Interesting Best XI

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Excape Goat, Aug 30, 2005.

  1. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    These two are also interesting. 1990s eleven by Thomas Tuchel.



    Schmeichel, Zanetti, Koeman, Desailly, R. Carlos, Deschamps, Seedorf, Zidane, Figo, Rivaldo, Raul

    Other nominees and options are given in the five minutes video. Personally I'd tend to select those who were good well into both halves of the decade. So not Raul or Koeman really. Deschamps is nice for this.

    Best players of the 21st century without an international trophy, by stats website squawka:
    https://www.squawka.com/en/best-players-without-international-trophy-zanetti-ferdinand/?amp
     
  2. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
  3. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Arsenal
    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Wait...did you actually research the positions these chemists played in real life? Did these "nerds" use to play football? :D
     
  4. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    hahaha, I think, just two real Nobel were GK when younger.

    I should name it "fake Nobel" or sounds like Nobel, instead of :)
     
  5. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I noticed this XI just from players he played with too:
    Sir Trevor Brooking best 11 he played with though his career - YouTube
    Peter Shilton (mentions Ray Clemence, Phil Parkes);
    Billy Bonds,
    Alvin Martin,
    Bobby Moore,
    Frank Lampard Sr;
    Mick Channon,
    Ray Wilkins,
    Martin Peters,
    Alan Devonshire;
    Kevin Keegan;
    Geoff Hurst
     
  6. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
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  7. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member+

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    An interesting article. The selection in no way reflects the club's history, given the much-publicised fact that Newcastle have won nothing for more than fifty years. That could soon change of course.

    There is no doubt when the club was at its strongest. Between 1905 and 1911 Newcastle won three league titles and appeared in five FA Cup finals, losing four of them. They were generally regarded as the team to beat in England. Yet nobody from this era makes the final eleven. Bill McCracken picks up 8% of the votes for right-back and there is the odd vote for versatile Colin Veitch but that's it.

    In fact McCracken, more of a central defender really, was not an automatic pick during the glory years. The outstanding players were Andy Aitken, Peter McWilliam and Veitch. When journalist Ivan Sharpe picked his all-time British line-up in 1952, McWilliam and Veitch were included. One might reasonably expect them to make a club team.

    Newcastle claimed only one more league championship, in 1927. There were a couple more FA Cups a few years either side of that, and three more during the 1950s. Plus that Fairs Cup in 1969 that so often got pointed accusingly at Mike Ashley as the club's last silverware.

    Who would be in a more representative eleven? Given and Shearer seem obvious choices, despite goalkeeper Jimmy Lawrence's record 496 appearances for the club during the early twentieth century. Up front Milburn probably edges out Gallacher based on length of service and three FA Cups. Gallacher's 143 goals in 174 matches look impressive, but they came during the highest-scoring period in English football history after the change in offside law.

    Aitken, McWilliam and Veitch have to play. So too Irishman Alf McMichael, widely considered the best left-back in the country during the 1950s. He can be partnered by fellow-countryman David Craig. The pair registered over 800 club appearances between them. The iconic Bob Moncur, Fairs Cup hero, takes his place in central defence, with Peruvian Nobby Solano providing creativity and cover on the right.

    That leaves just one place for a central defender. The best man for the job would be a slightly controversial choice, given his earlier career with rivals Sunderland. Andy McCombie moved from Wearside to Tyneside for a record fee before helping Newcastle win their first two league titles. The Gaelic-speaking McCombie had just 132 outings for Newcastle, but that was only three fewer than Philippe Albert who made the fans' team.

    Retaining the 4-4-2 formation from the original article:

    Given - Craig, McCombie, Moncur, McMichael - Solano, Aitken, Veitch, McWilliam - Milburn, Shearer.
     
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  8. victorcalello38

    Feb 28, 2017
    Club:
    Montevideo Wanderers FC
    Dida
    Dsantos domingos desailly nsantos
    Rijkaard didi
    Garrincha pele gullit
    Eusebio

    Vs

    Yashin
    Vogts baresi moore maldini
    Matthaus beckenbauer Maradona
    Messi distefano cruyff
     
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  9. Gregoriak

    Gregoriak BigSoccer Supporter

    Feb 27, 2002
    Munich
    Belgian League Champions 1980-1989 Best XI

    ..............Vandenbergh.....................Tahamata


    .........Vercauteren........Ceulemans..............Scifo

    ...................................Vandereycken


    ....Baecke........van Tiggelen...............Olsen...........Gerets


    .....................................Preud'homme

    1979-80

    Club Brugge
    Barth - Bastijns, Meeuws, Leekens, Maes - Balint, Vandereycken, Ceulemans, Courant - Verheecke, Sørensen

