News: Recent polls and stats on soccer popularity in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by Brasitusa, Jun 9, 2014.

  1. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  2. Tom Ado

    Tom Ado Member

    Jun 25, 2015
    The age/ideology breakdown went down the way I expected. These numbers suggest that soccer has a healthy hardcore fanbase that cites it as their #1 favorite sport. The next challenge in boosting TV ratings is to grow the casual fanbase that cites it as their #2 or #3 favorite sport. Basketball and baseball might not be a lot of people's #1 sport, but unlike soccer, they can say that a lot of people have it as their #2 or #3. Football being the most casual-friendly sport due to its short schedule is unsurprisingly #1, since it's safe to say the vast majority of sports spectators fall in the "casual" category.
     
    bigredfutbol repped this.
  3. johngonole

    johngonole Member

    Barcelona
    United States
    Feb 15, 2018
    I'll admit that in the last two years my favorite sport went from college football to soccer. I only occasionally watch college football now and even less so basketball. But I DVR soccer and watch ESPN FC religiously now. My son and I started for fun just playing soccer in the yard when he was 5. And here we are 6 years later and we are both really into it.

    I think soccer will continue to grow in popularity in the US. Smart for MLS to move into Florida. It will take some time to take root in the Southeast but it will.
     
    edcrocker, Kejsare, bigredfutbol and 2 others repped this.
  4. Kacper

    Kacper New Member

    Manchester United
    Poland
    Mar 27, 2018
    When it comes to football European's are as always so over themselves they cannot admit that some other places around the world are getting better and better in football, Asia is getting there States, and Australia, sooner or later Europe will be just a competitor!
     
    LouisianaViking07/09 repped this.
  5. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    the Gallup poll shows just what a poor job MLS has done at getting soccer first fans (sports fans who say soccer is their #1 sport).

    Soccer is a popular sport in this country and MLS is not taking advantage of that popularity. I've said before, this has very little to do with quality and more to do with alienation soccer fans (consciously or subconsciously) feel towards the league.
     
  6. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    May I ask how you come to that conclusion.
     
  7. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    because MLS is not getting very many of those 7% who say soccer is their fav sport. If they were it would be evident in TV ratings.

    Just look at Los Angeles. Soccer is popular in this city by every metric. Ideal demographics. But LA Galaxy have a very small fan base. The soccer fans in this city have for years had the most accomplished MLS team in their city and they havent really cared. The last couple seasons their local TV broadcasts have averaged 9k viewers.They give away as much as 20% of their tickets.

    You can look at any number of cities and see how MLS fails to get the majority of soccer fans. FC Dallas is another
     
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  8. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I don't disagree that the media appeal for MLS is low but I don't fully accept that MLS is doing "a poor job" in trying to lure fans. If we're being honest any and all domestic soccer leagues in the US will be fighting the tide because there are so many forces working against them. Yes, those numbers suggest a lot of sports fans are into soccer but how many of those folks are devotees of foreign leagues? (Especially Liga MX) How many of them are also fans of other sports who want to stick with their established NFL franchise first?

    I agree that it could be a lot better and MLS has work to do, but they and other leagues have also made great strides to reach the level of support we have today, and doing so on comparably thrifty budgets and with minimal media exposure. So rather than simply lambast the league I see they have opportunity for more growth.

    My thoughts, anyway.
     
  9. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    There are enough soccer fans (and soccer first fans) now that the NFL and other sports argument doesn't really fly.

    There's actually a lot of survey data on the American soccer fan and by large percentages they don't like the bastardization of the sport. By that I mean MLS's way of doing business that goes against how the rest of the soccer world operates. The biggest example is the single entity structure.

    Whenever I've asked a soccer fan I know why they don't follow MLS the answer is always because there are no real clubs, the league owns all the teams, it's plastic etc.
     
  10. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The single-entity should be seamless. The league owns the player contracts and gives each team a budget at the start of the season. Yes it technically owns the teams and there's revenue sharing but the operators are independent. But the whole idea of the single-entity is to prevent the disastrous losses that befallen every previous professional league in the US and Canada..

    Miami and Tampa folded because they were losing money. San Jose was put on hiatus until they sorted out a stadium. LAFC were awarded Chivas' place. The Crew to Austin deal is a disgrace but relocations have happened in other countries.

    In contrast to the single-entity, the big European leagues are effectively cartels with a handful of teams calling the shots and taking more and more of the profits with the smouldering threat of a breakaway.

    Where does "plastic" come into it? MLS fans are as passionate as anyone.

    Soccer fans will always have this issue with MLS. Even if it became a European style league with pro/rel Euro-snobs will just make another excuse not to watch it. Honestly, Atlanta could sign Barca's entire squad and some people would say "well they're not as good as Real Madrid.".

    Some people just can't except that professional soccer is thriving in North America.
     
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  11. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    So single entity forever?

    If you don't think that the league owning all player contracts and not the team is not alienating to soccer fans then I don't know what to say.

    If you got rid of single entity the league would not fold. Is that he argument you're making? That it would?
     
  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why does centralised contracts matter? A club informs MLS that they want to sign a player and they work out the deal between them. It's not like players are randomly distributed among teams.

    Strict cost controls are necessary and have been necessary since day one. Without them we'd have had another NASL. American sports owners don't know how soccer works.

    The single-entity will remain until either the wealthier owners decide they'd be better off without it, or a rival D1 league threatens its existence.

    Please explain you're definition of plastic.
     
  13. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    Centralized contracts matter because it's the opposite of club autonomy. It's not a real club if they don't control their own contracts.

    My definition of plastic is inauthentic. I've never used plastic to describe MLS. Have heard others use it.

