YNT-eligible MLS players: 2019/2020 Offseason thread

Clint, this is getting ridiculous. I generally like your posts and think you are one of the more knowledgeable posters on this website, but you have to be willing to not always take the side of FC Dallas. I think most people here generally like the job FC Dallas is doing with young American players, but there are going to be times where the team does things wrong or there will be news that doesn't portray the team favorably.

Gomez is not part of preseason because he's going to leave the club. The same is going to happen for Carrera. Thats why they are not in preseason with the first team. Che has skipped Carrera because Carrera is going to leave the club. I think anyone can see this without even having any info on it, and then there are posts like the ones above that say as much. I don't think anyone's even criticizing FC Dallas for not including the players in preseason, but to act like there's nothing to see here is utterly ridiculous, and there's a lot of reason to believe its also untrue.

 

I see no reason to believe that those players were left out of these first couple of friendlies for those reasons. Nothing but internet conjecture. [I believe what Buzz and legitimate reporters tell me, and not internet gossipers.] What was the purpose of those friendlies? It was to give the draft picks an opportunity to impress the staff before cuts have to be made. Then the rest of the spots were filled in by first team and NTSC players under contract. Academy players have played very little so far in pre-season. Is Che the only one?

I suspect that FCD needed a fill-in at CB because Brecc Evans has been loaned to Austin Bold. Che's a USYNTers just like Carrera is. In fact, I remember the anti-FCD horde on these boards telling us a year ago that Che was leaving for Germany imminently. Interesting that they were 100% wrong about that, but we somehow believe them about Carrera and Gomez. These people told us there was zero percent chance that Pepi was signing a contract, and he signed a contract like a week later. I can keep going. Why do people believe what they're saying about Carrera and Gomez? I have no idea.

By the way, do you know the academy player travelling to pre-season camp with FCD? Its none of the above. Its Tanner Tessman. The same guy that the internet experts are telling me is about to be a place kicker at Clemson. Interesting. Does that look like Clemson? Is FCD wasting an extended preseason roster slot on a place kicker at Clemson? Maybe, I don't know. But I tend to believe my eyes and the experts first.

Tanner Tessmann heading to Cally with #FCDallas is something.

Last year Pepi and the Rodriguez brothers went. pic.twitter.com/FFlqwgV32r

— 3rd Degree (@3rdDegreeNet) January 30, 2020

 

If you want to skip over all the micro-reactions and speculation and wait until there's official confirmation of these players leaving before having a macro-opinion, you can certainly do that. I do agree that we can't be sure that these will leave or stay until there's 100% confirmation. Some of the speculation that goes on here and twitter about these players ends up being wrong.

However, I think it'd be silly to believe that these decisions have no reason behind them. This a high-level professional football club. Of course the decisions are well-thought out. We might not always know the reason behind these decisions, but there are reasons for them. I just hope that if the speculation ends up being true that some of these players are going to leave the club, that the analysis is not then that it's an irrelevant discussion. You are certainly allowed to not want to make much of speculation, but if the speculation is officially confirmed, there shouldn't be a "nothing to see here" or an "this already happened and isn't worth discussing" approach.

 

The purpose of those games wasn't to give academy kids an opportunity! That's what I'm saying. It was to give the draft picks an opportunity! Nothing whatsoever to do with Carrera and Gomez. That's why I said I didn't think the fact they were selected.........in isolation..........means anything. The purpose of the game was to give Burgess an opportunity. Not Carrera. Che was picked over Carrera? Is that such a shock? Che is a USYNTer as well.

If those players don't want to play for FCD, that's fine with me. Adios. Good luck somewhere else. FCD isn't a halfway house for kids that have no intention of signing a contract.

 

Nashville SC 0 IF Elfsborg 0

Lineups
Nashville SC starting XI: Joe Willis; Eric Miller, Dave Romney, Jalil Anibaba, Dan Lovitz, Hany Mukhtar, Anibal Godoy, Alan Winn, Dax McCarty, Abu Danladi, Dominique Badji

Nashville SC beginning at 31': Adrian Zendejas; Brayan Beckeles, Ken Tribbett, Jack Maher, Taylor Washington, Derrick Jones, Tah Brian Anunga, Trialist, Matt LaGrassa, Alistair Johnston, Cameron Lancaster

Nasvhille SC beginning at 61': Elliot Panicco; Trialist, Trialist, Trialist, Trialist, Trialist, Trialist, Trialist, Tanner Dieterich, Shak Adams, Luke Haakenson

The Sounders Matchday twitter is very active for a preseason game. You find multiple more mentions of thread eligible players from yesterday's Seattle Sounders game on their.

 

In breaking #RBNY #USYNT news top 2003 prospect Caden Clark is joining the Red Bull’s organization. I’m working on the details be it academy or a pro contract. But can confirm he is joining the Red Bulls. Story at @RBNewsNetwork to come.

— Eric Friedlander (@Efried97) January 31, 2020

 

Yes it is such a shock. For me Carrera is by far the best CB in his age group and blows away Che who is a great prospect in his own right. Carrera and Gomez are receiving similar treatment to what KDLF did when he was expected not to resign with Barca. Kobe Hernandez was also receiving this treatment when he was getting little Galaxy 2 minutes when he was by far the best left back in their system.

