Am I the only one that misses what Abby Wambach brought to the table?

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by McSkillz, Feb 22, 2019.

  1. McSkillz

    McSkillz Member+

    ANGEL CITY FC, UCLA BRUINS
    United States
    Nov 22, 2014
    Los Angeles
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Slow? Yes. On the roster long after her effectiveness, yes. But damn, did she have some good plays where her head was involved. Who is our "big" now? and who is our header during corner kicks and free kicks? Are they effective as Wambach or was she like Hope Solo a great athlete that we had the joy of watching for a brief period of time that isn't automatically replaced?
     
  2. FanOfFutbol

    FanOfFutbol Member+

    The Mickey Mouse Club or The breakfast Club
    May 4, 2002
    Limbo
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Wambach was one of the best true center forwards to ever play in the women's game. We do not have anyone that can "replace" her and we are unlikely to ever have such. It is just like we will never replace Michell Akers, Mia Hamm, Kristine Lilly or any of a rather large number of retired greats. What we need is to have a "style" that fits the players, which are quite good, that we have rather than trying to find players that play a desired style.

    It is quite possible to have a very good, or even great, team without any true center forward.

    In fact a weakness of the earlier US teams, when we had Wambach, was that we had no one to replace her and when we lost her (broken leg just before a major tournament) the team and coaching staff just fell apart because our whole style depended on her.

    I think the current squad is better than the team with Wambach but you are correct we have no one that dominates in front of goal.

    Ertz looked, for quite a while, like she would be the go to player on corners but, for some reason, she has become less effective on corners since she moved forward in the formation. Maybe she is a little less hungry because she is more involved in the play.

    There is also the fact that our whole youth and college system is now over emphasizing possession and the skills needed for a center forward is not taught as much. We (The whole country) needs to re-balance our programs so that direct play is just as desirable as the slow build up possession game. Both styles have their merits and the best teams should play such that they attack with equal ability using both styles and even switching in the middle of an attack.

    Most teams easily go from direct to possession if the direct attach breaks down but few ever even try to switch to direct when they start an attack with possession.

    You also touched indirectly on another part of the problem, the lack of a real world class goalkeeper. With Solo or Scurry in goal the players believed that if they over committed forward trying to score the keeper would bail them out. They do not have the same confidence in our current crop of keepers.

    But, yes I miss Wambach. She had heart and courage that few player have. Moving back to the broken leg incident: I remember her being carried off the field and still trying to give directions and encouragement to the younger players. She was one of a kind and we will not replace her.
     
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  3. jackdoggy

    jackdoggy Member+

    May 16, 2014
    Big D
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sooooooooooo, you are asking if I miss Abby Wambach. If I started to write how much I miss our former players I would not get anything else done till they plant me.

    FofF touched on many salient points. Her talent, instincts and size was something that the game has never seen and 184 goals speaks for itself. I wish I had a dollar for every minute of sleep lost by opposing coaches trying to figure out how to stop her. Not a big memorabilia guy but glad that I see this every day:
    IMG_0077.jpg

    Hope, and the Aura of Hope may never ever be equaled or exceeded, No one else, not even Manuel frickin Neuer could have psyched out Celia Sasic to miss that Penalty in the Semis back in 2015. While some members survive, I miss the group of original Female Bad *sses that comprised the Department of Defense
    Co4pvaSXgAECPdA.jpg
     
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  4. Semblance17

    Semblance17 Member+

    United States
    Apr 27, 2013
    Lighthouse Point, FL
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I adore KO but I must make a correction: this is the original Department of Defense that formed the centerpiece of a major tournament-winning team, specifically the one that turned two stars into three.
    Screen Shot 2019-02-23 at 6.43.19 PM.png

    As for Miss Wambach, I often reminisce about her huddle pep talk at halftime in the U.S.-China quarterfinal: "First ten minutes, we get a ****ing goal."
     
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  5. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Yep, we fell so far apart that all we managed in that Tournament was the gold medal.

    Angela Hucles was such a failure as her replacement that she only scored four goals, and only got the silver boot...

    Sheesh It is one thing to be an Eeyore-- everybody does that now and then (except Jackdoggy,) but it is quite another when your pessimism attempts to alter what is already in the books...
     
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  6. FanOfFutbol

    FanOfFutbol Member+

    The Mickey Mouse Club or The breakfast Club
    May 4, 2002
    Limbo
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I am sorry. It is well known on these boards that my ancient brain sometimes gets time lines messed up and confusing one tournament with another is one of the ways it shows.

    I still do not think that the loss of Wambach was well handled. But we did win and I guess that makes up for what I saw as problems.
     
  7. hocbz

    hocbz Member

    Feb 15, 2016
    She definitely had a presence/leadership qualities/tough mentality that I don't see from anyone on this current team. That's why they brought her to the world cup. Ertz is really the closest thing to a vocal leader they have (maybe O'Hara who never plays). Regarding the "captains", I've never seen anything from Morgan or Lloyd resembling "rallying the troops" so to speak, for club or country. Seems like they were chosen for marketing reasons but I could be wrong. Morgan is a good player but I find her captaincy very puzzling. Becky made more sense as someone who calmly talks to refs, is level headed and calms her teammates, etc.
     
