Post-match: US v. Canada GC group stage

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Reccossu, Jul 18, 2021.

  1. dams

    dams Member+

    United States
    Dec 22, 2018
    #751 dams, Jul 22, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2021
    Hoppe needs to be tried at the 9 before the tournament ends to see where he stands. This where we are thin, where he plays at club, and where he scored his B1 goals. He has been playing pretty deep in the limited minutes he has seen, at times he is almost playing as a shuttler. Dude is a poacher, not a midfielder. Personally, I don't see Hoppe beating out any of our wingers on the A team. Gregg has been talking him up a bit but he hasn't been playing him, and the proof is in the pudding. We'll see how much time he gets from here on out and I'm pretty skeptical GGG is going to roll him out as a striker.
     
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  2. RefIADad

    RefIADad Member+

    United States
    Aug 18, 2017
    Des Moines, IA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Probably the more correct statement.
     
  3. VictoryWePredict4Thee

    VictoryWePredict4Thee BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 4, 2019
    No way should use a straight B team for any game until we are qualified. Can you rest some guys here and there, sure. But to put out a full B squad? No way.
     
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  4. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    He is not the second coming, no doubt. But in the Sarachan era, he was one of the few US midfielders who could receive a ball under pressure, turn, and do something productive sometimes.
     
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  5. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #755 TheHoustonHoyaFan, Jul 22, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2021
    Folks should watch Green play for club. It is clear that you have not watched. Green for Furth is neither slow, weak, nor plays second forward. He is one of their controlling midfielder so handles the ball under pressure and passes at 85%. He had 9Gs and 2As in 28 2BL starts last season, so about a G every 3 matches as a LCM. He also tackles and intercepts at a slightly higher rate than Lletget, 2.1 to 1.7 per match.

    Other than that you were spot on. :rolleyes:
     
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  6. theboogeyman

    theboogeyman Member+

    Jun 21, 2010
    I completely agree about wanting to see Hoppe as a center forward, but I think he’s done really well in that wing/shuttler role. He’s a lot more versatile than he was able to show at Schalke.
     
  7. Calling BS

    Calling BS Member+

    Orlando City
    United States
    Jan 25, 2020
    To me you have one of three choices. Run your A side into the ground playing 3 games in a short window. Play hybrid A/B team squads. Or play the A team twice and run out a B team once.
     
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  8. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    I'm not sure you can plan it out completely or have to choose. You can start with the A squad, but maybe you are up 4-0 at half and can rotate out everyone to play minutes in another game. Conversely, maybe they are in a super concacaf slog and are too bruised and exhausted to play much even 6 days later.

    It is hard to get a fix on what Berhalter was thinking because the Mexico game went over. But McKennie basically played that whole game and the whole game against Honduras and didn't look unable to go against CR. So, it might not be A vs B, but this player can go 240', this one 180', etc. At that point, I think you maximize things to get points at home. But then do you target what you think is the easier road game, or hope the rotated squad can get the job done.

    Using the first window, I think you try for 3 points against El Salvador, then do what you can against Honduras.
     
  9. rgli13

    rgli13 Member+

    Mar 23, 2005
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    you can rotate 3-4 players in each match and keep everyone on 2 starts. playing all the backups at one is a terrible idea.
     
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  10. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    In a 4-3-3 with one DM and two CMs, Green plays the LCM. He's also played the DM a couple of times, but he looked more limited there.

    When they've played a more defensive flat midfield in a 4-3-3 (away games against strong rivals), Green has been the enganche guy, playing behind the forwards and right in front of the 3 CMs.

    When they've played a standard 4-2-3-1, Green has not started.
     
  11. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    And you can alter the plan for each window based on the opponents. In some cases, A/B/A might make sense, and in some it's going to be hybrid approach.

    Since Berhalter has already signalled he's bringing more than 23 to camp ... option (a) doesn't seem to be on the table at all.
     
  12. juvechelsea

    juvechelsea Member+

    Feb 15, 2006
    random? you're going with random? you're implying our consistency says something?

    when they beat us in both 2015 and 2019 worlds, aggregate 4-0, your theory lacks something or other. you're right, i should instead look at the roller coaster and not how our games went. "oh, but they didn't qualify in between winning it all and finishing same round we did." did you look up how their 2017 team went? they were 3-1-2. europe has 8 slots.

    i think our consistency says we should dominate the region, as that is a controlled situation. i think we have not done so well at worlds that any given team should be taken as foreshadowing something. i like this generation but "golden" hasn't been earned yet.
     
