WC 2018 Group B: Spain Portugal Iran Morocco

Discussion in 'GROUP B: Portugal, Spain, Iran, Morocco' started by +PL+, Dec 1, 2017.

  1. gfx_bq1

    gfx_bq1 Member

    Mar 19, 2016
    While not being a neutral on portugal vs iran (it's not close) i am neutral on the issue of Morocco vs Iran I'd say the following:
    The CAF teams generally (Morocco, Algeria, Senegal, Nigeria,,) have far superior players (it's not even comparable), the asian teams (Iran, Saudi, Japan, Korea) have more cohesive, organized teams and better federations to ensure the teams don't have periodic meltdowns (ie like Algeria and Ivory coast have right now)
    My bias is towards talent mainly because a team with talent like Nigeria can gel and make a great run. Japan, Iran or Saudi won't do that (unless FIFA cheats to help them like Korea/Japan got in 2002).
    So I'd say Morocco is likely to beat Iran, that said the difference isn't enormous and on the day of the match tactics could give Iran a chance to win. The Iranian fans shouldn't feel bad about feeling like they have a chance to win this match, they do though they aren't favorites. They just have virtually no chance to qualify. The Moroccan fans meanwhile should feel comfortable in asserting they have a far superior WC history and players, this is also true. However the gap between the teams isn't enormous and on the day of the match anything can happen.
     
  2. Perspolis#1

    Perspolis#1 Member+

    Jun 27, 2011
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Rest assured FoxNews... refereeing calls never go Irans way.

    Whenever Bernardo Silva or Ronaldo feel like the game has been 0-0 for too long they can dive and the ref will be too happy.
     
  3. Salas033

    Salas033 Member

    Juventus
    Dec 15, 2017
    United States
    Nat'l Team:
    Morocco
    Algeria lost at home against Cabo Verde 2-3. I'm not even an Algerian fan and I'm concerned for Algeria in their game against Portugal in Portugal. It could easily turn into a massacre score-wise like that famous France vs Algeria game of 2001.

     
  4. monster- exodia

    May 23, 2018
    Nat'l Team:
    Morocco
    been rumored that players are losing on purpose to get rid out of their coach.
     
  5. gfx_bq1

    gfx_bq1 Member

    Mar 19, 2016
    #3455 gfx_bq1, Jun 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2018
    Actually I completely agree with you (not sure what's up with the name calling).
    Unlike Saudi and their big money or Korea and Japan with huge consumer markets fifa has no reason to favor Iran. I'd speculate and say FIFA will do everything they can to get India and China into the WC. That's probably the biggest reasons the WC is expanding. Honestly I'd like to continue seeing an underdog like Iran dominate Asia as this will likely annoy fifa and the powers that be.
     
  6. JoseEmidio

    JoseEmidio Member+

    Dec 6, 2009
    London
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    Nat'l Team:
    Portugal
    Cabo Verde is a Portuguese speaking country and they are not a bad side. Portugal lost to them 0-2 at home in 2015 on Bernardos debut for Portugal. We Will see how they fare against Portugal.
     
  7. JoseEmidio

    JoseEmidio Member+

    Dec 6, 2009
    London
    Club:
    SL Benfica
    Nat'l Team:
    Portugal
    Bernardo, who is my favourite player for Portugal now is not a diver, at least not in his Benfica-Monaco days, I do not watch the PL but he still does not dive for Portugal (there might of been the odd dive but they were very far apart). The rest I agree with.
     
  8. Salas033

    Salas033 Member

    Juventus
    Dec 15, 2017
    United States
    Nat'l Team:
    Morocco
    I wouldn't be surprised. Madjer is a very bad coach. They can do so much better.
     
  9. Salas033

    Salas033 Member

    Juventus
    Dec 15, 2017
    United States
    Nat'l Team:
    Morocco
    Yea, Moroccan fans know them very well. Our team beat them home and away in Renard's first 2 games as our coach in 2016 for the 2017 AFCON qualifiers. They are a top 20 African side but Algeria should be able to beat them easily especially at home.
     
