We don't even need to answer the question. We never even got to ask the question. That's what is so frustrating. Even if you concede the (admittedly laughable) point that MB has been our best CM throughout the relevant period, that wouldn't necessarily make him first choice every time out. Players play in combination with other players; midfielders play in combination with other midfielders; varying opponents require varying approaches, etc. It's not that unusual for good players not to combine well, for the sum of parts to be less than the whole. Throughout my tenure on BS, our CM structure has always been MB + 1, occasionally MB + 2 (when he's needed extra help, as he evidently does now). Including him now (as a player) should have the entire USMNT spectrum questioning the integrity of the program. If no one else is capable of breaking the bad news to him, give me a shout and I'll do it myself.
Fair enough. I think peak Cameron was an adequate mid-table EPL defensive center-mid. He played a lot of CM in the 14/15 season where they finished 9th and made, more or less, the full time move there in 16/17 when they still finished 13th. It was the next year that they fell off the face of the Earth for the reasons you mentioned. However, that's the exact time period we really needed to be focused on replacing or at the very least, giving real competition, to MB90. We didn't have Busquets in our pool, to be sure, but we had a guy playing significant minutes in the EPL at the position we are repeatedly told we had no one else who could play. Because of his versatility, it was too easy to play him elsewhere when we really needed him at the 6. As another poster mentioned, Besler and Opara (and I would add with Cameron in front of them) would have probably gotten the job done in WCQ.
Aside from when having a stud like Jones next to him, Bradley has largely brought down the level of performance from our other mids, as they have to sit deep and cover for him. I remember when Jones asked the obvious question, why don't we ever try someone else next to me in midfield? Oh man, crickets from our marshmallow media. They curled up in the fetal position.
Transfermarkt showed roughly 550 minutes at center mid in 14/15. Seems enough to give him a run out there considering our situation and that was clearly a transition he was making at Stoke. In fact, JK helped a lot of players get time at their preferred positions in friendlies, just not those who wanted to play the 6 apparently...
Cameron got looks at CM by JK during the 2014 cycle and looked pretty good for the most part; whatever he did or didn't do with Stoke isn't necessarily relevant to the fact he was played at CM with us. The fact that we chose to treat him like a Swiss Army Knife instead of a rotation option at CM is its own issue.
He looked like a guy who could fill in in a pinch but Jones, Bradley and even Beckerman were clearly better options.
Its confusing because your pretending right now. Dax McCarty was fantastic as a DM and showed Bradley up in the 2017 friendly vs Jamaica down in Chattanooga. When Bradley replaced Dax that game, there was clear and distinct drop off in DM quality. Bradley remained #1 thereafter. Canouse also dropped off the face of the earth after impressing as the top #1 DM in a January USMNT camp with berhalter. Canouse never played the in the matches and was never seen from again.
This is what a person on twitter had a tactical video analysis of in regards to bradley with the USMNT since mid 2018. the video showed.... zero opportunities of advancement were being created from Bradley's zone because he was unable to physically get to a space, retrieve the ball, and then to create the disadvantage against the other team, which would result in a quick advantage for the United States. It was clear the US players were desperate for a very agile and mobile DM to help relieve pressure and create the break. Bradley couldent move to help. That was when i knew Berhalter was lying to us in regards to Bradley's importance.
when was he the no.2? I'm not knocking Rimando as he was reliable and deserved to go to Brazil but 2013 Gold Cup should have been Hamid's time to shine.
*Jogged The problem has always been that the two extremes of this argument get conflated. I am not interested in litigating the past. Bradley has been indispensable, adequate and disappointing over various points in the last few years. It is now 2020. Right here, right now, the idea that Bradley is in the national team picture and his name is on the lips of our Head Coach as even being in the pool is patently absurd. It's stupid, it's ridiculous, it is unjustifiable. It is as ridiculous as mentioning Beckerman or Bedoya at this point. Enough is fing enough.
He's been a great player for the program. He's past it and has been for some time now. Although media types like Holden and Lalas may disagree.
I don't think anybody is disagreeing.............................. This whole thread is like a strawman argument. Its people arguing with themselves. There are people defending Michael Bradley's past. I don't see anybody suggesting he should be a key player for the USMNT now. Nobody. Not a soul. The question is who you replace him with. And if Tyler Adams is injured, as he has been off-and-on for quite some time now, the answer is not so obvious. Tyler Adams has not been available for a callup in the last calendar year. Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the last cap he's had was in March of 2019. Its been a year and a half. He wasn't available for either the Gold Cup or the League of Nations. People seem happy to dump Wil Trapp. They seem happy to dump Cristian Roldan. So who ya got? That's the problem. It seems like the current answer for Berhalter with Adams being out is Jackson Yueill. The other #6 named to our U23 Championships roster was Hasani Dotson of Minnesota. That's the state of the position. And that was the problem faced by Klinsmann and then Arena the whole 2014 cycle. They tried a bevy of guys. None of them stuck.
