Direct quote from me re: Lainez: "Sure, he's pulled ahead." My stance is that that simply doesn't matter right now......... There are people on here -- and, of course, G. Kleiban -- who have doubted how talented Carleton is. Others think that he is on his way to rehab or too sensitive to what people are writing about him to be great. It's not that posters have said they don't want Andrew to be successful; it's that they have said they don't think he will be. Debating the details of the race analogy is very contrarian of you. The point is that making any conclusions about where these players will end up based on where they are right now is a complete waste of time.
And, let's stop with the childish "huge fan" with his picture over my bed talk. This whole conversation is ridiculous, but I don't think we have to get to that level....
The reason Carleton has his own thread is because he’s controversial, evidenced by the last few pages. This is not me taking a side, just noting an observation.
I gotta stop coming here thinking there’s actual news. Let’s see what kind of playing time he gets in preseason, especially towards the end of the preseason.
He played a fair amount in preseason two years ago and a lot last year. I think we're going to have to wait for the actual games to make any real conclusions.
I thought we stopped seeing him the last couple games in last year’s preseason. Then everyone was disappointed he was only making the bench the first couple games.
I think the comments tended to be along the lines of teachable and able to learn. I took that as a comment that was independent of their initial tactical sophistication. I also remember some comments (or at least one comment) attributing it to the fact that many American players went to college which was different from the typical European or South American player. Whether or not that is a valid statement, it stands out in my memory.
Last year was all about USL experience and introducing him to first team professional football. He played well in preseason, but he was never going to be a part of the first team early in the year, or, as it turns out, much late in the year either. Disappointing that he was not used more, but it's not like that is reason to panic about his long term trajectory. There are only two logical reasons why AC was not playing more regularly last season: a. there was a long term plan put in place long ago that laid out a specific path for his development and the organization has stuck to that path, or b. the club has concerns over Andrew's maturity. Considering the potentialvalue of their asset, and the lack of urgency to bring AC into the squad, it seems overwhelmingly likely that explanation A makes the most sense as they are choosing to bring him along just a tad more slowly. Did explanation B also play a part? That might be likely, too. In any case.... that's all in the past. There is no way that Carleton doesn't play a role in the squad this year. It is easy to justify not playing a 17 year old who hardly has any professional minutes and is not physically mature yet. It is impossible, however, to justify not playing an 18 year old youth star when you are the coach that has been brought in to bridge the academy and first team. That is especially true when you consider how well many of his contemporaries are doing. Maybe he has regressed. Maybe he will become an addict and end up in rehab like someone on here said. Maybe he is as good as advertised. We'll just have to wait and see.
With Almiron and Tata out, and Pity and DeBoer in with Barco, do people expect a more possession based system and less pressing? That would help Carleton.
Who knows...………………….. So far you just replace Almiron with Pity Martinez. How has Carleton's situation on the depth chart changed?
A fresh start with a new manager who doesn’t have the bad taste of Carleton’s indiscretions in his mouth is a pretty significant change. Pity may be a problem, but Atl is also playing in CCL, so there will be some chances to earn playing time. He’s really going to have to impress tho and be consistently good every game he plays. A nice play here and there isn’t enough
Almiron was very active defensively and pressed hard for 90'. Barco didn't quite fit that, being more of a possession player not run and gun. I'm hearing Pity is too. New coach too. New style and new coach usually means the old depth chart is out the window. Plus, reports were AC had problems learning to press like Almiron. Maybe that isn't an issue anymore because nobody on Atl can do it.
Can't wait any longer. Per longstanding BigSoccer tradition, conclusions must precede observations, sorry.
Imagine a universe in which Andrew Carleton gets one MLS start for every argument about him on BigSoccer...
What this thread needs is someone in Atlanta to sneak out to some of these preseason practices and see how Carlton is doing. A quick look at the Atl twitter feed and I saw him in one picture. Here at FCD I could watch the first team practices this week and last week if interested in how the young kids were doing other than what is reported( there is a lot of reporting on FCD preseason) but I don't see that on ATL. A daily report of how he did in practice would be interesting.
this is now better than the muwkelle akale thread. i'm rooting for the kid to produce this year.... but it would be really interesting itt if he has another bad year
Meh, this happens all the time. Tata had a similar issues in Barca except that he was trying to get them to play more direct. The players didn't like it because they were used to having more possession. De Boer was trying to get Inter to modernize their tactics. Positional play is using player rotation to open up passing lanes. Back when the Italians where the height of tactics they went in for more of a zonal approach. So I suspect that there was cultural backlash going on here. Leave it to Gardner to turn this in to an issue of Latins vs N. Europeans. Now that Italy didn't even make it to the WC in 2018 they are going for a more modern approach.
What's there to say at this point? don lamb believes that AC will perform so well at ATL this season that he earns a USMNT starting spot over - Sargent - Weah even though both players are getting playing time for teams far better than ATL. I hope he's right that AC does earn real minutes at ATL and sparks a conversation when it's warranted (which isn't now!)
- I have Sargent as the starting 9. How do I have Carleton over him? - Weah is far less talented than Carleton, but I admit there is an argument to be made selecting him over Carleton. I wouldn't, but the argument can be made. At the same time, I do not believe that you can make an argument that Celtic is a lot better than Atlanta or that the SPL is far superior to MLS. Why is this statement made with such doubt: "don lamb believes that AC will perform so well at ATL this season that he earns a USMNT starting spot"? Have you not noticed what has happened with Pulisic, McKennie, Sargent, Weah, and Adams recently? They were all youth national team standouts, and they are all locks for the full national team roster at 18-20 years old. Our U21 group is vastly more talented than the groups ahead of them. Carleton is a bright spot within that group. Why would we doubt so much that he could project to becoming such an important part of the full national team in the not so distant future?
Sigh. I don't doubt that he "could project to becoming such an important part of the full national team in the not so distant future." I, and others, are saying that he hasn't earned it as of yet and each of Pulisic, McKennie, Sargent, Weah, and Adams has by earning either more minutes at the same level or equal minutes at a significantly higher level. As to the Celtic vs. Atlanta, 538 global club ranking has Celtic @ 70 Atlanta @ 178 I'm not wading into the MLS vs. SPL debate because it's not relevant to Celtic vs. Atlanta.
Have I said that he should have been in January camp? Have I said that Pulisic, McKennie, and Sargent should move out of the way and let him take the national team to elite levels? I've said: - he's a Pulisic level talent - he's better than Weah - he's progressed quickly through the ranks and has performed on the field at every level - he potentially has maturity issues that are holding him back - he should be a starter in an ideal best 11 for the national team in the next 6-18 months - he still has quite a bit to prove on the field with Atlanta United Why on Earth do people take such offense to these things? It's a pitiful reaction to an optimistic outlook that is actually grounded in watching these players play and a lifetime of playing and coaching the game.