US-Curaçao, post game

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by superdave, Jun 30, 2019.

  1. soccerusa517

    soccerusa517 Member+

    Jun 23, 2009
    Ohio
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Would be wise to make a coaching change. An organization that is well ran would cut their losses and admit mistakes were made with selecting Gregg. US soccer doesn't fit that description.

    We won't make any progress under the current coach.
     
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  2. AutoPenalti

    AutoPenalti Am I famous yet?

    Sep 26, 2011
    Coconut Creek
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We are not that.
     
  3. barnabyjonez

    barnabyjonez Member

    May 28, 2011
    The Valley, Saba
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    The next WC cycle will be very interesting. Mexico will still be Mexico, but Honduras, Costa Rica and the US have all gone downhill in a major way. As an outsider, I can't remember the US having such a faceless and mediocre team since the early to mid 90's. Guyana? T and T? Curacao? Could have it been set up any easier?
     
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  4. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Curaçao had something to do with that. I’m not referring to their quality, but their style. There were long, long stretches where they played like Austria and West Germany in that infamous 1982 game. What were we supposed to do?
     
  5. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    Mediocre I might give you, but faceless? Really? Methinks you might be seeing a narrative you want to see here...
     
  6. sXeWesley

    sXeWesley Member+

    Jun 18, 2007
    Club:
    Portland Timbers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    1) We could press them and/or at least meet them above the 18.

    2) WE could pass the ball around ourselves like professionals instead of panicking at the first sign of pressure.

    I totally agree with your tacitly stated overarching point though; we should hire their entire coaching staff ASAP.
     
  7. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We had the lead. We have another game in 3 days. Why expend the energy if they want to wank around in their own third?
     
  8. keller4president

    Jan 5, 2006
    The only silver lining of this tournament is knowing/hoping we'll be a whole lot better when the following players join the team, return from injury, or mature (hopefully quickly): Sargent, Pomykal, Soto, Saief, Cameron Carter-Vickers, Marlon Fossey, Andrew Gutman, Antonee Robinson, Shaq Moore, Holmes, Lletget, Amon, Weah, Novakovich, Dest, Mendez, de la Fuente, Ledezma, Sabbi. And Mukwelle Akale, George Acosta, and Giovanni Reyna.

    The future can't arrive quickly enough.
     
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  9. rgli13

    rgli13 Member+

    Mar 23, 2005
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    curacao took advantage of our complete retreat from the game. nothing more.
     
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  10. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    Press as a unit rather than a single front line.

    If they play like that there should be 21 players in their half of the field and zero space to move.
     
  11. Reccossu

    Reccossu Member+

    Jan 31, 2005
    Birmingham
    This is really a disaster. Even those of us who understand that haven't really accepted the depth of it yet.

    The problems are big and small and numerous, but here are the major categories:

    First, the US is at a modern era nadir of talent. It's not even close. Pulisic is the only player in current form who would have made any of the A teams since 1998.

    Second, Gagg is either stupid or stubborn. He is coaching as if his talent is excellent. It's exacerbating the talent problem.

    Since there is no way ussf will make a change, the only way for the US to get materially better will be for some remarkable and disproportionate number of the U-20s to have breakout seasons and absolutely force themselves onto the roster.

    Hope I'm overreaching, but this just looks and feels very bad.
     
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  12. MarioKempes

    MarioKempes Member+

    Real Madrid, DC United, anywhere Pulisic plays
    Aug 3, 2000
    Proxima Centauri
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There are some things to criticize for sure, but big picture... 4 games played, 4 wins, no goals conceded, we're in the semi-finals. Jamaica on Wednesday. Beat Jamaica and we've achieved the minimally acceptable goal. Let's just see how this plays out.

    I have to believe that the US players were instructed to conserve energy and play in a conservative manner in the second half.
     
  13. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    The problem is instead of dropping back...we went after them eventually, our lines got stretched over 70 yards and they carved through our midfield with numbers.
     
  14. skim172

    skim172 Member+

    Feb 20, 2013
    Costa Rica has a population of 5 million. Curacao has a population of 161,000.

    In the extremely unlikely case that Curacao's diaspora was ten times the size of their local population, the total number of people eligible to play for Curacao would be slightly more than a 3rd of Costa Rica's local population.

    There's an inaccurate characterization of Curacao as "Netherlands B" floating around. Curacao is a dependency of the Netherlands and all residents are Dutch citizens by birth. This provides for free movement of the population - however, eligibility for Curacao is still dependent on FIFA requirements. Meaning, either you're born there, you've lived there for 5 years, or your parents or grandparents were born there. When the native population is 160,000 - then the number of people who meet this criteria is quite small.