    Given how popular soccer is in Los Angeles how do you explain LA Galaxy's inability to get a fan base? Their local broadcasts avg 9k and they give away 20% of their tickets.
     
  14. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    In the past few years that Atlanta's market has evolved from the NASL Silverbacks to United today I've been at the front lines of fan events since founding of the Terminus Legion and MLS2ATL. I can honestly say no one has ever mentioned single entity as a factor at all, one way or the other. As a topic on this board its presence is marginal at best.

    If someone is choosing not to support MLS because of single entity then they're the ones being plastic. Single entity doesn't do anything to stop fan involvement, it doesn't prohibit the team and the fans from creating a wholly unique atmosphere and bran, and it is certainly not a major contributor to the level of play on the field. What it does do is serve as a means of administering the league in a way so as to keep the thing solvent. If they did away with single entity tomorrow but kept cost control measures in place, which almost everyone I know would demand, we'd see no difference in the product.

    It's really simple, IMO - Soccer fans choosing not to follow MLS overwhelmingly tend to do so for 1 of 3 reasons:
    1) Level of play doesn't match the power leagues they see on TV;
    2) No team in their market;
    3) All the ways the league structure differs from the power-leagues in Europe. (ie: Pro/Rel vs playoffs)

    The casual US fan is barely aware of the single entity structure and the ones that know should be savvy enough to understand that doesn't impact the quality of the product.

    I'm not wedded to single entity and if it went away I'd have no problems whatsoever, so long as a variant of the salary cap protections are in place.
     
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  15. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    What affects the quality of play is all the economic nonsense (tam, allocations etc) and the salary cap. Single entity is just unnecessary.
     
  16. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Disagree 99%. The main issue is the total amount of money available, less so on which category it's spent. If MLS could afford La Liga level wages no one would really care about such qualifiers.

    More importantly, while it would be nice to some to raise or undo these control measures the reality is that these help keep the league competitively internally and keep the teams essentially solvent. Sports leagues are closed, insular economies and US fans don't like seeing their leagues divided into rigid caste structures that render smaller teams ritually uncompetitive. So while the cap may prohibit an MLS team from becoming a modern day Man U it will also save the league from having a Portsmouth-like failure. (Assuming they learn anything from the mishandling of the Crew fiasco.)

    I can agree with this now, but coming into being MLS had to make a business plan that worked for the US, and this out of the box approach eventually proved an important part of keeping investors vested. That MLS has the financial clout to appear that this is unnecessary is due in part to using this model to get here.
     
  17. barroldinho

    barroldinho Member+

    Man Utd and LA Galaxy
    England
    Aug 13, 2007
    US/UK dual citizen in HB, CA
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Whenever I've asked that question in person, the answer is always because the standard isn't up to what they've seen in EPL, La Liga, the UEFA Champions League and the World Cup.

    If I ask a staunch pro/rel twitter warrior what team they support, their response 80% of the time (I'm being conservative) is a high-profile European club.

    I call BS on the majority caring more about the structure and business model than the quality.

    In fact, I believe that the majority of people that do use the closed league and single-entity as reasons, do so in an attempt to convince us and/or themselves that it's not just out of resentment that the US doesn't have elite clubs or compete for the World Cup.
     
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  18. MLSinCleveland

    MLSinCleveland Member+

    Oct 12, 2006
    Cleveland, Ohio
    Club:
    Cleveland C. S.
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The European method of running a soccer league will never work in America. It's not how sports business is done here.

    The biggest issue is the disparity that would result. Americans are not going to watch a team that they know can never win a title in their or their children's lifetime.

    Pro/rel would not work because the relegated team(s) would lose most of their fan base (major league status is that important in America). Promoted minor league teams would not have to resources to survive at the top level (the financial gulf is too wide). Also, getting funding for a stadium or a TV deal would be impossible if you couldn't promise if you would be in MLS or the USL. Same goes for sponsorship.
     
  19. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes they do control their own contracts

    It's the plight of many MLS 1.0 teams. Remember how messed up the league was in the first few years going for a narrow set of a demographics?

    The current galaxy local TV contract is worth $5.5 million a year, so they obviously have work to do because it before it expires in 2021.

    Attendances in 2016 were the healthiest in years. Who knew they'd win the wooden spoon in 2017?

    upload_2018-4-2_16-22-8.png
     
  20. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    The current wage structure makes it so you have unbalanced talent on the same team. So you often have DPs who could play in top 4 leagues sharing the field with League 1 quality. If for instance there was a hard cap of $20mil( just a random #. Could be less) then clubs could spread their budgets around to more players and field better teams.
     
  21. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    People say a lot of things but the #1 reason someone won't support a team in their own city is that they don't feel a connection with the club.
     
  22. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    Never have I seen so many wrong statements in one paragraph. Most of that is off topic and discussed in other threads so I'm gonna leave it alone.
     
  23. dundee9

    dundee9 Member

    Jan 13, 2007
    LA Galaxy have never gotten a local TV audience. The last three years they've averaged 9k. And they've always given away lots of tickets so showing attendance figures can be a bit misleading.

    It makes me laugh when I hear LAG fans tell LAFC fans that LAFC is riding the coat tails of what they built. They built nothing. Not even a following.

    LAFC may be the shiny new object but the way they brand/talk about football is entirely different than LAG.
     
  24. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    A) Well they could do that now but it would be something lower than what they have overall now and MLS wouldn't have most of the "star" players we have now.

    B) This also has nothing to do with single entity.
     
  25. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Then that's an issue with the owner, and even if you only regard them as stewards of the league-owned franchise they still play the same role with regard to the local marketing and public relations.
     

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