PBP Thread: Match #6, Peru vs Denmark, 16 June 2018 [R]

Can't wait for this game. I have a soft spot for both sides (old enough to remember 1978, and for Eriksen as a Spurs fan) and my dream is that somehow France implodes and they both qualify.

 

So you're saying individual "international exposure" is better than team "international experience"?
This Peru team has less individual "international exposure" than previous teams, yet those other Peru teams didn't qualify. These guys qualify despite not being in top leagues and with their "Starts" (Guerrero /Farfan) not in their "prime" and with the added pressure that comes with so many years of being away from the WC...

 

Should be a good game. Could go either way.

 

You are right by the value parameter, mr. Ceres. And truly, Eriksen is one of a kind, that makes us proud of having a world class, player like the guy from Middelfart.

Value parameter and quality of a given player is by a number of reason not always equivalent. In my perception Zlatan is the best Scandinavian player in recent time alongside Michael Laudrup. But If Eriksen has a good tournament, he might end up in Barca or Real Madrid. And the the sky is the limit for Eriksen

 

Peruvians say they fear their team will underperform due to shaky legs. But is more like it's the fans who aren't used to see Peru in a WC.

Yes, Denmark can win. But Peru has faced stronger sides and came up ahead. For instance, Peru hasn't conceded more than 1 goal in each of its past 14 matches, and only 1 overall during the last 7. Since this line–up began playing together, by May 2016, it achieved the respectable record of +17-3=7, losing only once by a margin of 2, while playing twice to Brazil, Argentina and Colombia, and once to Uruguay and Chile. And that's why Peru is above Denmark both in FIFA and Elo rankings.

So, in my book, Peru has the better possibilities.

 

Not true.

They had lots more time to think it over, as actually it was them who found out about the uneligibility of Nelson Cabrera, to play for another team diferent to his homeland NT. If our FA wouldn't have presented the case to FIFA, their FA was going to present it, anyway, themselves. At the end, their FA presented their objections to FIFA, the same day the chilean FA did, a few hours after.

 

man you're all getting all worked up. #triggered lol

 

I’ll never understand how people can dream about bad things happening to others lol. What a toxic mentality.
I have few nations I don’t root for at all in this world cup but I wish them all the best.

To get back to the match I always liked Denmark as a footballing nation but somehow Peru got my sympathy aswell, maybe due to the fact that I’ve never seen them in a world cup.

Soo I’d like a draw

 

Toxic, that's funny. How dare a neutral have a preference. A 'dream' is used to mean something unlikely to happen, as well as something deeply wished for.

 

There are preferences, and bad wishes lol

 

I'd say from Argentina to Chile, any of the 4 teams would have deserved to qualify. The difference was tiny. Two points and four goals difference separate the 3rd from the 6th. In 18 matches. This means these teams were absolutely at the same level. I'm happy that the one that got to the playoffs was able to guarantee the slot do South America.
At this level there are no special qualities that make this or that qualify. It's sometimes just a question of luck. Or like you said, a penalty or a red card.
But in the case of Cabrera ... there are no "ifs", like "if that PK had been given" or "if he hadn't lost that 100% chance" ... In that case the results were done. There were no matches to play.
Without Cabrera's affair Peru would be out. And Chile (or New Zealand) would be in.
And no "ifs".
But well ... this is the past. And I hope Peru represents South America well in the group. The Conmebol has the best rate of getting to the 2nd round of all confederations, what more than justifies so many slots. I hope Peru helps us to keep it this way.

 

The "if" applied to Peru's defensive line, not to Cabrera.

There's no conditional in Bolivia inscribing a player who couldn't play for them. They made a mistake, or guessed they would get out with it without anyone noticing it, plain cheating, no conditional. Curiously, it was a Bolivian radio pressman who denounced it, a month later (and yes, he got death treats from all over Bolivia).

Anyways, the whole discussion wasn't if there was cheating, but that the rules stated that the complaint had to be done within 24 hours after the match's ending, which is as intelligent as saying that unless you can identify something was stolen from you after 24 hours, then you lose all your rights on the subject.

Conmebol payed no ears to Chile's complaint (sticking to the reglament, thus defending Bolivia's right to cheat and go unpunished), so they went to the TAS, and to add weigh to it they convinced Peru to go with them.

Then all the bad press this issue received, from those not cheating or cheated, was because it went against their interests, and not because fairness.

