Feyenoord bought Argy defender Senesi for 7 million, almost 3 times the value given by TM when he was in Argentina (2.25 million). So off by +/- 270%. Ajax bought Argy Martinez for 6 million, which was the same value given by TM. Ajax bought Alvarez for 15 million, while TM valued him in Mexico at 7.5 million. Argy Tagliafico was bought for 4 million, while valued at 6 million. Just a few of our transfers. Would be interesting to see how this looks like when sampling Latin American transfers to the Eredivisie as these in general are for players looked at with potential to add value by Dutch clubs.
Here’s an ESPN article or that uses EA FIFA ‘19 ratings to compare teams. https://www.espn.com/soccer/united-...ion-player-development-and-tactical-evolution
Just a word of caution here. Something I found when I was doing the equivalent for MLS transfers was that sometimes a transfer is announced well before the transfer is technically listed as having occurred. So if Transfermarkt updates their market values before the transfer is officially complete, and you just compare the transfer fee with the market value at the time of the transfer, it looks a lot closer than it actually was before the transfer was announced. So for example, Frenkie de Jong's transfer was announced in January 2019 but his contract didn't actually begin until July 2019. And it was essentially reported as a done deal in December 2018 (and if you click on the link you'll even see fairly accurate reporting about the transfer fee Ajax was asking for). So if you go by the July 2019 figures, it looks like Transfermarkt overestimated his value by €10. But if you go by the value in October 2018, the last listed market value a couple months prior to the transfer being reported as a done deal, then they undervalued him by €35. I don't know how many players on that list that applies to. It actually didn't apply to too many names on the MLS list. But I wonder if it might be different in European leagues with more active reporting on transfer activity.
If the claim is erroneous then you should be able to debunk it with actual evidence from football matches. What Suyuntuy is saying is not that different from what I said a few posts back: at the margins, there isn't much difference between our lower-level guys in Europe and MLS achievers. Like me, I assume he's made his opinions based on years of watching soccer. If you disagree, then you should be able to build a strong case to prove that. So far, all I've heard are assumptions backed up with statistics from completely different sports. As I have said many times, now: this is the issue with the "major / minor" idea that leads to oversimplified or just poor evaluation of players. For instance, Roldan and Morales are closer to eachother in quality (basically interchangeable for the point of comparison) than either is to Pulisic. Or similarly, a poster in the Best 11 thread made the error that Werder Bremen and Villareal are the same "major" level to argue that Sargent was far ahead of Jozy Altidore at the same age.
This is exactly the point about major vs minor leagues: the thought that roldan and morales are interchangeable is the point - they’re not particularly close and no B1 team would play roldan against B1 competition. He’s a mid career minor leaguer and no one believes he has the ability to step up to a higher level of play. even their play on the USMNT is noticeably different in 2019 as Roldan has effectively played himself off the squad and morales has an extra gear/drive that roldan has never showed. To be fair, I’d give both a pass because they almost always had to play with Bradley/trapp and that’s not a fair thing to do to either player. no one is saying that an average XFL player is just as good as an NFL player or that an lifetime AAA baseball player is as good as a starter for the Marlins. Yet, here you are with roldan and Morales. if you’re looking for an example, look at the B1/B2 relegation games. If the levels were roughly equivalent, you’d see a lot more B2 victories....
Mid/Major is attempting to slap an American sports landscape term on a far more diverse global sport. Doesn’t work. Roldan could play at a level between Sea and your average Bund club.
In other new, Zimmerman just got sold to Nashville for $1M monopoly money ("allocation" money) and 1 international roster spot. They said he was making $600K+ at LAFC. https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2020...man-traded-lafc-nashville-sc-blockbuster-move I wonder what MLS would have asked for from a Euro league.(I'm assuming they still have veto power on sales to foreign clubs). I"m not sure he would be any further along in his career had he taken the deal he was offered by Viking in Norway on a free after he ran out his string at Dallas.
I honest Don’t remember... was Bradley on the field when Morales got his ankles broke on Mexico’s 2nd goal? Morales is not the hill to die on.