  10. persianfootball

    persianfootball Member+

    Aug 5, 2004
    outside your realm
    what you are failing to see is that your first 2 points are completely irrelevant in terms of what will happen in the next few weeks. the last point is only somewhat relevant, and i dont even believe morocco showed anything much more special than Iran this year.

    dont commit the rookie mistake of the south korean posters. they had been running their mouths on here saying the same irrelevant points as you (i.e. "we have more players in top leagues/teams") yet Iran won something like 5 of our last games against them. their premier league forward failed to score a single goal against us in these 5 games. you are forgetting that football is a team sport, filled with tactics, psychology, and other important factors. paper value only goes so far in terms of determining the outcome of the match, and il give you a hint: the level of the gap between morocco and Iran is not sufficient for doing so. against a team like spain, sure, their paper value is so much higher than ours that we can say it will 90% determine the outcome of a match against us, but we cannot say the same thing about morocco.
     
  11. AK8 Wizard

    AK8 Wizard New Member

    Persepolis
    Iran
    Jun 1, 2018
    #3461 AK8 Wizard, Jun 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2018
    I totally agree with majority of your comment. It seems some people here are just simply trolling to rile up Iranian fans.

    After watching many highlights of friendly and official matches of Iran, Morocco, Portugal and Spain for few weeks. I rate them as

    1. Spain
    2. Portugal
    3. Iran
    4. Morocco

    Based on 2017-2018 results against top 80 teams on fifa ranking

    Morocco:
    Competitive matches (fr=friendly)(h=home)
    Morocco 0-1 Finland (fr)
    Morocco 0-1 Congo
    Morocco 1-0 Ivory coast (h)
    Morocco 0-1 Egypt
    Morocco 2-0 Burkina Faso (fr)(h)
    Morocco 1-0 Tunisia (fr)(h)
    Morocco 1-2 Netherlands (fr)(h)
    Morocco 0-1 Cameroon
    Morocco 6-0 Mali (h)
    Morocco 0-0 Mali
    Morocco 3-1 S.Korea (fr)
    Morocco 2-0 Ivory Coast
    Morocco 2-1 Serbia (fr)
    Morocco 0-0 Ukraine (fr)

    14 matches 7 win 2 draw 5 loss 18 GF 8 GA (1.28 for 0.57 against goal ratio per matches) If take out a 6-0 win against Mali at home, the ratio is 0.85 goal per match.

    Other matches
    Morocco 3-1 Togo
    Morocco 2-0 Uzbekistan (fr)(h)
    All result analysis: 16 matches 9 win 2 draw 5 loss 23 GF 9 GA (1.43 goals for 0.56 against per match)

    Iran:
    Competitive matches (fr=friendly)(h=home)
    Iran 1-0 China (h)
    Iran 2-1 Montenegro (in Montenegro)
    Iran 0-0 S.Korea
    Iran 2-2 Syria (h)
    Iran 1-1 Russia (in Russia)
    Iran 2-1 Panama (fr)
    Iran 1-0 Venezuela (fr)
    Iran 0-1 Tunisia (in Tunisia) (fr)
    Iran 2-1 Algeria (fr)
    Iran 1-2 Turkey (in Turkey) (fr)

    10 matches 5 win 3 draw 2 loss 12 GF 10 GA (1.2 for 1 against goal ratio per matches)

    Other matches:
    Iran 1-0 Qatar
    Iran 2-0 Uzbekistan (h)
    Iran 1-0 Uzbekistan (fr)(h)
    Iran 2-0 Togo (fr)(h)
    Iran 4-0 Sierra Leon (fr)(h)
    All result analysis: 15 matches 10 win 3 draw 2 loss 22 GF10 GA (1.46 goals for 0.66 against per match)

    Result analysis
    Conclusion 1: Just using competitive analysis Morocco has statistically slightly better attacking records due to a 6-0 win over Mali at home. Taking that single result out makes Iran significantly better at attacking (1.2 goal per game over 0.85). Using the same analysis makes Morocco significantly better at defense by 0.57 conceded goal per game compared to Iran record of 1 goal/game.

