US used to play like that, but for right or wrong are trying to develop the ball out of the back under GGG. I don't think you're advocating a return to the rope-a-dope style?

    I feel like GGG's "vertical" style tends to do a decent job getting the ball down the field wide, but the team never seems set up to commit numbers to attack the box, so IF the cross comes in (and to a man, the US final ball has been pretty dreadful), there's only 1 or 2 guys there against 3+ defenders...and none of the US 9s is a guy who's shown they can beat 2+ guys to the space on the ground or in the air unless the ball is inch-perfect. I don't know that GGG's tactics are about keeping players at home to solidify the defense, or whether it's the players who aren't understanding the timing and shape needed to support the attack without opening up the back. It's a consistent failure that needs addressing.

    BUT... when MMA were on the field, the shape and tactics changed- varying the point of attack from wide to central to switching, and putting numbers around the ball upfield more consistently. I don't know if this is simply about those 3 specific guys and how they read, play and understand the game differently, or whether GGG was specifically instructing them to play that way....but I think it's the former.

    So for me, there's definitely an issue with GGG's approach or implementation that needs fixing, and there's an issue with the US players and their final ball being a mess.
     
  8. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    The team looks like a bedraggled mess coming out of the club window. With McKennie, Dest, and Aaronson out, the team has taken a huge setback. This is unfortunate because it seems as though these guys just cannot ever get everyone on the field together. If there are problems qualifying this weekend, this will obviously be one of the major reasons why. The US team just has not been healthy over the past two years.

    Players will need to take ownership and step up. This is where Berhalter’s next man up philosophy where he has rotated so many guys through competitive games should put the US in a better position than many other squads. McKennie and Dest are two of the top players in the squad. Aaronson is also a key guy.
    There are no replacements for what those guys do, period. McKennie is a big game player, and having him out is a HUGE blow because these are the biggest three games of the cycle…in direct competition with the three teams they are battling with for a qualifying spot.

    There are some obvious guys who can step up and deliver: Pulisic, Adams, Reyna, Jedi Robinson, Zimmerman, and Weah.

    There are a few others who I have a suspicion may be the ones to make the difference should the US qualify: Arriola, Musah, Acosta, and Morris.

    Notice that I don’t have a single striker listed there. They are all performing unevenly and even though Ferreira is coming in hot, he has been up and down with the Nats lately. Ferreira and Arriola have really developed chemistry and understanding and should those two get on the field focused with Pulisic on the left, I would think that some goals could come…that is if the ball is able to make it through the midfield, which is where Musah (and LDLT) comes in.

    Questions:

    - Does Reyna play the #8 and Weah play right wing?

    - What role does LDLT play? Against which team(s)? Same questions for Busio.

    The points strategy coming into this trio of games will be extremely important. I am interested to see what they choose to do and how they approach the Mexico game.
     
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  9. Jazzy Altidore

    Jazzy Altidore Member+

    Sep 2, 2009
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Aaronson updates?
     
  10. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've never been overly impressed, but Prefok has been pretty consistently putting the ball in the net lately and I thought I heard some noise from GGG that he was going to feature this window. I like Jesus, but feel like he's at his best as a more withdrawn guy, which leaves nobody advanced in GGG's typical setup. So either they play with the formation, pushing CP or Weah higher, or go with Pre.

    Reyna... I just don't see him as the 8 in this setup. too much defensive responsibility for a guy that seems more focused on his offensive responsibilities and occasional reaction chasing run back, more than carefully considered awareness of reading the play defensively to get himself where he needs to be ahead of time.

    Now... if he was an 8 with a double pivot of Adams & Acosta or Musah behind him- I can see it (although I don't see GGG switching things up here because of personnel). but that would mean the wings would have to work harder defensively- and I want CP upfield as much as possible.

    I think he'll be on the bench vs Mex due to that idiotic 90 minutes he just played, and Weah will start on the right opposite CP, with Pre or Jesus centrally.

    I honestly don't see Busio playing much. He's more of a 6 when I see him- great at finding useful balls forward when given time, but never opening up space for himself on the dribble that the US needs from its 8. This is more Musah and LDLT territory, and each has enough defensive awareness and bite to do the job (not at Wes levels). If there's a problem with Adams and then Acosta, sure- we'll see Busio.