    1980-81
    RSC Anderlecht
    Munaron - Peruzović, Olsen, Broos, De Groote - Haan, Coeck, Nielsen, Vercauteren - Geurts, Brylle

    1981-82
    Standard de Liège
    Preud'homme - Gerets, Meeuws, Poel, Plessers - Haan, Vandersmissen, Daerden - Tahamata, Wendt, Voordeckers

    1982-83
    Standard de Liège
    Preud'homme - Gerets, Meeuws, Poel, Plessers - Haan, Vandersmissen, Daerden, Delangre - Tahamata, Gründel

    1983-84
    SK Beveren
    De Wilde - Jaspers, Lambrichts, Garot, Baecke - Crève, Schönberger, Theunis, Kusto - Albert, Martens

    1984-85
    RSC Anderlecht
    Munaron - Grün, Olsen, Peruzović, Andersen - Scifo, Frimann, Vandereycken, Vercauteren - Vandenbergh, Czerniatynski

    1985-86
    RSC Anderlecht
    Munaron - Grün, Olsen, Peruzović, Andersen - Scifo, Frimann, Vandereycken, Vercauteren - Vandenbergh, Lozano

    1986-87
    RSC Anderlecht
    Munaron - Grün, van Tiggelen, Demol, Andersen - Scifo, Janssen, Vercauteren, De Groote - Gudjohnsen, Krnčević

    1987-88
    Club Brugge
    Vande Walle - Mamadou, F.van der Elst, Broos, van Wijk - L.van der Elst, Querter, Ceulemans, Crève - Degryse, Brylle

    1988-89
    KV Mechelen
    Preud'homme - Sanders, Emmers, Rutjes, Deferm - Hofkens, E.Koeman, Versavel - Wilmots, Den Boer, Bosman
     
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  10. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    The best XI from 1951' Copa Rio, according to the brazilian newspaper "Mundo Esportivo - SP":

    ----------------------------- Schweda
    -------------------- Bertucelli ------- Clarel -------
    W. Fiume ---------------- Ocwirk ---------------------- Piccininni
    ------------- Bonifaci ------------------- Jair
    Tesourinha ------------- Tomasevich ----------- Aurednick
     
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  11. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    The best XI from 1953' Campeonato Sul-Americano, according to the brazilian newspaper "Mundo Esportivo - SP":

    --------------------------- Bonnard (Ecu)
    ----------- M. Gonzalez (Uru) - Delgado (Per)
    D. Santos (Bra) ----- Leguizamon (Par) ------ Cortez (Chi)
    --------------- Romero (Uru) ---- Romerito (Par)
    Julinho B. (Bra) ------ Fernandez (Par) ------- Pelaez (Uru)

    In the article there is a top 5 for the best players in each position.
     
  12. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    A foreign Best XI made by the brazilian player Waldemar Fiume (Palmeiras - SP) with players that he saw on the field (1955).

    --------------------- Bacigalupo
    --------------- Salomon ---- W. Martinez
    R. Andrade --------- Parola ------------ Pescia
    ----------------- Moreno ---- Labruna
    Basora --- Di Stefano/Pedernera --- E. Garcia

    Honorable mentions: Sastre, Baldonedo, V. Mazzola, Praest, Ocwirk, Schiaffino, Vaca and Viola.
     
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  13. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Corrected link.


    1) Foreign best XI with players that were saw on the field:

    1.1) Gilmar (GK for Corinthians and Santos - SP) 1956.
    ----------------- Carlos Gomes (Por)
    -------------- Hall (Eng) - Byrne (Eng)
    Chiapella (Ita) ---- Ocwirk (Aus) ---- B. Wright (Eng)
    ------------ Gratton (Ita) ---- Haynes (Eng)
    S. Matthews (Eng) -- Taylor (Eng) -- Travassos (Por)

    1.2) Cláudio (RW for Corinthians - SP) 1955.
    --------------------------- Vaca (Arg)
    ------------ Salomon (Arg) --- W. Martinez (Uru)
    R. Andrade (Uru) ---- Perucca (Arg) ---- Ocwirk (Aus)
    ---------------- Sastre (Arg) ---- Moreno (Arg)
    Muñoz (Arg) ------- Kubala (Hun) ------ E. Garcia (Arg)
    Honorable mentions: Bacigalupo, Parola, Pederneira, Rossi, Praest and Schiaffino.