Sea v. Bremen in the attack ------------------rui diaz (sargent) morris(rashica)----lodeiro(osako) that's pretty close. I'd actually go with Seattle midfield -------------roldan(klaasen)---jones(sahin) ---------------------svensson(eggestein) that's not close - I'm going with Bremen altho Svensson is high level player. I'd say the defense is about even, maybe a slight edge to Bremen, without listing them here. Main thing is that Bremen don't have their attack playing together and that is sooooo important.
we are comparing morales to roldan - that’s not particularly close. Morales was one of the few competent players in that game vs Mexico where we insisted on playing out of the back into the teeth of a press.
I don't actually think Morales was anything special against Mexico. But, Roldan has been actively poor for several games now. So, by default Morales deserves another chance. I just wouldn't pin my hopes on a team featuring Morales as a vital component. He can dig in, work hard, make some tackles, minimize stupid giveaways, but that's basically all. I mean, Roldan offers none of that if we are comparing them. But, let's not pretend Morales is sensational just because he deserves more time n a team where guys like Roldan get plenty of minutes. Morales deserves a spot on the bench to get some on-field time when we need someone to bring the energy and intensity up a notch or to grind out a result. If we go to Qatar with Morales as one of our starting players, we're likely to not be in great shape. Probably my biggest issue surrounding Morales and this team is that his lack of involvement in favor of plodders like Roldan shows that Berhalter seems to place zero value on hard-working ball winners/fighters. And when you're not one of the top 5-10 teams in the world, you're gonna need 'em. And, Berhalter's willing to sacrifice such players, not for ball wizards or dangerous attackers, but for players that exemplify mediocrity across the board. If you don't have anyone who offers you much, at least pick the fighter.
I would definitely take Morales over Roldan based on how they have performed when with the NATs over the past year. He could maybe earn a starting spot, but right now I see him more as a central midfield bench option with Adams, McKennie and Pulisic slotting in the central midfield positions.
morales is a plumber willing to do the hard dirty work and he has done it at the B1 level for 4/5 years now. We know that he won’t wilt in the face of faster/stronger/more technical opponents. Quite frankly, we need a lot more of this grit. we have no reason to think that roldan is capable of this and in fact have reasonable evidence that he doesn’t. Clearly every team in the big 4 agrees. do I think morales is a very good player? He’s clearly behind Adams and McKennie and we know his ceiling isn’t very high as it’s right about where he’s been for a couple of years (mid table B1) but that’s well above roldan and lletget. I’d like to see how Pomykal, Yueill and Holmes look in the midfield but we don’t know what their ceiling is and it wouldn’t surprise me if they had lower ceilings than Alfredo (particularly Holmes and Yueill). Pomykal is young and his progression isn’t so far off of Tyler adams and Alphonso Davies so I’m hopeful he continues his upward progress.
What was competent about Morales? He picked up a dumb yellow card and then when the team needed him to win the ball or foul the player, he couldn’t because he lost control earlier and was already on a yellow. So he got schooled on the breakaway. I’m sure if that player had been Bradley or Trap you would have been on here berating them about that play. But because it’s Morales, somehow you can look past that. I’m all for rating players, but there needs to be some honesty when doing this. It shouldn’t matter where that player plays or what their TM value is, their play on the Nats should stand alone as their value.
Please can someone post up the counterattacking goal from our corner (I think it was Mexico’s 2nd goal) where Morales closes down the dribbler and he fakes Morales out so bad that he literally ends up on the ground as the Mexican attacker runs by him. We need to put this made up narrative of Morales as one of a few competent players to bed. He has only played a few games and his major contribution has been a glaring error for a Mexican goal.
