I have absolutely no clue about how transfermarkt determines value. I would expect it to be related to their latest price when there is a latest price but from the Championship transfers (summer). Ryan Sessegnon: Value $35M BP, Transfer Price $27M (to Spurs) Neal Maupay: Value $12M BP, Transfer Price $22M (to Brighton) Kenneth Zohore: Value $7MBP, Transfer Price $8.9 (to West Brom) Adam Webster: Value $9MBP, Transfer Price $21.9M (Brighton) I could go on and some are almost the same, while others...like many of these, vary wildly in both directions. As you can see, the prices and values are all over the place. No rhyme or reason that I can discern for many of the players. the only thing that I can say is that it appears the older the player, the more the transfer price and value tend to converge. Also, the more expensive players were the youngest. Of 17 players (B2 and Championship combined) that transferred for $9.8M BP or more, only 2 were 28 and 29 and all the rest were under 25 with 13 that were 23 or younger. Interestingly enough (IMO), 3 of the top 4 were centerbacks (all transferred for more than $20M BP. I had a list of transfers from Championship and from B2. All of these transfers were from Championship and had been sorted but I forget how I sorted them. Otherwise I just went down in order on the list and only omitted one that was transferred to China but including him probably would not have changed anything. (value 14M sold for 18M at age 29)
I'm not the one who cites transfermarkt to evaluate player quality. I'm doing my best to combat the argument made, which I disagree with, within the parameters given. I guess I could come back and say "hey, you're wrong I'm right no facts offered on my part but you're an idiot". Would that be better?
Yet you go on about "never played above championship " and "two Scotland caps" You aren't combating anything. You just seem upset about the valuation on a website of players you know nothing about.
Also, does the fact that Cairney played 42 games in the EPL make any significant difference when he's played 278 games in the Championship?
Fair enough. Perhaps no heads would explode. Of course we don't even know if he would survive the addition of new players that increased money brings...much less keep his place in the team. Survival in the EPL, for any promoted team depends largely upon how well they spend.
West Ham seemed to like him before he played last season in the Premier League https://www.skysports.com/football/...-down-tom-cairney-bid-from-west-ham-worth-20m So is transfer market undervaluing him?
the original comment was that the championship doesn’t have as good players as Vela and Ibra. I think that’s totally wrong - would it make you feel better if I used the last three years actual transfer fees for both MLS and the championship instead of market value? the answer is the same for both but perhaps there’s an additional layer of cognitive dissonance you have.
Again, LA paid half what transfermarkt had estimated Vela's valuation at. I'm not now trying, nor have I ever tried, to argue that MLS is more than a second-tier league. I'm disagreeing with your citation of transfermarkt valuations to determine quality. We've had this discussion over and over, and I've repeatedly laid out my arguments clearly that access to European or Cotonou passports makes a massive difference in transfers.
not for elite players. I’ve asked before: who are the MLS players who have been hurt? Why can’t they go to Germany?
Agree Webster is way off. Sessengon sold for -22% value (not too far off), Maupay sold for +83% of value, Zohore +27% (but I would argue that lower prices should be expected to vary more...I might be wrong), Webster +140% To be fair, there were a number of values that were close to the transfer prices but there were also quite a few that were not: Oliver McBurnie: $8M value, transfer $19.1M Daniel James: $12M value, transfer 17M Che Adams: $7M value, transfer 16.7M again three taken at random this isn't an argument against the validity of Transfermarkt's numbers. They must use some computerized algorithm and I do not in any way feel qualified to criticize them. I just don't see any good correlation to numbers that I would expect to agree somewhat (valuation and transfer value). The one thing it does seem to underline for me is that even with all of our technology and the money that goes into all of the statistics etc. it all comes down to the human elements in the end. Someone is making a subjective judgement on how beneficial a player will be for a specific team in a specific league and someone believes enough in player that is valued by transfermarkt at $8M to pay more than double that to get him in their squad, while others can't be given away. Edit: it seems that the valuations for Germany (B2) are much closer to the transfer amounts than the Championship transactions.
As will many current championship players. do you think that MLS has players that are well above those in championship?
Transfer fees will vary greatly with how much time is left on a player’s existing contract and also with age of player. Also with how much of a pain in the ass a player is about leaving a club.
Every single one of the top 50 transfermarkt value players in the Championship has a European passport. Every single one. 2 players in the top 75 don't have European passports (and one of those is from a Cotonou country). Rounding out the top 100 sees a Bermudan and a Jamaican/Canadian enter the fray.
When we see that one league consistently sells players at values above [7]m and one doesn’t, that’s a pretty good indicator of value. when one league top selling player is sold for 23m and scores the same in his first year in the majors as Bobby wood who was sold for 4m that’s a data point as well.
What are you asking about "who are the MLS players who have been hurt"? No, he didn't have a Euro passport. He was with FCD and signed with Schalke instead. What's your point here? A very promising kid signed a contract on his 18th birthday, bypassing MLS for Bundesliga.
because your point seems to be that MLS transfers are hurt by not having a passport (a “massive difference”). Therefore I am asking who in MLS was hurt by not having a passport? Who are the players who would go for over 7m euros but for the fact that they didn’t have a passport? Given that you think there’s a “massive difference” caused by the lack of euro passports, I would think there’s a lot of examples. I brought up Weston because he made it without a euro passport as did Adams, I believe.
I don't have a list for you and your 7M Euro bar. How the hell am I supposed to know that information??? There are likely a whole bunch of players who never got looked at because they lacked the passport, but Aaron Long is probably one recent one. While he qualifies for a WP in England, his options are limited to Scandinavia (they ain't paying), Belgium (pretty unlikely--only 5 incoming transfers met your $7M Euro bar this season. I'm counting the guy who was 6.9M btw), and Germany (one guy in the 2.BL met your threshold, a whole bunch in 1.BL--maybe 50--met your threshold). Even the Championship only has 8 incoming guys that meet your threshold this year. So, basically, even if you meet the current UK WP requirements via national team play there are 2 leagues that would likely pay $7M for a transfer fee. EPL and 1.BL. Anyone with a European passport or from Cotonou countries has those options plus Ligue 1 (looks similar to 1.BL in terms of quantity of transfer fees over 7M), La Liga (slightly more than 1.BL), Serie A (maybe even more than Spain).
That's a good point. a player that is close to the end of his contract will see the fee driven down because a team wants to get something and teams will not be willing to pay as much if they feel they can get him on a free by waiting. The age of a player should, in my opinion, be factored into the value but it is more difficult to calculate because it is based upon too many unknowns,. As far as driving the fee up,however, I don't see too much other than apparent potential that would affect it and....again, I would expect that to be factored into the value. If they do a good job with the valuation it would be somewhat close. they do seem to get closer with older players so, perhaps, the weakness with their system is with the youngest players. (and that is the group that EVERYONE has the most difficulty predicting with any kind of accuracy)
Sorry the question was meant to ask if the top MLS players are far above the top championship players as was posited in the original post.
Hey, look who it is arguing against things because they dont like the implications but really knows nothing about the the topic, The issue with Long is he isnt worth $7M. Just another over hyped MLS player with big deficiencies in his game.