    Conclusion 2: using all matches analysis Iran is better offensively (1.46 goals per match vs 1.43) and Morocco is better defensively(0.56 conceded goals per match vs 0.66)

    Subjective conclusion: Iran and Morocco both had played against European teams. Iran's record is win 1 draw 1 loss 1 while Morocco is won 1 draw 1 loss 2. While all Iranian matches been played in opponent turf while Morocco were in neutral venue or home stadium. Iran has played a wide variety of opponents (South American, African, European and Asian) while Morocco matches are more against other African teams.

    There are only 3 teams that both Iran and Morocco has played against. Tunisia, S.Korea and Uzbekistan.

    Morocco played against Tunisia and Uzbekistan in Morocco and against South Korea in neutral ground with 3 wins while Iran played against Uzbekistan in Iran, against Tunisia (in Tunisia) and S.Korea (in S.Korea) with 2 win 1 draw 1 loss.

    Iran has a record of 4 win 1 draw in last 5 matches between Iran and S.Korea and Iran only lost to Tunisia with our first choice offensive players being on bench and we lost due to an own goal in a stadium full of Tunisian fans.

    Watch the results and analysis and draw your own conclusion. I know Iranian team better and based on watching all friendlies and reading from different analysis from different angles I think Iran and Morocco have produced similar and close results. I gave Iran a slight edge because of most of our results came of playing on our opponent's turf and having a better offensive selection. Morocco obviously has a better defensive selection. I don't base my decision only based on market value of players because I saw the result in last world cup. Iran vs Argentina should have been 5-0 for Argentina if we wanted to go based on value of the players on the paper.
     
  12. Perspolis#1

    Perspolis#1 Member+

    Jun 27, 2011
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I find some of your descriptions of friendlies to be "Tucker Carlson" like.

    Saudi spends massively for influence in AFC and gets foreigners to play in their league, Japan/SK do it thru commercial markets for influence.

    Iran(before CQ) pretty much did it off talent because of the lack of organization in IFF. Its a big reason Iranians going to Europe is tougher than most countries of equal or slightly worse players because the agents/incentives are not there. We dont have hundreds of millions to pay La Liga for example.

    In terms of influence, the rift between Qatar and Saudi has helped Iran get some leverage.

    This will change over time though esp with players like our players now opening up new avenues in Russia, Belgium, Netherlands, Greece. Next step is the higher leagues.

    We've gone thru this before so I wont bring it up.

    We are going to need a 64 team world cup before India even gets close. They are still inferior to 2nd tier Arab teams like Jordan/UAE who did not even come close.
     
  13. gfx_bq1

    gfx_bq1 Member

    Mar 19, 2016
    Typical example of an African team disintegrating. Last WC they came within inches of eliminating Germany. They have a long list of stars, Mahrez, Brahimi, Feghouoli, Slimani, Ghezzal, Bentaleb but this WC they finished last on qualifying and just lost at home to an island with a few hundred thousand people.
     
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  14. gfx_bq1

    gfx_bq1 Member

    Mar 19, 2016
    Yes but you realize probably the sole biggest reason for expansion the WC is to give China an outside shot of qualifying and ensure FIFA doesn't have a financial disaster like the USA missing out like they did this year.
     
  15. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    #3465 Mani, Jun 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2018
    Every argument a Morocco fan can make for their team against Iran, like World Cup history and past success, having players in top leagues etc, a Korean fan can also make for their team against Iran and has done so over and over in the past. After all, South Korea has been to twice as many World Cups as Morocco and has had way more success at the World Cup. Their star player is also worth three times Morocco’s most valued player. Yet despite all that, South Korea has yet to score a single goal against Iran since 2011 and has lost 5 of the last 6 enounters with Iran. So maybe the more enthusiastic Morocco fans should take note of that and learn from the experience of Korean fans, and tone it down, just a bit, untill the match.
     