  8. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    Wambach papered over the fact that American players lack technical skills. Unlimited subs, which you find in most amateur soccer in the USA, especially the NCAA, is a rule difference that radically changes the game. Players can go all out for short periods, rest, then come in and do it all again. The rule leads to a much more physical, less tactical and technical game.

    Just a few years ago, when MLS was mostly NCAA grads, the league was the same way. European players would come here and talk about how everyone runs for miles for no purpose. Now that TAM has altered the player pool in MLS to be more foreign (and the DA has players playing more with less subs and no-reentry) the league style of play is really changing.

    But for the women, who mostly play NCAA then turn pro, and the NWSL, it is the same run, run, run, run harder soccer. Teams like Japan that can play as a team and pass, can hang with us and probably beat us even though are women are superior athletes. At the senior level we also have the luxury of having 2-3 really technical players. One that skipped NCAA and went to France, and two who just seem to be outliers. But at the senior level your player pool is 12-15 years long. At the youth level, the USA is rarely competitive anymore.

    Wambach was simply a physical freak (in a good way) and would allow the USA to run, run, run, and then just cross it to her over the heads of the Japanese.

    So, I don't miss her because eventually, we have to start playing soccer. You hear locked in USWNT players like Morgan, Dunn, Lloyd talking about how they had to go to Europe to work on the technical part of their game. That is astounding if you think about it.
     
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  9. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    From what I've seen (and I haven't seen everything), Julie's drop off is because Jill always has her making a near post run, that takes her wide of the post. The only way she's going to score is via a ridiculous low percentage flick on that somehow finds it's way through a whole bunch of bodies. The soccer equivalent of a "seeing eye grounder."

    I don't know if (on the set pieces I've seen) Julie has been reduced to decoy status; or, because Julie has converted a few of those amazing shots, Jill thinks she can do it. Most likely Jill feels like Julie is the only player in the world that can convert near post corners like that, leave the headers in the box to someone else.

    Either way, I disagree with having Julie always making beyond the near post (as in outside of the frame) runs on set pieces.
     
  10. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Or maybe there's an important tournament coming up and Jill wants to give people a chance to forget what she can do to them? I mean this isn't the kind of situation where various forms of sandbagging aren't predictable...
     
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  11. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    That's a great group. Sauerbrunn should go down as our best CB ever. Kling's contribution to the WC, to me, goes unrecognized. She was the playmaker. So much of what we did came via Kling overlapping and making incisive passes.* O'Hara, I was not a fan of early on, but she has improved sooooo much. Her passing now is excellent.

    *A lot of what allowed Kling to be the playmaker was Pino's willingness and ability to cover back for her. I think that the Dunn/Pino left side combo is sort of an attempt to recreate that. It doesn't look like it will pan out as well, b/c I don't think Pino has the speed to cover back like she did (though she is certainly still willing), and Dunn is not as good of a passer as Kling, which speaks volumes for Kling.
     
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  12. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    That makes sense. Let's hope it's that.
     
  13. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    I always kind of thought Sydney would be a good replacement as a 9. (play Alex in one of the attacking winger positions) She's really good in the air. And it would give the position a multidimensional aspect. But, I guess Syd never got any kind of form back?
     
  14. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    She got pregnant again, didn't she?
     
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  15. socalsoccer23

    socalsoccer23 Member

    Jan 4, 2017
    Yes...Sydney pregnant with baby #2.
     
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  16. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    I had no idea she has a 2nd one on the way. Congrats Sydney!
     
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  17. cpthomas

    cpthomas BigSoccer Supporter

    Portland Thorns
    United States
    Jan 10, 2008
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's exactly what I said to my wife during the game when she wondered about why all the near post corner attempts.
     
  18. FanOfFutbol

    FanOfFutbol Member+

    The Mickey Mouse Club or The breakfast Club
    May 4, 2002
    Limbo
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I kinda thought she might be trying to emulate Joy Fawcett but, if my old memory is not failing again, Joy played more around her pregnancies. But, regardless, any woman that has one baby and the actually chooses to have another has more grit and toughness than I. The pain of delivery with the months of the body misbehaving leading up to birth followed by the recovery while taking care of said baby would kill most well above average men.

    I am real glad men can't get pregnant. But, if they could, the population explosion would be less of a problem as very few families would have more than one child.
     
  19. RalleeMonkey

    RalleeMonkey Member+

    Aug 30, 2004
    here
    We'll see.
     
  20. cpthomas

    cpthomas BigSoccer Supporter

    Portland Thorns
    United States
    Jan 10, 2008
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I agree. It could be an intentional diversion, or it could be something Ellis wants them to do all the time. I hope the former.
     
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  21. Smallchief

    Smallchief Member+

    Oct 27, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I'd agree with that -- and I've been puzzled as to why Kling is not on the team now.
     
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  22. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Old and small are clearly not Ellis' preferences in outside backs, and she also clearly did not think either Kling or Kreiger were offense minded enough. I'm a big Kling fan myself, but I can see why she favors the others...
     
  23. Glove Stinks

    Glove Stinks Member+

    Jan 20, 2014
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Crazy thing is Syd showed up to Pride preseason camp 6 mos prego and was going full speed yesterday
     
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