PL: Brighton vs Liverpool - 1230pm Nov 28 [R]

Discussion in 'Liverpool' started by SamScouse, Nov 26, 2020.

  1. Suss

    Suss Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 11, 2003
    New York
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    This team needs to be picked with Wolves on Sunday in mind. Can Matip play both Tuesday and Sunday? If Henderson only had 45 minutes in him today, will he be able to go Tuesday and Sunday? Gini just played Sunday, Wednesday, and Saturday. Surely he’s at risk if he goes again. Klopp mentioned that if he had 5 subs today, he would have used it to get Robbo off. This a major headache. With each new injury, Klopp is forced to put even more players at risk.
     
  2. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    It's a crime that a man, watching in slow motion, however far away from the pitch can make such a decision. The referee calls up VAR and asks for some help? Ok, I get it. But for a TV referee make such a call? A travesty.
     
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  3. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Let's do away with slow motion - if it's not detectable at full speed, it's not able to be changed via VAR.
    Slow motion makes minimal contact - like Robbo with Wellbeck - look injurious when it is really innocuous.

    I've said it before, and I'll say it again - when has VAR ever shown a close "offside" goal to be millimeters onside? If the only result is negative, people lose faith in the system.
    HawkEye, in tennis and in football, is universally loved because it really is 50-50 when it goes to that review - the ball could be millimeters in or out. There is nothing subjective about it.
    But VAR is taking subjective situations and instead of leaving decisions to a man on the field, are now bringing two subjective opinions to the same situation and encouraging irrational groupthink - "Mr VAR said Wellbeck was fouled - I didn't see it - but he's got slow motion, so I'll agree with him."
     
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  4. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Back in 2015, the league would have one, maybe two, 'big' controversies per match day.
    VAR seems to have improved on that - we now have several 'big' controversies PER MATCH.
    I'd rather see it scrapped altogether at this point.
     
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  5. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    You've just banned any and all contact between players with that viewpoint.
    Have you reviewed every corner kick taken in the match - how many shirts were being pulled in every one of them?
    Next time a defender clears a ball in the box I'll just stick a leg out so he kicks my foot = automatic penalty.

    Your unerring support for every VAR decision is so tired and tiring.
     
  6. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Bruno Fernandes would be the sole person joining @EruditeHobo in its defense.
     
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  7. Suss

    Suss Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 11, 2003
    New York
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    And it often takes away the beautiful goals, the ones that we watch football for, because an armpit was a centimeter offsides. The goals that VAR is awarding is to players who posed no threat to the goal for the softest of fouls or handballs. The negatives outweigh the positives by far. It’s at the point where you can’t even celebrate a goal anymore. Isn’t that the whole point of supporting a football team?
     
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  8. Wingtips1

    Wingtips1 Member+

    May 3, 2004
    02116
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    As has been mentioned, it's a shame that we're not talking about Jota. Or Nat Phillips.
    I'd rather be b*tching about the fact that we signed the wrong player from RBS and wasted 8.5m on Minamino than VAR.
    Or wondering if Thiago is the new Harry Kewell. The player that we pin hopes on only for him to never actually be available. I'd rather buy Leonder Dendoncker and have him play 42 games over the course of the season and have an obvious game plan than to hope for Thiago's fitness and have to recalibrate every time he's fit for one or two matches.
     
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  9. bayern is god

    bayern is god Member+

    May 26, 2007
    india
    Wrong choice of words Terp.

    He never puts a foot wrong in his interviews.

    But he's talking it a bit too far blaming BT for getting scheduled at 12 30 pm when there are clearly other targets and issues at play.That was my only grouse.We have been immensely lucky with injuries last few years.This year we have shit luck with injuries.The constant moaning about Scheduling and games is kind of getting cumbersome.Its the same for everyone.

    We just need to Adapt & Keep Moving.
     
  10. Fussballer

    Fussballer Member+

    Liverpool FC
    Sep 18, 2002
    In my head
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    We was robbed of 2pts. Total shite Var.
     
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  11. EruditeHobo

    EruditeHobo Member+

    Mar 29, 2007
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #136 EruditeHobo, Nov 29, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2020
    I'm sorry it bothers you... you're not actually taking on anything I'm saying, somehow; a player cannot kick an opponent in their foot inside the box and have it not be a penalty and have the ref not rule it as such. Almost the same exact thing happened to VVD, who admittedly got quite a bit more on Lamela than Robbo did on Welbeck, but they were both equally obvious.

    Both VVD and Robbo were unlucky, the opponent dipped in front of them as they went for big swinging clearances... but being unlucky is part of any sport, and just because it happens quickly doesn't mean it didn't happen. Still, this has very little to do with VAR.

    But overall I know what you mean because I too am really tired, of people ignoring the rules and the realities of what happens on a pitch just because at certain times and in certain incidents it didn't help out their beloved club. It happens all the time around here.

    No,,not even close. Lots of contact in the box still doesn't result in pens. In fact, even with VAR, pens from fouls/contact aren't going through the roof... the handball pens are, because of the handball law change, but not for fouls. When these plays are caught by refs, which for the most part they are, they are called pens.

    The fact that most of the calls which rise to the level of close long VAR review scrutiny do not include many allowed goals... that is an indication that VAR is working. The other close offside calls which are onside do not take as long to decide. That is actually a good thing!

    Some have been allowed though. I don't have a list of them, but it's definitely happened.