 

A few things here :

1. Conmebol never saw the case, as it wasn't up to Conmebol decide what to do about it.

2. Chile and/or Peru, never presented a formal official complaint, as to do that, FA's have to present it before 24 hours the match which generated the issue, had finished.

What Chile's and Peru's Federations presented before FIFA, was an objection over a FIFA rule being breached, and FIFA decided to act on it, on its own.

The reasons why it went to the CAS (TAS in spanish), was because the bolivian FA, presented before the CAS, an objection to what FIFA had ruled on relation to the points of the matches deducted and the fine they handed to them, which also was a lot of money.

All FA's in Conmebol, not only the ones of Bolivia, Peru and Chile, but also from everybody else, were invited by the CAS, to present their points of view on relation to the case.

For the CAS, it always was Bolivia's FA vs. FIFA. And the CAS at the end, denied the bolivians everything, and found nothing to support their thesis, so they lost the points and also still had to pay the fines imposed over them by FIFA.

 

Before? Are you sure?

And yes, Conmebol refused to accept the complaint. That's what I said.

TAS is its original name: Tribunal Arbitral du Sport. Most of such organizations use French, such as Fédération Internationale de Football Association (FIFA).

Other than that, you're saying that the Bolivian FA was the one who actually presented the complaint (and not Chile's), because they didn't want to pay a single dollar.

Source?

 

Ah, Peruvian "sports" press. Several players, with more than enough "pedigree", were separated because they weren't in good shape. And Gareca was praised for doing it.

Now that it seems he'll do the same with Guerrero (8 months without playing is quite a bit), the press says: "No! Not our God!" Tss tss tss.

But even if Guerrero is in good shape, as Sweden defenders had no problems neutralizing him, it's foreseeable the Danish won't have issues either. Yes, yes, Guerrero is singled for his strength, but that's bread and butter for European defenders.

Against them, attacking with ball technique seems a reasonable bet... and –anyways– that's how Peru plays since forever. On a sad note, I'll miss his free–kicks (and his courage) if he's not in the pitch.

 

Over the TAS / CAS naming, ok you win (I forgot that actually its offices are in Switzerland, using french as their main language)

source for what I posted before : look what they have, at their own site :

http://www.tas-cas.org/fileadmin/user_upload/Media_Release_Bolivia_02.03.17.pdf
.
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About the first part of your post , you simply don't get it : WC qualifiers are ruled by FIFA, not by any particular world Confederation, and so, Conmebol had no say in anything of this, at any time. Nobody presented any complaint before Conmebol, either.

 

One of the games I await during group stages. I always liked Danish football, and Peru also has my sympathy - I missed them for these 36 years. It will be a close affair, but I predict 2:1 Denmark - Eriksen, Poulsen, Sisto and Schmeichel are all capable of great stuff. Btw, I missed all scores predictions until now...

 

Should one punt at the sportsbooks, a draw would be tempting. Naturally it could go either way in a clash with two teams with a good pedigree. I would be surprised If there will be scored 3 or more goals in the match.

 

Aye, but I didn't mention the unbeaten streak. The results including the double games versus Brazil, Argentina and Colombia, and the single ones versus Uruguay, Chile and Croatia: +3-2=4. Against those, Denmark has its +1-0=0 to Poland, and it can be argued if Poland is better than Denmark or Peru.

Now, regardless of Peru's solid numbers, Denmark has the quality and team play to defeat Peru, but I dispute betting houses and Europeans giving Denmark as favorites, as they base their predictions on the clubs the players play for (?), when such criteria was proven wrong by Peru by the mere procedure of qualifying.

 

That's what Conmebol said to ANFP when they talked about the subject. It's the same as Guerrero and Oviedo talking to Infantino. It doesn't change the fact that Conmebol talked to Chile, and FIFA to Peru.

On TAS resolution after Bolivian FA appeal, you forgot to mention the involvement of Chilean FA in the sanction, as otherwise Bolivia wouldn't have had to appeal a thing. Tss tss, details.

Curiously, it wasn't Chileans alone who didn't think it would help Peru more than anyone. Colombian and Argentinian press singled out Chile for the out–of–date complaint.

 

This game should be fun... Peruvians everywhere in Russia... I expect them to outnumber the Danes in the crowd by quite a but.

 

Given that you by betting houses mean bookmakers - sportsbooks - Denmark and Peru is almost even odds, albeit Denmark is slight favorite.