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  16. Perspolis#1

    Perspolis#1 Member+

    Jun 27, 2011
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I havent followed the progression of the 48 team model but I think they gave Asia 8.5 places?

    Iran,Japan,SK, Saudi, Australia are locks.

    Uzbekistan probably going to qualify finally. I see Iraq/Qatar to be above China. So yeah China will be fighting for a play off spot against the likes of Syria/UAE/Jordan. I think at least half the time FIFA loses that money.

    But they have done it before. In 2002, Fifa put Iran and Saudi (the two top teams outside the WC hosts) in the same group and China in an easy one.
     
  17. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    It is hard to prognosticate about how Iran will do at the World Cup when I really don't have a good enough sense of either the XI or the formation we will use. In our last 3 friendlies on FIFA match days, our formation was 4-3-3 as follows:

    Tunisia:
    Beiranvand - Rezaeian, Khanzadeh, Cheshmi, Mohammadi - Karimi - Shojaie, Hajsafi - Ansarifard, Ghoochannejad, Amiri
    Algeria:
    Beiranvand - Ghafouri, Montazeri, Khanzadeh, Aghaie - Ezatollahi - Ansarifarad, Hajsafi - Jahanbakhsh, Azmoun, Taremi.
    Turkey:
    Beiranvand - Rezaeian, Cheshmi, Pouraliganji, Mohammadi - Shojaie - Ansarifard, Hajsafi - Jahanbakhsh, Azmoun, Taremi.

    In other words, except for Beiranvand, Hajsafi and Ansarifard (used in different posts), no one else started in all 3 matches. Comparing Iran's starting lineup against Tunisia to our starting lineup against Algeria, there were 7 different starters. Comparing Iran's starting lineup against Tunisia with our starting lineup against Turkey, there were 5 different starters. Comparing Iran's starting lineup against Algeria to our starting lineup against Turkey, there were 5 changes even if the forward line was identical.

    Of course, I am reasonably (not entirely) convinced that the 3 players upfront for Iran will be Jahanbakhsh, Azmoun and Taremi. We can assume Hajsafi will start for us against Morocco as well. Likely, the same is true for Beiranvand. And I would be shocked if Pouraliganji doesn't start as one of our CBs. But I am not sure about the rest of the team. In fact, I am willing to bet I can name at least 9 of the 11 starters for Morocco against Iran (and very likely all 11 of them) but I wouldn't nearly as confident picking who will start for Iran!
     
  18. Salas033

    Salas033 Member

    Juventus
    Dec 15, 2017
    United States
    Nat'l Team:
    Morocco
    These theoretical comparisons were maybe useful and fun in December or January when the WC was several months away. The real show is in less than 2 weeks. Imagine posting all of these theories and getting smashed 2 weeks from now. This is true for everyone not just Iranian fans...

    I'm just sayin'
     
  19. Laurent75

    Laurent75 Member

    Aug 2, 2014
    Let me make it sound better, even the fans of Panama can say to belgians and english that past results and squad strenght are meaningless. Even Costa rica's one can say this to brazilians. Even Icelandic ones can say this to Argentinian ones.

    Happy or should I continue ?

    It's obviously trolling not to consider that the names on the squad AND the WC history is the most serious indicator to follow when you judge teams. Nobody here said Morocco would beat Iran, even not me, a draw like Nigeria did against you in 2014 would not surprise me that much. A loss would surprise me a bit, especially because you always fail to beat teams in world cups, you could not even beat Angola.