    Robbo kicked him directly in the foot. The ref took a 2nd look, and saw that. Almost no ref is not awarding that pen. You're saying he should claim he didn't see it? You and other Liverpool supporters might not want to see it, but refs don't tend to operate that way. If they do that too often -- ignore really obvious things which happened on a football pitch -- they could very well lose their jobs.
     
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  12. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC

    well spotted. Wait for it .... it will start to happen.

    Funny thing is, reading the preceding argument above - what it doesn;t get is that an attacking player can decide to not go for the ball and just try to cause a collision.
    The overwhelming likelihood will be that if its close, he will get the foul, even though he was adjusting to get it and not the ball ....

    This is what happens when people who never played football or were cr@p at it start adjusting rules....
     
  13. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    "
    Robbo kicked him directly in the foot. The ref took a 2nd look, and saw that. Almost no ref is not awarding that pen. You're saying he should claim he didn't see it? You and other Liverpool supporters might not want to see it, but refs don't tend to operate that way. If they do that too often -- ignore really obvious things which happened on a football pitch -- they could very well lose their jobs."

    Hobo has me on ignore ( I Believe) - which is nearly as much a Joy to My World as Biden defeating Trump - but could one of you perhaps posit the question/point of why it's okay for refs to ignore similar incidents when the ball was obviously not going to be reached by the attacker before going out of play? I'd love to know what the difference is?

    I'd love to see that poster or anyone else put his salary up on a definite bet on that rubbish I bolded above with ten random refs picked. Jesus H Christ....
     
  14. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC

    Will you insult Jota if he misses the next 12 games???
    It's not logical what you are saying.
    Also, Minamino was okay today. He's a good player. Everyone was okay (except Neco and the VAR refs)
    Serious question_ was Andriy Schvencho a worse player because with selection and injury he never was a star at Chelski??
     
  15. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    He's great. Got a long career ahead of him, I'd reckon.....
     
  16. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    No- it's throwing the thalidomide baby out with the bath water.

    It's not necessary. Going beyond that a step - it's not good for viewing. get rid.
     
  17. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Even debating that shows how insane this over-analysis has all gotten.

    A penalty now, today, tomorrow and yesterday ... bloody hell .... ffs.....

    or maybe they should tweak the rules to say, be a bigger stronger man when a guy barrells into you from behind... :rolleyes::rolleyes:
     
  18. zaqualung

    zaqualung Member+

    Jun 17, 2015
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Liverpool FC

    me too .... absolutely.... but this game was all about ........ oh yeah, the same thing ...

    Still, chin-up mate. There'll be an egregious offside goal that isn;t scored against us this year at some point, and all will be well ....
     
  19. Red Bird

    Red Bird Member+

    Sep 30, 2003
    Oxford
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I’m cringing at the vitriol which Neco Williams is coping on social media. It was a dire team performance and bullies are picking on the weakest. He wasn’t the worst performer and people need to realise that not all players are going to be instant successes. Sigh ...
     
  20. newterp

    newterp Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 6, 2007
    North Potomac, MD
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    to be a fair comparison - you would need dendocker to also take a near season ending challenge from Richarlison and see how he recovers.
     
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  21. speker

    speker Member+

    May 16, 2009
    Canada
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Exactly. VAR choose to ignore the vast majority of what goes on in the box including incidents like Pickford's two legged assault on Virgil. They say that's up to the ref .Then they pick and choose which incidents to rule on eg Robbo's challenge when the ref is 10 feet away with a clear sightline . What happened to 'clear and obvious'?

    As for offsides , VAR is making farcical marginal calls of millimeters to rule players offside . The spirit of the original law was to prevent "goalhangers" planting themselves in and around the penalty area all game not to catch out an attacker who is essentially level with the defender.

    VAR is ruining the game, many games are not fun to watch. We can't spontaneously celebrate a goal any more while we wait for VAR's check to be done. Exciting goals get chalked off because an elbow is two millimeters over their imaginary line.
     
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  22. Suss

    Suss Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 11, 2003
    New York
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    There is no excuse for abusing a 19 year-old on social media.

    Neco is walking into a real tough situation. It's not like in 13/14 when you can just throw in a teenage John Flanagan at left back and ask him to do a simple job. The game has changed so much since then, and so much more is expected from fullbacks, especially in Liverpool's system. Our right back sees as much of the ball as anyone on the pitch.

    It is also not helping him that he is playing alongside another inexperienced player in Nat Phillips. Phillips also doesn't want the ball at his feet, and it makes our right side an obvious target for opposition. Neco was also not helped by the midfield we put out yesterday. Minamino is not used to playing in that position, especially the defensive responsibilities. Gini and Milner are used to not being asked to do much with the ball as our fullbacks are normally where the creativity comes from. Whenever we are without Trent, we need more creativity from midfield. Jones and Naby provided it against Leicester. We really could have used Henderson from the start, and it would have been great to have Thiago back. We can then ask Neco to do a much more simple job.
     
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  23. SamScouse

    SamScouse Member+

    Jun 1, 2015
    Toronto
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Neco will be starting on Tuesday. Poor lad. These idiots should have their internet privileges revoked.
     
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  24. soccershaggy

    soccershaggy Member+

    May 18, 2003
    Baltimore
    Club:
    DC United
    Absolutely. Nico made a rookie challenge in the box that resulted in the penalty- and their player was looking for the contact, not playing the ball.

    Aside from that, he didn't have a horrible game. Trent also made errors when he was learning, and is now considered one of the best right backs in the world.
     
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  25. newterp

    newterp Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 6, 2007
    North Potomac, MD
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    totally was adrift whenever anyone did a hard cut back into the box. and now, as stated, he's learned.
     
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