    This is the breakdown of the 23-man roster:
    Dutch Eredivisie: 6
    Dutch Eerste Divisie (2nd tier): 4
    Dutch Tweede Divisie (3rd tier, semi-pro): 2
    Belgian First Division B (2nd tier): 1
    English Championship (2nd tier): 1
    English League Two (4th tier): 2
    Portuguese LigaPro (2nd tier): 1
    Cypriot First Division: 1
    USL Championship: 1
    Saudi Professional League: 1
    Curaçao Promé Divishon (semi-pro): 3


    So, no - this is not "Netherlands B". And yes, Costa Rica is definitely better off than them.

    This is a case of a well-organized small team maximizing the most of their limited talents - especially in their keeper, Room, who is just on a real hot streak (and I'm not even sure if he's still contracted at PSV - if so, he hasn't played a game for them since 2017-18).

    And, maybe, it suggests that Gregg's system is not designed to maximize goalscoring. It certainly did feel like we pulled back and played defensive in the second half - which I'm not quite sure I support.
     
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  15. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Member+

    Nov 10, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    I mean I did say earlier I think after the 60th minute I think Greg basically said scew it let's get out of here with a win and regroup. Nothing is going right tonight. I don't like the approach, but I don't think it was the initial thought.

    Maybe. A lot of those guys need to start producing in the first team. I do think privately though Berhalter will admit he made some poor decisions with the roster. Does that do us any good? Not really.
     
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  16. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    I honestly think you are overreacting a bit, though you aren't wrong entirely.

    Simply because while I actually agree we are at a low ebb or talent AND I agree that Berhalter is trying to play a style of play that generally requires more talent ...

    a) It's still 3+ years to the WC
    b) We have potentially a lot of young talent on the way -- including some that is proven but not at the Gold Cup because it is hurt

    It's possible that talent is overrated and will not turn out. Or that it's a bit too young to make a difference. And at the same time, Berhalter or Earnie won't realize that.

    But I also think people are crazy if they think that the choice needs to be today or at the end of the Gold Cup. It's just not that hard to tell everyone -- 442! Press and Counter!

    Berhatler and Stewart have both made clear they are trying to build something more for the future. They may be wrong, but beating Curacao by a lot is not the end state. Neither is this Gold Cup.

    If the talent doesn't arrive, or the team doesn't improve, at some point you have to make a call. And given the 2018 cycle, I can understand that some people may be concerned that it comes too late.

    But whenever too late it, it's probably not today.
     
  17. LuckofLichaj

    LuckofLichaj Member+

    Mar 9, 2012
    Then we shouldn’t have had four players faux-pressing until Curaçao broke the first line and walked into our final third over and over and over again.

    Our shape was atrocious. We weren’t playing conservatively. Either these players still have absolutely no idea where they’re supposed to be in this system or Berhalter has no idea what he’s doing. Either way he’s failing.
     
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  18. butters59

    butters59 Member+

    Feb 22, 2013
    No, to me it looked that they were instructed to lose the game to avoid future embarrassment.
     
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  19. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Member+

    Nov 10, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    A bit of an overreaction. Was tonight bad? Absolutely. But I don't think it is all doom and gloom yet.
     
  20. CMeszt

    CMeszt Member+

    Farewell Sweet Prince
    Jan 9, 2004
    Gentrification's Apex.
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    wanking around in their third is what Djordje Mahailovic was born to do for the USMNT.
     
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  21. butters59

    butters59 Member+

    Feb 22, 2013
    Meanwhile Luchi is starting Cerillo, Servania, Pomykal and Ferreira in Portland.
     
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  22. Jazzy Altidore

    Jazzy Altidore Member+

    Sep 2, 2009
    San Francisco
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not quite. We don’t get regularly outplayed by some island outpost like Curacao.
     
  23. largegarlic

    largegarlic Member+

    Jul 2, 2007
    That felt like the Venezuela game, except Curacao was not as good as Venezuela, so we got a 1-0 win instead of a 3-0 loss.

    We allowed ourselves to be pulled out of shape by them passing back and forth (and back and forth, and back and forth) in the back, and we coughed up the ball pretty easily when they did press. Maybe it was just rust from not playing the Panama game, but I'd say there were a half dozen players on Curacao who had better touch tonight than anyone on the US (Pulisic included).
     
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  24. ChrisSSBB

    ChrisSSBB Member+

    Jun 22, 2005
    DE
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Drove me crazy to watch Steffen and the CB’s passing about inside their own 18 with Curacao players around them. Looked like we were more likely to pass it into our own goal then break out of our own end in a meaningful way.
     
  25. CMeszt

    CMeszt Member+

    Farewell Sweet Prince
    Jan 9, 2004
    Gentrification's Apex.
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Sorta on topic. Group D in the Nations League is Curacao, Costa Rica, Haiti. I may need to pay for FloSports just to see that one. Most of the other groups look unimpressive, but that one could be fun.
     
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