    1.3) Olavo Barbosa "Nena" (CB for Internacional - RS and Portuguesa - SP) 1955.
    --------------------------- Vaca (Arg)
    ------------ Salomon (Arg) --- W. Martinez (Uru)
    Ocwirk (Aus) -- O. Varela (Uru) -- Arico Suarez (Arg)
    ------- Schiaffino (Uru) ---- V. Mazzola
    Basora (Spn) -------- Gabetto (Ita) ------ Praest (Den)
    or
    Muñoz - Moreno - Di Stéfano - Labruna - Loustau (Arg)

    2) Foreign best XI from 1949' Campeonato Sul-Americano, according to the brazilian newspaper "Mundo Esportivo - SP":
    --------------------------- Garcia (Par)
    ----------------- Acha (Bol) ---- Cespedes (Par)
    Rivero (Ecu) ---------- Nardelli (Par) --------- Cantero (Par)
    ---------------- Castillo (Per) ---- G. Sanchez (Per)
    Fernandez (Par) ------ D. Arce (Par) ------- Pedraza (Per)
     
  14. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    Great find of the Copa Rio 1951 or Club World Championship.
    There were two more editions at 1952 and 1953.
     
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  15. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I've found the ranking for the best players at the 1952' Copa Rio too (Mundo Esportivo - SP):
    GK - Gilmar / Castillo
    RFB - Murilo
    LFB - Pinheiro
    RH - Jair
    CH - Ocwirk
    LH - Roberto
    RW - Cláudio
    IR - Orlando
    CF - Baltazar
    IL - Didi / Stojaspal / Travassos
    LW - Aurednik
     
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  16. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Interesting how much appreciation/exposure Ocwirk had in South America.
     
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  17. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    #1467 ManiacButcher, Apr 15, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2022
    From what I read, the brazilian press always praised a technical football, based on dribbles (Zizinho, Pelé, Garrincha, Ademir...) and organized distribution (good vision and passing game - Fausto, Bauer, Danilo, Tim, Jair, Didi...). I think that's why Ocwirk, the yugoslavian generation (leaded by Mitic) and River Plate's La Maquina gets that kind of higher praise.
    English football from the mid 50s and 60s is criticized because they say is focused more on speed and strenght, an ugly kind of football. From what I read from the 66's WC, the english nt played a horrible football (Argentina should have eliminated them if Rattin was not sent off and their goal was offside). And the violence suffered by Pelé (from Bulgaria mainly and Portugal) left an even worse impression on the brazilian press from Rio and São Paulo.
    Just to clarify, the english NT from 1950 WC left a good impression. B. Wright and T. Finney were always highly praised.
     
  18. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    The best XI from 1942' Campeonato Sul-Americano, according to the brazilian newspaper "O Globo Sportivo - RJ":

    --------------------------- Gualco (Arg)
    ----------- D. da Guia (Bra) - A. Muniz (Uru)
    Affonsinho (Bra) ----- O. Varela (Uru) ------ Dino (Bra)
    --------------- Pedernera (Arg) ---- Moreno (Arg)/Tim (Bra)
    M. Barrios (Par) ------ Laferrara (Arg) ------- E. Garcia (Arg)

    Honorable mentions: Honores, Livingstone, Alberti e S. Varela.

    The best XI from 1945' Campeonato Sul-Americano, according to the south american press in Chile (Source: "O Globo Sportivo - RJ"):

    --------------------------- Livingstone (Chi)
    ----------- D. da Guia (Bra) - F. Barrera (Chi)
    C. Sosa (Arg) ----- A. Perucca (Arg) ------ Jayme (Bra)
    --------------- N. Mendez (Arg) ---- R. Martino (Arg)/Jair (Bra)
    Tesourinha (Bra) ------ Heleno (Bra) ------- F. Loustau (Arg)/Ademir (Bra)
     
  19. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Complementing what I said before, here is the article called "Dishonest referee gives the victory to England".
    The english NT is classified as anti-football, simple, lacking imagination and disloyal. Some heavy handed criticism but there's some truth there because the unusual game made the brazilian press even forget the usual rivalry against Argentina (even called argentina's posture as "brave").
     
