Yet the opposite is true. Pro/rel does serve a practical purpose and its anything but outdated. It followed the trajectory of every good idea in business. It started in one place and went viral everywhere. A good analogy is the supply chain. You don’t think pro/rel would work in the US. That’s your opinion. I’m very optimistic about pro/rel in the US because it’s essentially a free market idea based on meritocracy. That’s a concept Americans can understand. Would it work if it was forced in today? Or in two years? Of course not. It works when d2 is ready for it to work. To me that means a d2 that looks not all that different than what mls looks like passion wise with attendance around 12-15k avg instead of 20. It’s irrelvant that we don’t practice pro/rel in any other pro or college sport.
It's never really been a thing in American sports to name a league after the Confederacy. "Southern" or "Southeastern" or maybe even "Dixie" would be okay, I guess (although the latter probably went out of favor years after the cancellation of Dukes of Hazard LOL). The closest I found was this interesting read... WAS THERE REALLY A PROFESSIONAL BASEBALL TEAM CALLED THE CONFEDERATE YANKEES? After the Charleston church shooting, momentum gained steam to remove confederate monuments/memorials and last year, Robert E. Lee elementary school in Tulsa changed its name to Council Oak Elementary. The term "black people" is okay but the term "coloreds" has a very negative connotation dating back to segregation and Jim Crow laws. Needless to say, use of the "N" word is an absolute no-no, even if you claim you're only trash talking. Tulsa Roughnecks' Bastidas has contract terminated after racist abuse accusation ***ironic since the Roughnecks' coach, promoted from summer interim to head coach in the offseason, is a local product of Tulsa's youth club scene and a traditionally strong Booker T Washington HS program, and is one of the few black head coaches in pro soccer right now.
After all these years I think the whole argument boils down to this: I'm fine with them opening it so long as they do it responsibly, understanding and mitigating any risk. Don't do it for the sake of it. That's stupid. Don't make it the key mechanism in youth development. That approach is outdated & outmoded. Dispense with any notion that this is a mechanism for punishing teams or owners. Dispense with any notion that soccer is a warm and fuzzy environment where the unscrupulous get their just desserts. Understand that whatever reasons are otherwise put forth, most people choose EPL over MLS as they believe it to be the strongest league in the world. Pro/rel isn't going to change that.
I don’t know how popular pro/rel is with MLS fans in general. It’s my perspective that it’s quite popular with LAFC fans. But when i used to go to LAG games it didn’t seem popular. Then again it hardly ever came up. And maybe attitudes have changed since that was 10 years ago. The soccer circles in run in (LAFC ,American Outlaws, epl) pro/rel is quite popular. It’s actually not even a divisive issue. Most want it and it’s rare someone says it’s a bad idea. But if someone were to say that they won’t support an mls side that is local because there’s no pro/rel they would be looked down upon. I’ve only ever encountered that kind of fan online.
So then the support is only in glory hunting ? Funny, we've constantly got people trying to sell us far more than that in regards to what football, and clubs that play it mean to folks around the world. Though, if those of us in the US "can't say what would happen if a team was relegated because it hasn't been tried" (that's a constant line we get thrown at us) then surely you can't say what would happen upon a structural change anywhere else, can you? I mean that'd just be hypocritical ... Except he's already bought into Palace in the first division ... and owns stakes in multiple American sporting teams. Try again. If you think that money comes into teams in American sports leagues equally, you've got a hell of a lot to learn. Merit is merely a means of measuring something ... it IS NOT the definition of "results from sporting competition" like most of you like to assert it is. MERIT can be the financial measure of an ownership group, a market's potential viability to support a club, a results based point total, or literally anything you choose. Explain Arsenal then if this "superior" system of yours doesn't allow teams to be sloppy for years ... I'm a fan, and we've been sloppy for 13yrs now and the worst we've finished is 6th.
Ahem, if he's on the take of pharmaceutical companies to prescribe statins, while research has shown these pills have no effect I gladly put his prescription in the bin.
Ah, okay. I understand how you describe the vilification of certain words in the USA. I donot get why the word coloured is negatively regarded, even in relation to those laws you mention. I can't see the difference between black people and coloured people as a word. Those are in fact visual descriptions of how certain persons look like, not a condescending description of them as a person. The subtility is lost on me.
Nope, before that. There was a proposed breakaway in 1985 and I believe in 1990. And the Notts County chairman at the time voted in favor of forming the Premier League but refused to spend his own money on a striker to get us there.
Is it perhaps because the word "colored" was very commonly used in designating segregated facilities, such as bathrooms and water fountains, in the Jim Crow South?