Will Trapp was the centerpiece of that game(!) and by most accounts, Morales was a bright spot. Here's Ives' take: "Morales was one bright spot in the USMNT’s 3-0 loss to Mexico." Here's Berhalter (which I take with a grain of salt as he's not a guy to throw his players under the bus): "He came with us and was able to perform well against Mexico. What he gives you is a tenacity, an energy, a work rate in midfield that helps the entire group" https://sbisoccer.com/2019/11/morales-set-to-bring-much-needed-tenacity-to-usmnt-canada-rematch These takes are consistent with the post-match thread. You can hate on him and say that Roldan is better but it's not particularly close. Didn't he have the best shot on goal off a blind volley that hit the post? He was also the only one who was willing to stand up for the USMNT.
The shot was nice. He had some other good moments where he combined in pressure. But the yellow card was stupid, and you expect more from a high level pro. That card was instrumental in how he miss-handled the play that led to the 2nd goal that put the game away.
well, if you think morales yellow card was a bad thing for the USMNT, we look at what’s wrong with our team very differently. He did exactly what I want our players to do - show the other side we’re not backing down an inch. Contrast that to our heavy MLS play in couva and under Berhalter or heck even trapp in that game. I think Bruce arena has become an utter douchbag with his exclusionary bullshit but I love this quote from his first World Cup game: first tackle today, first foul, first shot, first goal. That’s our identity. instead, we get pushed around by Mexico as we build around will trapp. Morales totally gets it as does McKennie and Miazga in 2019. Do you agree with the statement that roldan and morales are interchangeable and therefore roldan could spend 4/5 years as a consistent player in the B1?
I very seldom care about a yellow card. Maybe suspension issues with an important game coming up, you need to watch it. And you don't want to foul needlessly in bad areas. But, I think you absolutely need at least one or two guys out there that get yellows fairly regularly. Soccer is still a contact sport last I checked. It kind of reminds me of what Coleman Hawkins said about playing music, "If you don't make mistakes, you're not really trying." We could easily say, If you don't miss the ball and take a players legs now and then, you're not really tackling.
I do tell my sons that if they dont get called for a foul while defending in a game, they’re not doing it right. they do have to help the opponent up and say “my bad” however and not do it in our box.
Yup, you should always be right up on that line between fair and foul when defending. And, you're not close enough to it if you don't sometimes cross over.
More specifically, it's vitally important that we show spine vs. our #1 rival in Mexico. To be clear, I mean in a friendly rivalry in a sport - I still admire Michael Bradley for rallying the team for a picture with Mexico in 2016.
Morales had a solid game in his first one with the USMNT in years. He showed well for the ball and combined well with his teammates. His biggest impact was the tenacity he brought on the defensive side of the ball. He missed played some passes and got beat on the third goal. That doesnt detract from the positives he brought. The game showed that he should be an option for depth and should get more minutes to settle in. He was bright spot on the night because many of the regulars didnt bring positives and made similar mistakes that he did. He is a clear upgrade to Roldan and Trapp. https://soccer.nbcsports.com/2019/0...rom-a-bad-night-versus-mexico/comment-page-1/ Alfredo Morales — 6 — Dueled with Pulisic to be the United States’ Man of the Match. His performance was made more impactful by the fact that he had little going on around him for the first hour (outside of Pulisic). Probably would’ve even earned a 7 had he not been sautéed by Hirving Lozano on the third goal. Let’s hope his late injury isn’t as serious as it looked.
We look at things very differently. When you get suckered into a useless yellow, then you got played for a fool. Teams like Mexico try that crap all the time. Usually it’s the inexperienced players that fall for that crap. If you wanna get some payback, you do it right. You give them a tackle that they feel for the rest of the game, or if you really know what you’re doing, you give them a lil something off the ball unseen by the refs. Not out some stupid pushing match that comes to nothing but a yellow for you. 1st off he should have been subbed off. You don’t want a Dmid on a yellow. But since he was left on we all saw the consequences of that stupid play. How anyone thinks that was a good thing is beyond me, since we saw it play out in front of us. I think you are confusing playing hard with playing stupid. BA’s quote has nothing in it about getting the 1st yellow. Roldan is not interchangeable with Morales. At the same time anyone thinking Morales has been a difference maker is not being honest. Maybe he just needs more time, but so far I’m not impressed.