  20. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Foreign best XI from 1956' Campeonato Sul-Americano, according to Roberto Belangero (Corinthians - SP and a starter for Brazil at the tournament). Source: "Mundo Esportivo - SP":
    --------------------------- J. Musimessi (Arg)
    ----------------- G. Delgado (Per) ---- F. Vairo (Arg)
    R. Andrade (Uru) ---------- E. Mourino (Arg) --------- R. Cortez (Chi)
    ---------------- E. Hormazabal (Chi) ---- A. Labruna (Arg)
    L. Pentrelli (Arg) ------ R. Castillo (Per) ------- E. Cucchiaroni (Arg)
     
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  21. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I don't say it's completely incorrect, but maybe this could be a bit misleading for people not viewing the 1966 WC footage, because it could seem like England played extreme hoofball or were committing many many fouls etc I suppose, and I wouldn't say that was the case exactly, and they weren't overly defensive, even though playing by the standards of the time quite a conservative system without true wingers for most of the tournament (similar to a diamond system I'd say). This is Bobby Moore playing as a ball-playing centre back in the Final for example:
    Bobby Moore vs Germany 1966 - YouTube
    And interestingly in the Placar poll in 1981, 2 of Ocwirk's 5 votes for best XI of all-time came from English voters!
    Placar greatest footballers (1981 & 1999) | BigSoccer Forum
    He was highly regarded by the English press at the time, who called him 'Clockwork Ocwirk' I think (and RoyoftheRovers used to have good words to say about him when he posted on the forum I remember too), but at the same time it is fair to say that English football tended to be more direct and Ocwirk played a more cultured/patient game I think. This game is relevant I think too
    Pathe News Special - England V Austria (1951) - YouTube
    And for example it was widely remarked that the Englishman who went to coach in Hungary and influenced the style of the Magic Magyars had been shunned a bit in England because of not favouring direct football but more of a passing game (or something like that), so your comments are not without any basis for sure (and yeah notable that Finney and Wright made the good impression in 1950, despite the early exit - interestingly though between Wright and Moore, Wright, although equally likeable perhaps as a person, was said to play more long balls and less constructive passes I think and his team Wolverhampton Wanderers in general played quite direct in contrast to West Ham of Bobby Moore in the 60s).
     
  22. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    World all-time best XI, according to Alfredo Di Stefano (made in 1960). Source: Revista do Esporte - RJ:
    --------------------------- Cozzi (Arg)
    Sosa (Arg) ---------- B. Wright (Eng) --------- N. Santos (Bra)
    ----------------- Bozsik (Hun) ---- N. Rossi (Arg)
    ---------------- Moreno (Arg) ---- L. Suarez (Spn)
    Finney (Eng) ------ A. Erico (Par) ------- Loustau (Arg)

    World best XI of the year (probably 1960 - Il Calcio e Il Ciclismo), according to the Italian Press. Source: Revista do Esporte - RJ (Published in 1961)
    --------------------------- Yashin (Rus)
    Durkovich (Yug) ---------- W. Martinez (Uru) --------- Szymaniak (Ger)
    ----------------------- Sipos (Hun) ---- Benitez (Per)
    ----------------- L. Suarez (Spn) ---- Pelé (Bra)
    Hamrin (Swe) ------------- Seeler (Ger) ------------- Charlton (Eng)
     
  23. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Odd (and unusually good) World all-time best XI, elected by Daily Mirror (Eng) readers. Source: Jornal dos Sports - RJ (feb/1970)

    --------------------------------- Gilmar (Bra)
    D. Santos (Bra) ---------- J. Charles (Wal) --------- G. Facchetti (Ger)
    ---------------- D. Mackay (Sco) ---- D. Blanchflower (NI)
    ----------------- Di Stefano (Arg) -------- Pelé (Bra)
    Garrincha (Bra) ------------- J. Greaves (Eng) ------------- Gento (Spn)
     
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  24. ManiacButcher

    ManiacButcher Member

    Palmeiras
    Argentina
    May 23, 2004
    Brasil
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Brazil all-time best XI, elected by Manchete Esportiva - RJ readers (1958).

    -------------------------- Castilho
    D. Santos ---------- D. da Guia --------- N. Santos
    -------------------- Bauer ---- Danilo
    ----------------- Zizinho -------- Jair
    Garrincha ---------- Leônidas ------------ Ademir

    some notes: A highlight to the number of votes (made by letters to the newspaper headquarters). And as expected, a brutal dominance of "Carioca" players. Only Djalma and Bauer never player in Rio (Flamengo, Vasco, Fluminense or Botafogo).
     
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  25. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    Most voted in his role, until 1958:
    N.Santos - 7985
    Zizinho - 7654
    Ademir - 7089
    Less voted in his role:
    D.Santos - 5049
    Jair - 5678
    Danilo - 5784
     

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