I don't understand what coming 6th has to do with promotion and relegation. You understand that MLS teams win or lose on merit too right? Look what happened to the top ten spenders in 2018: 1. Toronto FC $26M - 19th overall 2. LA Galaxy $17M - 13th overall 3. NYC FC $14M - Conference semifinals (playoff second round) 4. Chicago $14M - 20th overall 5. LAFC $13M - knockout round (playoff first round) 6. Portland $12M - MLS Cup runners-up 7. Montreal $11M - 15th overall 8. Seattle $11M - Conference semifinals 9. Atlanta $11M - MLS Cup Champions 10.Colorado $11M 21st overall
Exactly. That's why the dudes constant relating P/R with clubs being 1-6 or less and money is so ridiculous. P/R has nothing to do with how clubs make their money. Glad you agree.
Glory hunting!!? You think 30,000+ people go through the turnstiles every weekend at Sunderland because they are 'glory hunters'! lol, no, they turn up every week convinced that they are on a return journey to the Premier League, they wouldn't be there if there was no chance of that. You think Arsenal have been 'sloppy'!? Really? THE bank of England club, sloppy? The beauty of the league is your club will finish where it deserves to finish, if Arsenal were as 'sloppy' as Sunderland then it would be Arsenal in League 1 along with them.
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/fans-love-message-aston-villa-16276818 Aston Villa into the final, probably to play Leeds who I think will eliminate Derby, two GIANT clubs who would simply not get the opportunity of a return to the Premier League if there was no pro/rel, one is still going to miss out! Very exciting for the fans.
Sunderland were also.known as "The Bank of England Club", more recently than Arsenal in fact, perhaps ironically because all the money they spent couldn't win then the title.
I don't ... gates, sponsors, and other forms of revenues certainly have "something to do" with p/r Right, so if there was no chance of ever attaining that Prem glory again, they wouldn't show up. That's exactly what I said. So you agree. Awesome. Yeah, they've been sloppy as hell ... LITERALLY gave the Cinderella Leicester club its title. Completely mismanaged Ozil, have had some of the worst "fix the issue" transfers in recent memory (Mustafi), continually don't address team needs (yeah Welbeck was a great fix for the ST position before buying TWO starter level STs in a one up top system), signing teen after teen only to continue to allow the first team to spread thinner and thinner buy not adding to cover for the injury bug that's been around since 2007 .... etc etc etc. Yes, they've been sloppy. Playoffs are great like that! I mean, they'd not get the opportunity if they didn't have 'em ...
I think Sunderland would sell out the Stadium of Light if they had the chance to win anything, even the Anglo-Italian Cup if that were ever revived. We had 5 visits to Wembley in 6 years.
Do you mean that because of the competitiveness going along with P/R it can make some managers/owners make stupid investment decisions to make a team viable enough to stay in? Do you mean because of the lack of competitiveness in a closed league as you cannot lose your spot in the league, managers/owners donot have to make investment decisions to prevent the loss of a spot, is a good thing?
Ironic that Leeds could miss out on promotion due to gentlemanly conduct. They literally defined ungentlemanly on and off the field during their glory days.
Because of how the Premier League in particular is set up, the richest team will always reap the lion's share of the revenues. This allows them to buy more merit in the form of better players so that even when a team like Man U or Arsenal has a bad year, they can remain in CL contention in spite of themselves. They've been able to horde enough talent so that they are pretty much guaranteed a shot at Euro competition if not a EPL title. On the opposite end, you have teams that come up and must go in to a lot of debt just to try and stay viable. Is it a stupid decision? Well, faced with the possibility that you'll get relegated and lose out of a lot of revenues, then what else are they supposed to do. The system is rigged in favor of the rich clubs. The system was set up by the big clubs. This is a feature not a bug. Where the hell do you get off saying closed leagues aren't competitive? Have you ever watched a closed league? It's been pointed out to you numerous times how much more competitive the US leagues are and don't play the mediocrity card. The NHL, NBA, NFL, and MLB are the top of the mountain at their sports with the cream of the crop in athletes. The worst NBA team would run away with championships in Europe. What make you think there's no incentive to improve? Read Moneyball or just do a quick Google search about American sports teams efforts to improve. Sure, some flop. My favorite baseball team brought in one of the best power hitters in the game but didn't get enough talent overall so they're probably not going to make the playoffs. The result of their past few years of ineptitude? They're currently in the bottom of the league in attendance in a city that loves its baseball team. There's in incentive to improve because winning improves business. The difference is that in the US we don't punish players and fans by not only having them suffer the sadness of a poor season but the further indignity of getting kicked down to a lower league only to be replaced by a team that got to face inferior competition. The manta "there's always next year" is true in the US and Canada. It's up to the owners and front offices of the crap teams to take advantage of the assistance they're given. Some do (Golden State, Cleveland Cavaliers, Houston Astros), some don't (Cleveland Browns, New York Knicks). If they don't improve the fans vote with their wallets and eyeballs.