Brener selling and re-brand?

Discussion in 'Houston Dynamo' started by slycat, Sep 9, 2020.

  1. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    my guess is what is keeping ramos employed right now is his family situation.
     
  2. quiznatodd_bidness

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Apr 14, 2020
    Idk about CoS guy but they’ve been pretty adamant for weeks that they want Jordan gone.
     
  3. AcetheTigah

    AcetheTigah Member+

    Apr 6, 2005
    Woodlands, TX
    Reading all the bullshat in the exit statement - Jordan claimed credit for alot of things besides the Western Conference final and the Lamar Hunt cup what lasting good did he really do?
     
  4. AcetheTigah

    AcetheTigah Member+

    Apr 6, 2005
    Woodlands, TX
    well if we keep on spiraling down we may get the first draft choice...

    or have we already traded that away in some other stupendous Jordan deal!
     
  5. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #455 juvechelsea, Aug 30, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2021
    a structural issue i see that needs addressing is the HC/GM split

    (1) does that continue, as some HC candidates would want personnel control (and depending who i might be inclined to give it)
    (2) if HC and GM are separate are they equals or does HC report to GM

    i bring up the first bit because franchise history. i am not sold it's necessary.

    i bring up the second bit because i felt like jordan used a series of coaches as cushioning for his fall, a layer of insulation from accountability. like, coaching is the problem, we hired the wrong guy, my bad, keep me, i will do better next time. and i realize payroll for coaching comes in here as well but he picked that series of duds as well.

    also, i felt like the HC and GM were competing power centers with their own team ideas and personnel choices rather than hand in glove. when kinnear picked someone you knew he was trying to fit a scheme. very rarely did they not fit the scheme at all (koke). usually if we had an issue it was more quality control, player wasn't as good as scouted/advertised. by the time it got to "jordan plus one" it was a freaking mess. kids and signings coming in who never see the field. and/or the coach waits weeks or months to play someone almost like, i didn't ask for this guy.

    this has not felt like it was a steady building project towards a scheme in years. to me the GM -- if we bother, and i am not sold it's necessary -- should be the coach's equal and hand in glove. what kinds of players do you want for your scheme? who is expendable around here? ok, let me mess with the roster and get what you want. way it's been for several years, yeah, i know it's a short payroll, but the coach and GM didn't even seem on a page how to spend that little bit. which is deadly. so you have DPs on the bench, players here who rarely see a minute then leave, inefficiencies we can't afford. then the GM is your boss and can use your corpse as a cushion in the event of a crash landing.

    and fwiw it's like how the heck is waibel the rising GM that has never been here.

    anyhow, i bring this up in part because while ramos might be briefly immune for family reasons, another reason to stagger departures is that if we have a GM they get hired then hire the HC -- if we go hierarchical. i think jordan's tenure points out a downside to a "report" situation. i personally think it should be a unified job again, or someone brought in almost like an assistant as part of a team. this is x's personnel guy. there have been a few too many bravo/smith/parejas where at times the split seems to result in competing egos who each want credit at the other's expense, even if it goes well at each other's throats. if you have a split the GM needs to be part of a team. HC, his assistants, fitness guy, personnel guy. seamless, on one page.

    that, and the 433, etc., there needs to be more money and then a ground up rethink of "identity" and how to go about this whole thing. what we are doing doesn't work.
     
  6. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    #456 juvechelsea, Aug 30, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2021
    i was amused he called it a "championship."

    fwiw that this got "bought" speaks to the absentee, non-soccer landlord problem. you need owners and brass awake enough they grasp what certain metrics or awards mean. so either the owners were complicit in overblowing the cup for sales purposes, or sufficiently absent and oblivious they thought what we did was a big deal. i've seen so little soccer savvy displayed i am more inclined to believe soccer got delegated to jordan, elevated above the coach, and then jordan got to explain how the year went. and so he would shift around the goalposts about what we accomplished for a bit, but then we quit accomplishing anything and USOC got pandemic'd. you're then the GM of a bad bad team with nowhere to hide.

    i kind of don't believe, for example, a british owner could be fooled by, say, early round FA Cup success, winning Carabao Cup, playing in the qualifying rounds of Champions League and losing. it takes owners who don't care much, don't want to spend much, and don't know much.
     
  7. *rey*

    *rey* Member+

    Feb 22, 2006
    Houston
    weeks, you say? YIKES!

    the current situation was years in the making and they doubled-down years ago that Jordan was a master schemer and had the team headed in the right direction.

    none of those guys get to say “I told you so”.
     
  8. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    what they did was some combination of get sold that USOC was awesome, or buy into the idea they could market it like it was. they acted like HC and GM had 2 good years when they really had 1 decent year, ended abruptly and definitively by seattle, followed by the house of cards collapsing, hidden behind a tournament cup run that took place all at home and for the most part -- until the end -- as a B team contest. as cups generally do.

    and apparently jordan sold that the coach messed up the secret sauce when we started to suck, not that we were in steep overall decline from one lucky season, saved himself

    to me if we do separate HC and GM and have HC report to GM, tenure beyond the coach should come from extended success. otherwise on no planet should 1 year of playoffs since like 2014 keep your job.

    i can't quite decide if they conspired all the way to the top o pretend the cup mattered or were just too stupid to know better. a lot of the damage, to me, was we acted like 2018 was positive and not the thing running aground and we lucked into a trophy. cause the vibe we gave off was like 2017 playoffs 2018 USOC 2019 CCL when that was steady erosion and then ramos just made this worse.

    i say this because it is important on a basic level for the organization to grasp what "good" or "bad" looks like in sports terms, independent of marketing bullcrap. independent of the payroll problem, it is dangerous to think that lucky playoff run from a low seed, or USOC, or CCL, was anything like what seattle has.

    and on the business side, dear god did he suck at transfers. if they are greed obsessed how did elis or manotas not end this all?
     