    Points strategy... bleh. I want all the points and don't want any formation concessions, even in the Mex game. But I get the rationale for going all in on Panama and not blowing up at altitude at Azteca... even if I don't like it.
     
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  11. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    since we can't discuss Aaronson in the Aaronson thread...

    here's the latest thing I saw from an hour or so ago:

    FC Red Bull Salzburg

    @RedBullSalzburg

    Traveling Red Bulls Good luck and come back healthy, boys! Whether Brenden #Aaronson will join the US national team is still open due to his knee problems
     
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  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Will beating Mexico make you feel better?
     
  13. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A result of any type against Mexico will help. Four points should be good enough. Five would be a lot better.
     
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  14. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    Is the best strategy in Mexico to sit most of your top players and tell the rest of the guys: no pressure, go out and win?
     
  15. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    The more I think about the Mexico game, the more I go with some of the players who have been really showing that they want to make the squad, regardless of ability. And I give them the freedom to attack. You want to be in Qatar? Go make it happen. Those guys include LDLT, Jedi, Zimmerman, Arriola, Roldan, Pefok, etc.

    Pulisic———Ferreira———Arriola
    ———LDLT————Musah———
    ——————Acosta——————
    Jedi———————————Yedlin
    ———Zimmerman—EPB————
    ——————Horvath——————
     
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  16. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Horvarth
    Reynolds M Rob Long (or EPB) Bello
    Acosta Busio
    Arriola Reyna Morris
    Pefok

    Second half planned subs:
    - Weah (he needs minutes)
    - Ferreira as attacking mid


    Including Reyna as he hasn't played for the NT since last June and may have forgotten the Powerpoint and Acosta because you have to without Adams.
     
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  17. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't know.

    This is a B+ lineup for the US- which I guess I can get behind. These players should be pretty primed to go and shouldn't give up too much. Not sure about EPB, tbh... that's quite a spot to throw him into without much if any (that I can remember) time with those guys. I want my CBs confident and comfortable with each other and the FBs... I think you have to go Miles here.

    But if we're putting out most of these A guys... why hold back here? who are we resting for Panama- Adams, Weah and Reyna?
     
  18. el floppo

    el floppo Member

    NY RB
    United States
    Dec 7, 2021
    NYC LES Evil
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    so just roll with the complete 2nd team, but throw Reyna (who just went a long 90 mins yesterday) into the mix with guys he hasn't played much with?

    I guess if we're giving up vs Mand putting all our eggs in the Panama/CR baskets.

    I'm not liking it.
     
  19. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think Reyna is pretty rested given that was his first full 90 minutes since the WCQ in El Salvador. And I'd be inclined to sub him out early.
     
  20. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Brooks is not even good in the Bundesliga any more, Wolfsburg fans want him replaced ASAP.

    As for C-CAF, the guy is a tronco unable to follow a dribbler, the sort of low-center-of-gravity guys rather common in Central America and Mexico. Glad he's out.
     
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  21. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    We will. But the pool is not that great. It has some potential, but truth be told, half of our guys in Top 5 leagues are about to get relegated, and of the other half, most are utility/depth players.

    Beyond Pulisic, Aaronson, McKennie, and Reyna, when healthy, their current situation is nothing to write home about.

    PS: The good side is that this is probably the worst Mexico in memory, and the same applies to Costa Rica. Even this Panama is inferior to the one that got crushed in Russia.
     
  22. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    I left Adams and Pefok off because they are on yellows. Weah is injury prone. Just my personal approach, which means absolutely nothing.
     
  23. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    if weah is too injury prone to play..what is pulisic just expendable?
     
  24. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We can beat Mexico with any team boys!

    Nations League Final 3:2
    Steffen
    McKenzie Brooks Ream
    Yedlin McKennie Acosta Dest
    Reyna Sargent Pulisic

    Gold Cup Final 1:0
    Turner
    Cannon Sands MRob Bello
    Williamson Acosta Lletget
    Arriola Zardes Hoppe

    World Cup Qualifier 2:0
    Steffen
    Yedlin MRob Zimmerman ARob
    Musah Adams McKennie
    Weah Pepi Aaronson
     
  25. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    All those were at home. It's going to be somewhat more difficult in the Azteca. A draw should be possible, though.
     

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