The All-Encompassing Pro/Rel Thread on Soccer in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by bigredfutbol, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. aleaguer

    aleaguer Member

    Feb 17, 2000
    Wichita, KS USA
    and in however many years it was that byu did that, not one other school followed them.
     
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  2. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I mean technically a metro area of 700,000 people could fill a 20,000 seat stadium. Burnley, Blackburn and Accrington share a metro area of 370,000. But it probably wouldn't be a big revenue generator in today's soccer market. Eventually we'll see.
     
  3. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    If this is true, then they wouldn’t stay up. That’s honestly not that hard to grasp, either.
     
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  4. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    A media deal like any of the other major sports would render that irrelevant anyway
     
  5. Chesco United

    Chesco United Member+

    DC United
    Jun 24, 2001
    Chester County, PA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    At least we sometimes have the Lamar Hunt US Open Cup for romantics like me.I still remember Rochester (NY) Raging Rhinos (RIP) winning the cup in 1999, and Charleston (SC) Battery [still around] making the final against my DC United in 2008.
     
  6. Chesco United

    Chesco United Member+

    DC United
    Jun 24, 2001
    Chester County, PA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Green Bay (WI) Packers have survived a century in the NFL in a tiny market. They were grandfathered in, playing under business structures more similar are They've won the old NFL Championship multiple times, and 4 Super Bowls. They were forced to play two regular season games a season in the much larger Milwaukee from 1933 to 1994. People still have tickets from 2 games a season from the Milwaukee era. Season tickets have about 35 year waiting period before getting them.
     
  7. Abe Lenstra Stadion - sc Heerenveen
    Plaats:
    Heerenveen, Nederland
    Coördinaten:52° ′ NB, 5° ′ OL
    Capaciteit:26100
    built in 1994

    City of Heerenveen In 2020 29505 citizensWikipedia (NL)
     
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  8. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think Des Moines is a template for how USL should expand. Bring the city on board, then find the owners.
     
  9. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    They were the small team that survived.

    NFL 1930 Attendances
    Screenshot_20211018-212443_Chrome.jpg
     
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  10. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Packers don't really have a tiny market. Their market is the state of Wisconsin. If they relied only on the support of the population of the Green Bay metro area, they would not have survived.

    Playing those games in Milwaukee served the dual purpose of expanding their appeal across the state as well as convincing the NFL not to put another team there.
     
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  11. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    That’s Spokane, Kyle Krause owns the Menace and is behind everything happening in Des Moines.
     
  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  13. HailtotheKing

    HailtotheKing Member+

    San Antonio FC
    United States
    Dec 1, 2008
    TEXAS
    Club:
    San Antonio Scorpions FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Except of course pro/rel based on the results of the sporting competition doesn't prevent this .... unless of course you can show me a pro/rel top division of any significance where the top metro areas are not dominating/concentrated there

    I'll wait ...
     
  14. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Not entirely accurate. It's not uncommon for some teams to play in higher divisions in some of the lower-profile sports. Men's hockey is probably the most notable of these sports with D2 schools like St. Cloud State being national D1 powerhouses in men's hockey. I've also seen some D2 schools play D1 in men's and women's lacrosse.

    All of these are contingent on a conference allowing an affiliate member (like in lacrosse) or forming a sport-specific conference like they have in hockey.

    Pro/rel is dumb at any level and would be even more idiotic at the college level.
     
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  15. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    I noted the exception that allows lower division teams to play up in Division I in a single sport. I even cited hockey and lacrosse as the main examples.
     
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  16. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Green Bay actually played 3 home games (sometimes 4) most seasons in Milwaukee from 1952 to 1994.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Bay_Packers_home_games_in_Milwaukee
     
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  17. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    My mistake
     
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  18. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    The college conferences aren't strictly for athletic purposes, as well (although they obviously started that way). There are all sorts of other academic and administrative associations that exist within these conferences, too.

    But I agree that college athletics doesn't suit pro/rel very well.
     
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  19. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Yeah, that’s very odd. It’s not like some tightly held secret.

    “Krause +, the real estate arm of the group that owns the Kum & Go convenience store chain, plans a $540 million professional soccer stadium and entertainment district there, and the city recently received preliminary approval for $23.5 in state tax incentives to support the project”

    https://www.desmoinesregister.com/s...arts-july-epa-city-council-krause/7995154002/
     
  20. HailtotheKing

    HailtotheKing Member+

    San Antonio FC
    United States
    Dec 1, 2008
    TEXAS
    Club:
    San Antonio Scorpions FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Cool story
    College Station TX has 110k residents and Kyle Field seats 102K
     
  21. Potowmack

    Potowmack Member+

    Apr 2, 2010
    Washington, DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To be fair, college sports, especially football, don't primarily draw fans from the college town itself. I ran into people from all over the country at Michigan football games.
     
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  22. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Been banging this drum for a while so I'll take the challenge. I actually wouldn't have pro/rel between the divisions. There are genuine cultural differences between D1 D2 and D3 so I think it's best if the schools themselves determine where they fit best.

    Where I think pro/rel could work is within the divisions at least D1. Keep the conferences regional but have 2 or three tiers within each region and promote from there. The tiers essentially already exist in Football with the Power 5 and group of 5 divide. So for instance the winner of the Mountain West promotes to the Pac-12 and last place in the Pac-12 drops to the mountain West.

    Think this system would work and actually help with the conference realignments which are slowly ripping the soul out of college football. Not that I am biased :rolleyes:(one guess on which program has dominated the Mountain West but is in danger of being conference less in the near future).
     
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  23. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Wyoming fills it's stadium to the brim the Stadium is basically (give or take 1,000 people) the 3rd largest city in Wyoming. That's just the stadium. I think Nebraska is in a similar situation and a few others are close.
     
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  24. When we (in Europe) talk about soccer as a cutural heritage thing it would be a good thing to incorporate certain values in soccer:
     
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  25. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Looks like they rely on visiting fans to fill the stadium.

    The rainbow flag is proudly waved at every MLS stadium that allows flags (ironically Yankee Stadium doesn't).

    Screenshot_20211020-114527_Chrome.jpg
     
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