  9. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Say it so the fans in the upper deck can hear ya Ace! Matt Jordan and Front Office suits do not ever "win" anything, this is always done by the players and lead by a coaching staff. Any GM should take pride in the success during their tenure but Jordan is the leftovers of Canetti and his complete downward collapse of our club when they both were given the control by our older owners in 2012.

    Um, the Open Cup trophy was started way back in 1913 and specifically modeled after the F.A. Cup in intent to create a nation wide National Championship. The fact that even soccer players and fans did not even hear of the Cup for decades is due to the USSF marketing department not being able to sell water in the dessert. Juve, don't be dense.

    It does need to be put into perspective in that making a run in the F.A. Cup is indeed a big deal depending on the wage bill the club is under. For Man City, they SHOULD win the Carabao Cup right. But for Burnley, if they win that it is indeed a very serious feather in their club's cap.
     
  10. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    i just can't imagine you can bs AEG the same about soccer as brener and delahoya

    how much money did i make

    how did we do, matt, explain to me how the season went

    you can't fool mark cuban how the mavericks played

    this is closer to the texans and their emerging obsession with "character guys"
     
  11. Borrachin

    Borrachin Member+

    Feb 28, 2006
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Segal is interested in building the academy they need to hire a top dog from the FC Dallas academy so he can come over here and fix the crap we have. Whatever they are doing up there works and no reason why it can’t work here, we have just as much talent.
     
  12. nbrooks503

    nbrooks503 Previously Held @Dynamo Hostage From 2008-2019

    Jun 1, 2008
    Disgruntled Former STH - Fairweather Bandwaggoner
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Too stupid to know better would be my guess.

    USOC was a one off and it is significant in that the club did not make the playoffs. Put all of you effort into the USOC because you know you're not going to make the playoffs and every other team will use their reserve players.
     
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  13. ElNaranja

    ElNaranja Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Jul 16, 2017
    Hell it's tempting to get the band together again for a long podcast episode just on this firing.
     
  14. Westside Cosmo

    Westside Cosmo Member+

    Oct 4, 2007
    H-Town
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The stadium ops VP is leaving. Sounds voluntary although this is end of month and not a Friday so who knows. I haven’t been enough last few years to make a judgment, though I always thought the concessions and ops suffered more from lack of investment by owners and cheaply staffing

     
  15. DonJuego

    DonJuego Member+

    Aug 19, 2005
    Austin, TX
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It is often overlooked that the Dynamo USOC run was aided by winning every single site selection coin flip placing all games played in BBVA.
     
  16. nate19

    nate19 Member

    Mar 30, 2014
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    The dominoes have begun to fall. Soon, renowned Rennaissance men Westie and Juve will be named head of business operations and general manager, respectively, and return the Dynamo to the top of MLS. Concessions product quality and response time will be best in class. Brian Perk, the most-talked-about player in Dynamo lore, will finally suit up for the team. Nigel may return from exile. All wrongs in the Dynamo Universe will be righted.
     
  17. nbrooks503

    nbrooks503 Previously Held @Dynamo Hostage From 2008-2019

    Jun 1, 2008
    Disgruntled Former STH - Fairweather Bandwaggoner
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was thinking more of Segal financing my trip to England to recruit FO types from the Championship. Two months would probably work, first class airfare, expense account to wine and dine prospects, 5* hotels. That should do it.
     
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  18. quiznatodd_bidness

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Apr 14, 2020
    Also the first round opponent was a literal semi pro team.
     
  19. CeltTexan

    CeltTexan Member+

    Sep 21, 2000
    Houston, TX USA
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Recall the "we are just renters' answers years ago, so did our club purchase the rights to run BBVA 365 or just on Dynamo and Dash nights? The C of H still owns the building so this man leaving is a move outside of the club front office then right???

    Correct.

    This is the nature of these Open tournaments as witnessed the world over. For generations. Where a local Pub team sponsored by Chico's Bail Bonds can qualify and eventually end up playing a First Division team of professionals. So when the pro team draws this type of team they still have to go play the 90 minutes in a sport that is very defensive, thus the chance of upsets is always alive and well. Very cool to witness imho.
    In short what our Houston Dynamo players did in that USOC run to a trophy is beating whoever the draw from the USSF put our team up against. Recall the old Scottish oil man soccer saying, "I can only piss with the cock I got!"
     
  20. quiznatodd_bidness

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Apr 14, 2020
    Hey I like that aspect of the tournament as well and happy for those guys that they got to have that experience. My comment was more to add on to the “every game was at home” part. I’m glad to have teams like that have opportunities.
     
  21. newtex

    newtex Member+

    May 25, 2005
    Houston
    Club:
    Houston Dynamo
    https://www.houstondynamofc.com/news/ted-segal-discusses-next-step-for-dynamo-with-glenn-davis

    Link to the Audio: https://www.espn975.com/soccer-matters/

    Segal talks about the criteria for Jordan's replacement and the possibility of redefining roles with the organization.

    As far as player budgets:

     
  22. ElNaranja

    ElNaranja Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Jul 16, 2017
    It's the right sentiment and statement, just incredibly late
     
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  23. quiznatodd_bidness

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Apr 14, 2020
    He’s been here for barely two months
     
  24. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Did you just throw a Bad News Bears (original) out there?
     
  25. Ethos

    Ethos Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    Apr 28, 2019
    Houston
    Look, Segal has had an incredibly short time at the helm, but so far he's looking legit. I say give the man a chance.
     
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