 

DC United have told the parents of their Academy players that the mission of the Academy is to produce players that they can sell to other clubs.

i went to their presentation at the United Soccer Coaches Convention and there they indicated that if they produce one homegrown MLS signing per year and one USL signing per year they are satisfied with their progress.

So according to what they are saying, DC United’s Academy are preparing players for three potential outcomes that would benefit the club, but the reality is that every single player tells the story of their experience with the club for the rest of their lives so they attempt to make the academy a positiva educational experience.

 

Che and Carerra play for Dallas

 

Yes. That is clear from your post.

i am not an argument-based poster so my posts are not from the point-counterpoint genre.

 

That's the treatment that these players should be given.

Do folks think that Borussia Dortmund and Boca Juniors invest in kids that don't want to sign a contract and have their eyes on a move elsewhere? They let the kids move on, and invest in the kids that do want to be there.

This isn't the 4H club. THis is a professional soccer club. If a youngster doesn't want to be there, then the club should cut him loose. The second Weston McKennie turned down the largest homegrown contract in league history, and indicated he wanted to play in Germany...................he never played another game for FCD's academy. They could have used him in the DA playoffs at the time, but what would have been the point? To win academy games? If Carrera in particular has told FCD he plans of pursuing opportunities in Mexico or Europe, then why would FCD provide him with opportunities with their first team? They wouldn't. They'd give that opportunity to the "next man up" in their pipeline. Maybe that's viewed as Justin Che. Maybe it'll become clear that Che also wants to move on, then you go to the next man up after him.

Where does Carrera currently sit in the FCD centerback pipeline? Definitely behind Hedges, Ziegler, Bressan, Montgomery, Evans, and Ponder (all under contract). Probably behind 1st round pick Burgess, who's likely to get a contract. Probably behind former USYNTERs Brandon Terwege and Mark Salas as well in the NCAAs, who both are likely HG signings. So I'd put Nico Carrera at......................8 to 10th in the CB depth chart depending on how I feel about Terwege and Salas that day. I rate Che and Carrera similarly, so that's 6 of one; half dozen of the other. One of them got a shot in the NTX game, and it was Che.

Now, part of my rant revolved around the fact that I don't actually know what Carrera and Gomez are thinking. I also don't know that they didn't play in those friendlies on Wednesday. Buzz reported that in the 2nd half against the NTX Diablos, a bunch of the U17s and U19s subbed in. Those teams, by the way, had only recently returned from their trip to Mexico. So I don't really know what we're arguing about. I'll drop it......................

 

Here is why FCD approach may be shortsighted. They have a kid like Carrerra or Gomez who doesn't want to sign the USL deal but is interested in testing the waters in Europe at 18 instead. These kids have been pushed to USYNT camps, tournaments abroad all with the help of FCD to this point. There is no dispute about that. How about once FCD knows they don't want so sign with USL, instead of telling them to hit the road, FCD works with the player to see how they can help them get to the biggest club possible in Europe?

FCD wins if Gomez go to Dortmund as there is training compensation even if he is not a signed player. Further, If FCD was helpful and promoted these kids, perhaps the kid gets his deal set up in Europe, with FCD help, then signs a quick deal with FCD so they can get a transfer fee ( close to what Richards did). The goal of our MLS clubs, if they have any interest in helping the USNT ( this is debatable if this is there job at all) should be to get as many young players over to big clubs in Europe as soon as possible. Not to sign them and have them play in MLS until age 22 or beyond.

If a Gomez wants to go to Europe and it doesn't work out, if FCD has stayed on good terms with him, then maybe he reconsiders the USL deal if there was not a good deal in Europe. Hence, they don't lose their top players as much.

If FCD approach to discard a kid and go to "next man up" just because a kid wants to go to Europe and not sign USL could cost FCD a lot of money and could be a detriment to the US Senior National team in the long run.

FCD benefits from getting kids to Europe perhaps more so than signing them on HG and having them play in the first team. Is selling Richards for 1.5 million plus further transfer fees worth more than paying Pax 600K a year to play in Frisco? Probably so.

 

Dallas would still retain Gomez’s HG rights if he returned from Europe, just like they did with Hyndman. Unless that gets changed in the new CBA.

When players have a Euro club lined up to sign with when they’re 18, a good year ahead of time they’ll start training with that club for a couple months, return back to the U.S. for a couple weeks then return to Europe to train for a couple months again. So the club can just say to their federation that it’s an “extended trial”.

 

I'm sorry, but training compensation is the bare minimum payment. It does squadoosh for FCD. That's a net loss financially for FCD on each player that does it.

I'm not saying the FCD can't continue providing opportunities for Gomez and Carrera and others in the academy. But don't tell me we're going to play them in first team friendlies as we're preparing for he season over players under contract. Players under contract are going to be invested in first. Always. Period. This is basic common sense not requiring the least bit of knowledge about soccer. Ask a 4 year old. Hey, Billy..........which player should FCD play as they prepare for the season? One that is actually on the team or one that isn't under contract and behaves as if he wants to be somewhere else.