Nobody? Egg has basically said he's a legitimate part of the team. As has the soccer media. As has the scuffed podcast. That's a lot of people, way more than "not a soul". Adams plays the 6. If he's not there, McKennie. If he's not there, Yeuill is ok, or Morales. If all 4 aren't there? You don't play with a 6. You use some combo of Pomykal, Aaronson, Cardosa, Cameron, EPB, Reyna, Holmes, or the local waterboy. The point is you simply cannot build a system where Bradley is even mentioned as an option. He's literally the worst player on the field now in MLS games. He's still being mentioned as the #6 backup. The idea he is even part of the discussion, as @sXeWesley perfectly put it above, is so far past the point of logical reality, it's nearly laughable. That's just him being mentioned. When he gets called up in October? Simply proof that selection isn't about putting the best product on the field, but getting him a caps record. I have no idea how they are going to be able to do that at this point.
No matter what, Bradley isn't getting the damn caps record. He needs 14 more caps. Though, intriguingly, there are exactly 14 games in the Oct...
That is not true. Our coach is disagreeing, unequivocally and multiple times. No one gave a sh!t about this thread because even his most ardent defenders had come to the conclusion he was done. Most of us, those on the common sense side of this debate, do not want to be having this conversation at all anymore. Gregg Berhalter for one, you know that average MLS coach that now runs the USMNT because we interviewed literally no one else, keep up. It's the only reason we are back in this stupid thread talking about this again. Him and every other pundit and "journalist" that pretends Berhalter is sane when he says it. Also, posters like yourself who won't just come out and say that you think Bradley is the second or third best option at the #6, which seems to be your position as best I can gather from your post. To wit: And then there you go disagreeing and defending Bradley with straw men. We literally have pages and pages of lists of alternatives going back years. What position are you talking about exactly, the position that constantly becomes specifically whatever Bradley is at any given moment and the polar opposite of whatever the better alternatives are? Diagonal ball passer guy? Talk about your fing straw-men "we have no options, we never had any options, we tried all the options, I'm not saying he shouldn't be a KEY player, no one else plays as a deep lying trequerista advanced play-maker super general non gendered leader garbage version of Pirlo #6, no one likes it, but we absolutely MUST start Bradley every minute of every game because there are literally no other choices ever and never have been and look the young guys are always just too young and the other old guys are not experienced enough, etc." That is a bald faced lie. Who do we got? Kyle Beckerman at #38, right below Geoff Cameron, Clint. I have a list of 37 other players that are US eligible and clearly better than Michael Bradley right now, followed by Kyle Beckerman who is a better substandard MLS player this moment, then I would play with 10 and then I would consider Michael Bradley if Lindsey Horan refused a call up. I refuse to provide my list because to do so is to acknowledge that this is a conversation worth having and that the idea of Michael Bradley wearing the shirt again is a fantasy worth entertaining. It is not.
I mean, we could try playing in a fashion that doesn't require an immobile, uncreative player to run our entire offense through. I'm sure we could pick any random American-eligible CM and ask them to spend 50% of a game parked between the CB's and hitting poorly aimed diagonal passes. It's not like he's bringing some vital skillset that we can't live without. If he vanished from the face of the Earth tomorrow, I'm sure we'd find a way to fill the spot.
We'll see. I think even his biggest fans are past the point of defending him (as shown with the "nobody thinks he's good enough now...well except Egg and the entire media landscape"). If he's called up again after what I just witnessed in the MLS tournament, there is no argument other than corruption of some kind.
If Adams is injured, the CM combination that isn't talked about much, but I think might be the best option, is Mckennie and Holmes, with Mckennie functioning more as the #6. I think that may function better than a Yueill and Mckennie duo. Right now I would lean towards having Mckennie and Holmes called in as our #8s, and Adams and Yueill called in as the #6s if everyone is healthy.
Let's at least give these new pairings some thought (for a change), and let's not be afraid to move forward into the future, with courage.
Totally agree. I'm part of the camp that was a big Bradley fan for a long time, but now think that we have better options in CM overall. He did great work for the NT at times, but its time to move on. Obviously the general consensus is that Adams and Mckennie are the clear first choices, but if one or both of them are injured, which is a huge possibility, that's when things get interesting. Guys like Yueill, Holmes and Pomykal all show potential, but who's going to perform best in CONCACAF qualifying when the pressure is on?
At some point you would think Paxton needs to get a run out also. I'm kinda Luke warm on him but he is disruptive, covers a ton of ground, and seems like he fits the mold and would be a logical choice to back up Wes if he was forced to drop back to the 6 slot or was injured. I will admit that most of what I have seen from Paxton was at the U20WC so not sure what his form has been as of late??