Coronavirus Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'The Netherlands' started by Orange14, Mar 17, 2020.

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  1. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    You are missing the picture here. It doesn't have to be the pharma industry. Many national health institutes fund research into alternative medicine. Over here, the National Institutes of Health has a division set up for exactly this purpose: https://www.nccih.nih.gov/ The fund high quality research in a variety of different areas. I have no idea whether anyone has brought an inhaled H2O2 protocol to them for funding. You might want to check with the funding organization in The Netherlands and propose this to them. This way data can be generated to show this works. I never take the word of an independent scientist who just issues anecdotes.
     
  2. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I read a report yesterday that the Bundesliga will begin play to finish the season in early May. Teams have returned to practice. All matches will be played with no supporters, only televised matches. I guess this is progress. I have not seen any reports on the Eredivisie starting up.
     
  3. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Sure, I'll send them the video. I fully expect them to laugh it off though. People are generally very stupid when it comes to new, radical ideas. Especially if those ideas are very simple.

    Remember that all Truth Passes Through Three Stages:

    1st: It Is Ridiculed.
    2nd: It Is Violently Opposed.
    3rd: It Is Accepted As Self-Evident.


    It sounds from reading your posts you are still at stage 1
     
  4. @Brilliant Dutch
    I think you are pretty safe for the virus, given your weekend jenever consumption. Viruses can't cope with alcohol, so when your alco saturation level in your blood goes up, the viruses run for their life. It's true I read it on twitter.
     
  5. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    No, I'm just data driven. I used to take inhaled sodium cromolyn for my mild asthma but they took the darn thing off the market as they wanted to switch everyone over to inhaled steroids. My asthma to tree pollen pretty much went a way and I get a new inhaler every two years just in case. I haven't needed to use it. Too bad the cromolyn is off the market as the structure is similar to some of the compounds that inhibit SARS-CoV-2.
     
  6. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    You can still get it on Amazon and Ebay:

    https://www.amazon.com/s?k=sodium+cromolyn&ref=nb_sb_noss

    https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_fro...TRC0.A0.H0.TRS4&_nkw=sodium+cromolyn&_sacat=0

    Are you saying sodium cromolyn will treat (or possibly cure) Coronavirus??
     
  7. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    The links you give are for the nose drops. Those are still available in the US. I used the metered dose inhaler for my asthma. That is the version that is no longer available. The drug reduces inflammation in the lungs and is probably just as effective as hydroxychloroquine.
     
  8. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  9. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  10. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
  11. :DShort of soccer stuff, what's left;)
     
  12. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Okay sorry. I'm just trying to help
     
  13. Today I read in AD paper a plea I forgot some time ago to post in here as I was thinking that too already.
    It's about wearing masks outside.
    A few weeks ago it was adviced against it.
    Reasons:
    - those masks arenot good. Medical staff can't use them to protect themselves as there's too much leakage in.
    - not enough masks for medical staff to begin with so masks should be restricted
    for them

    Does anyone notice the contradiction between the two reasons?

    This is such a stupid advice.
    First, we donot need medical frontline quality masks as we donot cope with highly contagious people like the care takers and medical profession.
    Second it's also about nobody knows if he/she is infected, so a mask can prevent clouds of aerosols going round.
    I'm annoyed by the 1.5 meter distance rule. It's highly inadequate.
    We live in the Netherlands where it's windy almost every day with at least beaufort 3. So in those circumstances with back wind an infected person will have the aerosols blown for meters behind that stupid 1.5 meters.

    I'm glad someone wrote an article to challenge that imbecil take by the RIVM and thus by the Dutch gouvernment.
    These guys have such a tunnel vision approach to this thing, it's just not funny. It is fecking dangerous.
    https://www.ad.nl/opinie/verplicht-iedereen-vanaf-nu-mondkapje-te-dragen~a21ef93e/
     
  14. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
  15. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    I kind of agree with the Italians there. Why is Rutte so reluctant to help them out?! What comes around goes around, btw
     
