PL: Brighton vs Liverpool - 1230pm Nov 28 [R]

Discussion in 'Liverpool' started by SamScouse, Nov 26, 2020.

  1. delaynomo

    delaynomo Member+

    Jun 1, 2015
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    It's not the same principle because high challenges and slide tackles are different beasts with their own sets of additional considerations ......
     
  2. delaynomo

    delaynomo Member+

    Jun 1, 2015
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Does that matter?

    He got to the ball first and moved it.

    Is he not allowed to do that???
     
  3. delaynomo

    delaynomo Member+

    Jun 1, 2015
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    It works great in rugby so there's no reason it can't work for football.

    Just needs to improved.
     
  4. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Yes, bad challenge.
    But the guy had an AWFUL injury record before he got here - on average he's been unavailable 1/3 of every season. It's continuing now.
     
  5. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Keita has underwhelmed while here - but whenever he's played he is ALWAYS being proactive. He is ALWAYS trying to influence play. He is ALWAYS putting himself in the action. You can see how his combination of skill and physical attributes can be beneficial to our squad - and be upset that his body has not been capable of withstanding the demands of our games.

    Taki, on the other hand, seems to be passive. Feels like he's happy to be here but is unsure of himself and is willing to hide. I don't see anything in his game, in either his physical attributes or skill level, that makes me think he's got what it will take to be a success here.
     
    burning247 and bayern is god repped this.
  6. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    #181 zaqualung, Nov 30, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2020
    I know. He tapped it down toward the floor. This was one of about four things he could have done - NONE of which IMO would have brought, trapped or dragged that ball any nearer to him. (High, backwards and sideways away are the other three things.) Control was an impossibility given the length of Welbeck's leg and the fact that he is not Maradona. Even Maradona couldn't have foot willed that ball into the sphere of control where Welbeck was standing. My point is simply that he changed direction to try to get a touch on the ball. Fine. He got his touch. That's the game. Go for the ball. But that doesn't make it a foul by Robertson, unless they are applying different foul tackle rules in the box and outside it. Both he and Robertson have exactly the same right to get a touch on the ball. I'm sure we agree on that??

    For the hell of it, let's say a player goes insane in a game and throws his head groundward and gets a bad face-kick - is that a foul by the kicker, or something else? In this case, an incidence of madness??? Dangerous/reckless play with the head? It can't be the kicker's fault, surely??

    Back to reality - Serious question. If I am running with the ball and you slide into my direct line and block my foot with yours, stopping me from kicking (continuing to dribble, for better expression of the problem) and I kick your foot while I am trying to make the next touch of my dribble - have I just fouled you? Even after I fall over???

    Because that's bizarrely what you are saying here? Nobody seems to want to analyze it correctly.

    Robertson has control of the situation re the ball. Welbeck does not. Wellbeck changes direction and adjusts a foot as far as he can into that space to try to touch the ball. He's bound to get kicked - just as a sliding tackle player is quite likely to get kicked or stud-stood on when he is fouling the running player in possession.

    What is different about the two scenarios? I don't get it. Surely, in the first instance to foul someone you have to cause it? Welbeck caused that. Entirely - 100%
     
  7. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    well, good news is, we're almost 1/3 of the way in!
    ;)
     
  8. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    I've never seen them written down - have you?
     
  9. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Of course he is. But he will be kicked by doing that, it's bleedin' obvious, or it should be to a referee - just as the insane guy I posited in my other reply will get kicked in the head. It's part of a ref's responsibility to evaluate the cause of any collision on the field. Here's it quite obviously Welbeck. I'm fairly certain that I could go to a game next weekend and get myself kicked in the foot if you bet me 10 Grand that I couldn't.....

    I'd be willing to agree with your argument about this if Welbeck were following a fairly natural running and tackling course toward Robertson and the trajectory of the ball, where Robbo could be expected to see a need to adjust, but in this case the ref is just being ridiculous....
    Robertson has to go for that ball and that involves claiming that space, then Welbeck interferes his oddly placed foot into that trajectory. Absolutely not a foul. What was Robertson supposed to do - blow at the ball?

    My view is that Welbeck fouled Robertson.
     
  10. Samarkand

    Samarkand Member+

    May 28, 2001
    Supposedly a truism of the game pre-VAR, that referees’ decisions equaled themselves out over the course of a season. If the same is true of VAR, every decision from now until the end of the season goes our way, right?

    And knowing our luck, they’ll all come in one game, away to United, where we get 2 VAR penalties, 3 VAR goals and United have 3 penalties and 2 goals chalked off. Liverpool for the 7-2 win, then.
     
    soccershaggy repped this.
  11. burning247

    burning247 Member+

    Liverpool FC
    England
    Sep 16, 2000
    Dallas
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    That would make all this nonsense worth it, if I'm being honest :D
     
    delaynomo and Samarkand repped this.
  12. delaynomo

    delaynomo Member+

    Jun 1, 2015
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Good luck with that.
     
  13. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Granted on the high kick -

    I still don;t see why a slide tackle has what you call a different consideration to a situation with a player sticking his foot into another's path from a totally unnatural ball playing position. My main consideration is that even though he can touch the ball he can't ever get the ball.

    You can and will get likely kicked by doing what Welbeck attempted (legal play, if pointless).You can often get kicked when trying to slide tackle (which is also a fair thing to attempt). A high kick is never a fair thing to attempt. So, there's that equivalence.
     
  14. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC

    It ain't up to me to waste my time pushing the conclusion. It's just my conclusion.
     
  15. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    That made me laugh out loud ....
    that's very good....!
     

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