The All-Encompassing Pro/Rel Thread on Soccer in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by bigredfutbol, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Addendum: only pro league that actually plays at more than 1 level.
     
  2. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  3. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    USL also has to adhere to the PLS, and, unlike MLS, they have no dependencies needed to implement pro/rel.
     
  4. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Or are you saying that you're literally lost and we should send help?
     
  5. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Well, that's what happens when you try to defend the indefensible.

    Really, this isn't difficult. If the USSF wanted a level playing field between closed and pro/rel leagues, how difficult would it be to fix the darn divisional standards to cater for pro/rel?
     
  6. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I think these guys may have a darn division.

    https://www.theartleague.org/content/events_special_exhibits
     
  7. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    But the USSF is maybe the only federation to support multiple leagues at the same levels.

    What specifically do you want fixed? Try putting it into words.
     
    HailtotheKing repped this.
  8. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    TBH, their "let a thousand flowers bloom" philosophy is why I think the standards could potentially be revised.
     
    USRufnex repped this.
  9. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Right, and if a couple of teams in smaller MSAs get promoted what stops them asking for a waiver and a review of the PLS?
     
  10. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Well, in USL's case, I think they'll be able to influence the ussf.
     
  11. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    These PLS are just another excuse to do nothing and blame the establishment.

    There's no reason they can't be revised. If USL or some magic fairy rival D1 or D2 proposes some reasonable amendments, and they are rejected to protect MLS position, then you at least have grounds for complaint.

    Here's the story from 1993 to 2017.

    https://rantingsoccerdad.com/2017/10/24/timeline-how-did-nasl-dispute-come-to-this/

    It was all fun and games until NASL blew itself up. Remember when NASL had it's application for yet another waiver turned down it only had 3 functioning teams.
     
    HailtotheKing repped this.
  12. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Try reading what I've written.

    Here's another clue: stop trying to deflect by droning on about NASL.
     
  13. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not deflecting. As I see it there is nothing in the PLS process to prevent pro/rel.
     
    HailtotheKing repped this.
  14. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    For the record, I mostly agree with your position. My reluctance to sign off on this point, though, is not because of conspiracies or malevolence, but bureaucracy: the federation meets, what, quarterly? And business moves slowly.
     
  15. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    PLS are reviewed annually. I don't see why that's a problem.
     
  16. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    That last provisional D2 sanction nixed a ton of conspiracy theories for me.

    That league looked dead in the water of its own doing.

    If the USSF really was trying to ruin NASL as an MLS competition, there was no reason not to do it then.

    The detractors have tried to make the "give them enough rope" argument but c'mon; for whose benefit?

    Fact is, in keeping with many of their NASL-related decisions, the took steps to give the league one final chance, going above and beyond in the process and the NASL once again failed to get their act together.

    Even then, the USSF didn't put the NASL on hiatus. That was their own decision which in part seemed fuelled by Commisso's objection to his team being in D3.

    In fact, IMO, that's a big driver of the Founders Cup. It's an attempt to deflect attention from where the Cosmos really are at present.
     
    HailtotheKing and CrazyJ628 repped this.
  17. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    What’s the relevance? Is he advocating scrapping pro/rel? Has anyone in the UK?

    Is it the consensus opinion that the lower divisions in the UK are not healthy?
     
  18. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is the consensus the chairman was discussing. He was also talking about how the value of being promoted last year was literally a buffer against the team's survival.
     
    HailtotheKing repped this.
  19. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's always been the consensus. Thankfully there's an over-supply of people who want to own a football club.
     
  20. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is EXACTLY where I'm at.
     
    HailtotheKing and barroldinho repped this.
  21. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd wager there's a lot of passing interest in it. It's just not a make-or-break cause with most people.

    Not that I know of. Most SGs care about the club, and certainly there's some anti-MLS sentiment out there, but that's usually not about this issue.
     
    barroldinho repped this.
  22. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    Pro/rel is what keeps the pyramid healthy. Without it the whole pyramid would collapse and lower division clubs would fold.

    I always hear about how Arrington Stanley is an example of pro/rel not being a benefit. But without pro/rel there wouldn’t be an AC.
     
  23. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Here's the specific Twitter thread I'm referring to, but his Twitter in general has some interesting takes on the same types of things talked about in this thread:
     
  24. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So how did the Football League survive from 1888 to 1987 when there wasn't a pyramid outside of the top four divisions?
     
    HailtotheKing and barroldinho repped this.
  25. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    Teams outside the football league were largely amateur or semi-pro. They still had a path to the football league through election but it wasn’t a clear path like promotion.

    The question you should be asking is , what if England scrapped the pro/rel system and every league was closed.
     

Share This Page