  16. The Italians for a decade or so are, like the other populist spending countries, banging for the creation of Eurobonds, that liberate them from the markets to look at how they financially behave and price debt they want to put out in accordance to that.
    What Italy, Spain and France have been doing is utterly disgusting, to disguise their financial Trojan horse with the blanket of coronabonds.
    That would mean they can then put out loans covered by the whole EU, but in fact Germany, the Netherlands and a few countries around the Baltic Sea.
    Italy is already before the corona hit them virtually bankrupt. Was it last year or the year before that that populist shithead they elected as president or PM stuck his middlefinger up the rest of the EU and wanted to expand spending instead of bringing the economy in order by reforming their pension system they de facto cannot afford. The financial markets reacted immediately and rates for loans to Italy skyrocketed. So this shithead very fast had to eat humble bread and more or less (too little in my opinion) had to comply to the EU budget rules.
    That brake dissappears when Eurobonds (or dressed up as coronabonds) are created and we will be paying the price. Our pension system is cracking already as a result of the populist spending in Greece leading to their crisis, Italy and Spain and Portugal. Because the EU was going through a Euro crisis because of those countries the ECB started doing what the US Fed has been doing by buying up trillions of bad debt paper and thus driving down interest.
    That low interest causes our highly healthy pensionfunds great problems as future obligations in retirement payments are offset by current contributions of pensionfund members. The current payments are being calculated in a system called future value calculation. To do so a rate is used and it has to be a rate that's a safe and sure rate. So in fact the rate the ECB sets. Since the artificially putting down of the rates the value of the possessions of our pension funds got hammered. All as result of the financial disfunctional southern countries that lead to the Euro crisis. So now we already are suffering from financial misbehaviour of those countries by lower retirement payments and for those not yet retiring like our youth increasingly higher contributions.
    The whole discussion around reforming of our pension system is the result of those countries, not the result of us having a bad system.
    So do we really need to add another weight on that scale that alreay is flipping our money to them?
    No. Help they can get for this crisis, but we're not going to give them a credit card backed by us, for sure not while they just recently showed they will misbehave if there's no market to slap them back into reality.
    We are forced to retire later and later, while the French, who are part of that irresponsible budget behaviour, keep their citizens at 60 year old retirement.
    Are we really going to work later and later inlife to give populist shitheads bribing money to give to their voters like France not adjusting their retirement age at 60?
    Really? You support that?
     
    DutchFanatic repped this.
  17. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    ^^^^ please use paragraphs, my eyes are hurting now :eek:
     
    Orange14 repped this.
  18. Brilliant Dutch

    Brilliant Dutch Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Oct 14, 2013
    Amsterdam, Holland
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    The drug Trump said could be a game-changer

     
  19. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    i see no link to the actual trial results. As written, it is wrong to say that there are no cardiac events. A group that I helped form back in 2005, is publishing a very large observational study of patients who have been given both drugs and their data show that the combination of both hydroxychloroquine/azithromycin lead to cardiac problems.

    "However, when azithromycin was added to hydroxychloroquine, we observed an increased risk of 30-day cardiovascular mortality (CalHR2.19 [1.22-3.94]), chest pain/angina (CalHR 1.15 [95% CI 1.05-1.26]), and heart failure (CalHR 1.22 [95% CI 1.02-1.45]) Conclusions: Short-term hydroxychloroquine treatment is safe, but addition of azithromycin may induce heart failure and cardiovascular mortality, potentially due to synergistic effects on QT length. We call for caution if such combination is to be used in the management of Covid-19." https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.08.20054551v1

    Given Dr. Raoult's past behavior, nobody is putting much faith in his results.
     
  20. [​IMG]
    Colleagues at the Erasmus University Medical Centre pay tribute to a 60 year old collegue who died of corona infection (acquired outside the Medical Centre).
     
  21. Orange14

    Orange14 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 27, 2007
    Bethesda, MD
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Until we know the real case report mortality, and conjectures such as in the article are next to worthless. If this turns out to be similar to the 1957-58 Asian Flu which had a mortality rate of 0.3% versus 0.1% for the normal flu, things look a lot different.
     
  22. TFC Ajax

    TFC Ajax Member+

    Mar 20, 2011
    Greater Toronto Area
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    Netherlands
    Are you aware of any region that is conducting random testing of the population for antibodies to get an idea of the percentage that has contracted the virus?

    Around here they're still way too restrictive about who they are testing. Still only giving tests to people that are highly likely to have it (symptomatic, and direct contact with a confirmed case, or recently traveling).

    I personally know of several people who even experienced significant symptoms and weren't recommended for testing because they hadn't traveled or had direct contact with a known case. As of last week, we were only administering 30% of our daily testing capacity.

    How can the mortality rate be determined when we have no idea how many people people are contracting it and being denied testing, but all deaths are counted?

    Also it seems that if the purpose of testing is to slow the spred, that the strategy of testing people that are likely to have it, and vulnerable people is the opposite of who we should be testing? Those people should be totally isolated regardless, and we should be testing the apparently healthy people that have to work to provide essential services (food service workers, medical workers, etc) since they're the ones that are in contact with the most people/surfaces and we know that people can spread the virus without being symptomatic
     

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