    So the point is simply, based on squad talent, WC history, Morocco is above Iran, and quite clearly. Only Alireza and Azmoun would make the Moroccan 23 squad. 2 players out of 23. We have more talent at any other spot. Just like 2 or 3 moroccan players would make the brazilian, french or german squad. You see the difference ? You get it ? Morocco is a third class team if talking squad quality + past performances in World cup, along Denmark and Serbia for example...These teams are similar to ours in terms of squad quality and they all qualified at least once for the WC 2nd round too

    Iran is a fifth class team, your team is weak and you've never proved anything in a world cup. You're like Tunisia, a respectable team in Africa, with a certain discipline, but a way too limited to do anything in world cups, they've failed to impress like Morocco and Algeria did in the past.
     
  20. Valkyrie

    Valkyrie Member

    Mar 27, 2013
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    lol @ Moroccan fans showcasing their african culture and heritage in full focus. Never expected anything more from them to begin with though. They'll crawl back to their african hole after they've finished their 3 matches in Russia; not be seen on the world stage for another 20 years.:sneaky:

    Some of their trolls are kinda cute though running around this thread with soiled diapers and complaining about the putrid stink they're putting out.:whistling:

    Too poor to invest in a gas-mask?:ROFLMAO:
     
  21. Laurent75

    Laurent75 Member

    Aug 2, 2014
    Indeed, possible that Morocco fails to qualify for the next world cup, since there are only 5 tickets to share between several good teams.

    Morocco always failed against decent or good teams, in 2002 it was against Senegal which qualified for the WC quarters few months later, in 2006 was against Tunisia, we did two draws 1-1 and 2-2, they did not even beat us and finished only one point ahead. In 2010 was against Cameroon, and in 2014 against Ivory Coast.
    You see, in Africa there are 5 tickets to share between 10 good teams, and if you've got a Nigeria or Ivory Coast in your group, you know it's gonna be 50/50 in the best case.
    In Asia you got 3,5 tickets to share between South Korea, Japan, Australia and your country. The little thrill is when you finish third of your group and got to beat Uzbekistan to qualify for the next round where you'll have to beat Honduras or Trinitad Tobago ... lol.

    If your team gets trashed (like everytime) you'll be here again in 4 years telling us how your team improved a lot and how you've managed to beat South Korea again.
    It will not be Nigeria, not Morocco, maybe will be Senegal or Ghana in your group this time and you'll tell their fans to be afraid of the almighty Iran.
     
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  22. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    While I have a sense this World Cup will be one were past trends will change (for better or worse), the past 3 World Cups Iran has participated, we have not only never been "thrashed" (i.e., lose by more than 2 goals) but, in fact, have only trailed once in these 9 matches at halftime. In WC98, it took a late freekick to give Yugoslavia an undeserved 1:0 win. We beat the US 2:1 (1:0) and lost to Germany 2:0 -- both goals in the 2nd half. In WC2006, Iran and Mexico were tied 1:1 before a gifted goal saw Iran come apart late in the 2nd half and end up losing 3:1. We then lost 2:0 to Portugal -- both goals in the 2nd half. We drew Angolo 1:1 - both sides scoring in the 2nd half. In World Cup 2014, Iran drew Nigeria 0:0, it took a wonder strike by Messi in injury time to give Argentina an undeserved 1:0 win, with Bosnia to the only side to actually take the lead against Iran in the first half and ended up winning 3:1.
     
  23. Perspolis#1

    Perspolis#1 Member+

    Jun 27, 2011
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Based on WC history. Italy should have a good chance of winning the World cup. England and Spain have an even chance at it. Uruguay has more chance than Spain.

    I hope CQ starts his mind games tomorrow.

    "Yes we are the underdogs..all these advantages Morocco has...how can we possibly get a result..." ;)

    Cool it bro. Mock their arrogance. Not their country.
     
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  24. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    I can’t believe that some posters here still don’t understand meaning of the word “thrash” and how and where such wording should be used. When was the last time Iran got “thrashed” by anybody? Iran has not lost a competitive match by more than 2 goals in the last 25 years.
     
  25. Fa1con

    Fa1con Member

    Mar 29, 2016
    While Spain is obviously the favourite to top this group. Competitors for the second spot would most likely be Morocco and Portugal with Iran placing 4th, repeating its usual streak of failure.
     

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