I can't understand why this is even a discussion. Nobody would suggest Boca Juniors or Chivas behave this way. This is a business, not a community outreach program. If Jonathan Gomez doesn't want to play for FC Dallas, then he should move to Solar or the Texans. Then he can follow in the footsteps of Blaine Ferri.

 

don't care if they play them in first team scrimmages as that wasn't what I was addressing. I was addressing your contention they should tell them to "hit the road" once they make it known they want to play in Europe instead of sign a USL deal. If it is such a business, as it is, someone should tell them to make a smart decision and get some money out of these players. If FCD thinks training compensation is squadoosh then why retain the rights of any players at all, ever? Will FCD go on records letting all the players in their territory out of the "we hold your MLS rights" position as it means squadoosh?

Playing Gomez in the USL team over Imalgar makes sense if you can sell Gomez to Schalke or Dortmund. That transaction is worth loads more than you will ever get out of Imalgar. FCD shouldn't let emotion get in the way just because a kid doesn't want to sign a USL deal. Turn that kid into a commodity, work with him, not against him, and things would be more profitable and kids wouldn't' be refusing your deals left and right.

Suppose FCD has this approach to Gomez and Carrerra:

1. We support your efforts to get to Europe and will make calls, set up trials, buy you plane tickets, push for you on the USYNT, and do anything we can to make it happen.

2. In exchange for the above, you sign a USL deal paying 100K a year and it lasts until you are 19 with an option year. At the players option, and if the bid is over 500K, the kid can leave at 18 to any team in Europe.

This could be beneficial for both the player and club if they worked together instead of saying things like "go to solar and be like Blaine Ferri"

 

📋 | #NYCFC XI 🆚 @LAFC

Stuver, Scally, Chanot, Sands, Callens; Ring, Zelalem, Parks; Mitriță, Héber, Mackay-Steven pic.twitter.com/Xw2Qwuvzy6

— New York City FC (@newyorkcityfc) January 31, 2020

Today's #LAFC starting XI vs. @NYCFC.

Kenneth Vermeer
Diego Palacios
Jordan Harvey
Dejan Jaković
Tristan Blackmon
Latif Blessing
Bryce Duke
Josh Pérez
Carlos Vela
Adama Diomande
Brian Rodríguez

— LAFC (@LAFC) January 31, 2020

 

You make good points if and that is a big "if" FCD would do that. All indication so far is that is not how they are or will handle players. Terms I have heard of for USL are $20K first year, $24K second year and $40K for the 3rd year at FCD's discretion.

The 3 year total is about the same as most of the players would make the 1st year of a college scholarship. Tough decision to give up college for $44K guaranteed and maybe another $40K and then hope you are offered a HG contract.

And Solar isn't that bad, at least you have some freedom and FCD controls your HG rights anyway.

 

I agree with you and I think that is part of the reason the best players are turning FCD down. It would make no sense to take a 20K offer for USL over a going on trial in Europe and if it doesn't work out, then go to a Clemson or UNC to play a year.

The word I heard mentioned by someone who knows a kid in this situation is that USL is an insulting offer for a starter on the USYNT. If FCD ups that offer to 100K it may change things or not, but at least the kids would probably think more about it.

Solar is becoming a much better option in the last few years as seen with JT and with guys like Bailey and Josh getting NT exposure and go on trials in Europe. Lots of paths for kids.

 

So the MLS threads this year in this forum are going to be 50% runhard bitching about FC Dallas aren’t they?

 

I completely understand when they don't want to bring in non committed academy players to preseason. What I don't like is when clubs who tout themselves as youth development machines handicap players during the middle of the season and not play them with their USL team when they're obviously good enough (Kobe and soon to be Jonathan Perez) or when Dallas played Jonathan Gomez down with the 17's when he is a player who is above the u19 level. Clubs actively trying to derail the development of players who choose not to eventually sign with them is something I really don't like.

 

By the way, while I was at the United Soccer Coaches Convention, I saw a combined presentation by Goalkeeper coaches at DC United, NYCFC and NY Red Bulls. Apparently MLS clubs are sharing resources and information to develop as many pro ready goalkeepers as possible.

This makes sense that they would collaborate with this position. Only one goalkeeper can play at a time and the roster spots are limited. Academies need to maximize resources to ensure that we constantly produce the highest possible players at a position that often ends up being “hit or miss” at a lot of academies.

 

Is there training compensation and solidarity payments in play here? I know MLS was going to try to go after them, but I also know the plan was to have players essentially opt into the program. And that a bunch of people were recommending to players not to sign.

 

Are you sure this wasn't on the table and declined?

(and you'd likely have to up the transfer fee a bit to make it pay out, but I get your point).

 

I think that would depend on the kid and the national team. I wonder if some of this is also tied into an overevaluation on the part of the player. There are lots of YNT players who can't hack it in MLS yet. In fact, I'd say most.

 

It's time to create another "Andrew Carleton" style leper colony thread.