  13. Calling BS

    Calling BS Member+

    Orlando City
    United States
    Jan 25, 2020
    There’s plenty of ways to prioritize the games. I’m with you; I would make sure we get the three points at home. I think it’s much easier to defend away (get ties on the road) than have to attack at home ( get the three points) with a B team. Sands has made this much more interesting. The B team could play hybrid 3/5-4-3 and give TA a rest.

    I think you need to go in having a plan and then make adjustments as things pop up. Of course things can always go sideways, but I think having a good starting point is important.
     
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  14. Calling BS

    Calling BS Member+

    Orlando City
    United States
    Jan 25, 2020
    That’ll give you the hybrid option.

    Just to give you an idea a starting 11 of back-up would look like this:

    ——-Aaronson——-Dike———Weah
    ARob——-Musah——-Acosta——-Reynolds
    ——-Richards——Sands——Miazga
    ———————-Horvath

    Is that a terrible idea?
    The Subs would come from GC and Euro fringe players.
     
  15. Calling BS

    Calling BS Member+

    Orlando City
    United States
    Jan 25, 2020
    This would probably be the best route. When there’s a window with a must win, must use A team game (Mexico @ home) you’d want to use the A/B/A plan. When you have a window where you wouldn’t need to have your strongest A team roster possible, you could run out the hybrids and take all the points. This upcoming game against Jamaica against our B/C hybrid team will give us a barometer how difficult getting points against Jamaica will be.
     
  16. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    If we could count on health, our B team could be pretty impressive.

    But if we add Richards, Musah, and a couple others to Morris, Long, maybe some B/C teamers like Zimmerman, etc...

    Then yeah, it drops a bit. Still, let's just take everyone who is hurt. You could still roll out a B team with an attack of Sargent, Aaronson and Weah. That is not a shabby B team. Defense and GK are pretty good too. It's the midfield that may need some work, though...
     
  17. Calling BS

    Calling BS Member+

    Orlando City
    United States
    Jan 25, 2020
    I think GB has Sargent as his A team forward. That’s why I put Dike in there. I think Pefok is an A team sub, and could be the B team starter with Dike coming in as a sub.
    Switching to a 3-4-3 helps with the lack of central mids. You have three CBs, two wingbacks (FBs), 2 mids, 2 wingers, and a CF.
     
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  18. LivingStone

    LivingStone Member

    Barca
    United States
    May 21, 2019
    How is he a poacher? Only 1 of his 6 goals was a poach. Reyna's goal in NL was a poach. Please let us know.
    I agree with you on the winger part unless CP plays in the mid. Zardes is tough to watch and while i love Dike up top and have pushed/rooted/cheered for him, in Gold cup his touch and play have been brutal. I don't think we will ever see Hoppe at the 9 any time soon though...sadly.
     
  19. VictoryWePredict4Thee

    VictoryWePredict4Thee BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 4, 2019
    There is only one way to do it. Play your A squad, you can sub certain guys in for games and rest a couple of players possibly for certain games. Just like every US team always does. There is no playing the B squad for a game. Imagine if Berhalter did that and we lost. People would lose it.
     
  20. VictoryWePredict4Thee

    VictoryWePredict4Thee BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 4, 2019
    I stay start Dike at the 9, Hoppe and Gioachinni on the wings.
     
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  21. Calling BS

    Calling BS Member+

    Orlando City
    United States
    Jan 25, 2020
    So You’re picking the hybrid model.

    No good coach gives a shit if the fan base would lose it over a lose. The coaches look at the fans like the crazy, clueless parents on the sidelines during youth matches. They are not going to dictate a well thought out plan.
     
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  22. Craig P

    Craig P BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 26, 1999
    Eastern MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's fine when the must-win is the first or third game, but I'd argue that in the first window, the most important game is the second (at home against Canada bracketed by two away games).
     
  23. ifsteve

    ifsteve Member+

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jul 7, 2013
    MS and ID
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ....and I would suggest that the first game is the most important. Start out with points on the road. Set the tone. Don't start in a hole.
     
  24. Craig P

    Craig P BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 26, 1999
    Eastern MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If I remember right, that first "road" game will be in the U.S. So, no question it's a great opportunity to get off on the right foot, and I think I'd be concerned with anything less than a draw. But... it's against El Salvador. I'd expect to see our strongest squad in that window in the home against Canada. Out of the three in that window, Canada is where I worry about the potential to drop points we can't afford to drop.
     
  25. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Nope, FIFA has said it can't be in the US. Maybe somewhere neutral but seems likely to be in El Salvador with no fans or only vaccinated fans.
     
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