Link to anti-MLS involvement post. Of course, MLS can pop up franchises wherever they please, but if they want to really be representative of soccer should they take a different route to having a pro team in Detroit? Should there be a different route taken by MLS in general?
Don't see why they cant both exist. It strikes me as an apples to oranges type thing. One is low budget the other isn't.
No. No team or league is "entitled" to any market. If it's really that organic, the fans will remain MLS or no MLS. If Detroit City is concerned about having a strong competitor in the market and they want to join MLS, there's a pathway to do that. If they want to form a league and compete with MLS, USSF regs allow for that too. But there is no such thing as calling "dibs" on any market under USSF regulations.
Oh no doubt. They definitely both can exist, and will. The point was more that at what point do these kinds of investments show that MLS isn't representing American soccer? Obviously they have every right to set up a franchise in the market, but is that what's best for soccer in America?
I don't know what "representative of soccer" means so I'm not sure what you want to have happen. What exactly do you think MLS should have done here? Junk single-entity and go to pro/rel so that DCFC might have some chance of someday working its way up to Division 1? Or just avoid Detroit as a market until the DCFC people have enough money on their own to buy into MLS? Remember, MLS isn't just "popping up" in Detroit. Investors in Detroit have come up with a plan and they approached MLS about joining. So, MLS should have just said, "No, there are some guys running an amateur team in Detroit already. Let's see how far they get."
No and no. This is all symptomatic of the hipster/ultra/hooligan cosplay movement that's popped up in the soccer world the last few years or so. The feeble minded clinginess to anything "real" and some romantic vision of St Pauli, et al, has the natural effect of making MLS "modern football" and "corporate entertainment". It's all straight bullshit too. MLS has given this country a stable, successful and entertaining professional league. The only people who think it's "modern football" are people wearing ski masks and and scarves in July. Don Garber almost single-handedly saved soccer as a professional sport and a viable entertainment option. If you have any idea what people went through in the 80s and early 90s to get a fledgling league started those questions would answer themselves. I know that in pretend hooligan circles it's really cool to pretend that Don Garber is some evil corporate raider who's just waiting to smash the hopes and dreams of who-gives-a-shit FC (oh, are you really City til you Die? How clever) and pretend that somehow they don't bask in all the unwarranted attention, but the mustache and beard crowd needs to grow the f up. Because some of us have invested a lot more than they have to make this sport a success, and coming in with some silly "firm" tattoo and telling us we don't understand your passion is the ultimate f$&%waddery.
I don't know what the writer wants either other than telling DCFC what they were planning to do before announcing it. He says: So what exactly did he want Gilbert and Gores to do?
Wow. I'm in no way talking shit on MLS because I know that they've built everything modern American fans have to offer. I don't think it's your place to say you've invested more into American soccer than other fans. Maybe into MLS (specifically with those Detroit City fans), but all of that comes off as extremely pretentious. You aren't a better fan than any other fan just because you support a top league? The point is that there's something bigger to a club's identity than what an MLS franchise has to offer in Detroit. And if the fans from that town are vocal about that, MLS shows how it feels about grassroots communities by looking the other way and stepping on their toes. You could see it differently, but ********. You need to get off your high horse. It's some people supporting their club, nothing more.
No no no no no no. This isn't a pro/rel thing and I want to squash that really hard immediately. This is about the club DCFC, not any leagues or them going up against each other. They could have worked with the team to get them financially to a point where they could compete in MLS. They could have partnered with the club (an MLS partnership would boost revenue and legitimacy in a major way). My initial point was just that at some point MLS needs to stop disenfranchising these organic communities, and there's a way to do that. Just drop the multi-million dollar investors. This club proved they could raise over 4ook in a year just through their community. If it was an MLS club looking for community investment it would be massive. Obviously, that's not something MLS does or would do. But to really make soccer stick here you need grassroot involvement, and franchises don't provide that.
Wait, you are saying "they could have worked with them"? Who is "they? MLS? Where does MLS get its money? From the teams that own the league. Single-entity works both ways. "But to really make soccer stick here you need grassroot involvement, and franchises don't provide that." You don't think soccer is going to stick in places like Portland or Seattle? They have franchises. Heck, things are pretty rough here in Houston right now but our franchise has spent $80 million on a stadium. They think soccer is going to last here. Our supporter groups don't own the team but they are certainly organic. I know, I helped start one as soon as we heard we were getting a team and we had no idea what we were doing at the beginning. We've been supporting our franchise for 11 years now. Not as long as some but I think we'll stick around for a while longer.
1. Sorry if that all seemed directed towards you, it's a lot of frustration with the entire hipster involvement in the sport. 2. I'm not saying I'm "better" than other fans. I'm saying that people like me have bought season tickets for every pro team that pops up and went to USMNT games when there were less than 10k people there, and now our "passion" is being questioned by people who are clearly more into the scene than the sport. 3. The whole grassroots community has nothing to do with soccer. It's an excuse to play dress up. If people want to pretend that they're going to DCFC games to bask in the glory that is hack 18 year old amateurs playing soccer, fine. But they're clearly there for the scene off the field. 4. I have to question the "grassroots" aspect of a "community" group in Detroit that's about 99% white guys in their 20s. Sorry, they don't represent Detroit.
Does anyone really think the community could raise the billion dollar backing, with a multimillionaire majority owner, organically? Thats a bit of a stretch. And i dont see how this should be directed at MLS. Theyre responding to investors. Those investors didnt talk to DCFC. If there is someone to "blame" its said investors.
MLS Expansion Fee: $100M+ and climbing higher with every team added to the league........... Viable Stadium: $125M+ Training Center and Academy: $10M+, and also $1M+ in yearly operating expenses........ Yeah.........no need for multi-million dollar investors at all. Seriously?!?!?! WAKE UP!!! This is PROFESSIONAL sports. Grassroots is great for amateur/semi-pro level teams and clubs. To the second bolded line: Look no further then the Son's of Ben. They are a grassroots supporters club who got the attention of MLS and investors with the goal of bringing an MLS team to Philly. They are community based, as is MLS and the Philadelphia Union. All groups have community programs and conduct charity work and fund raising in the Philly area. Is the Timber's Army not community based? Do the Portland Timbers not work with and support the Timber's Army and the City of Portland?
There are rules and regulations established by USSF/FIFA that cause a couple of issues with some things you bring up: 1) MLS couldn't work with them to get them financially to the point to compete in MLS. Your owner has to have a networth in the millions (not sure what the exact amount is, but i believe D2 owners have to be at 20M). 2) 400k is great and i seem to recall it was from around 13 corporate donors mainly. That will take the NPSL team a long way considering. But that is a drop in the bucket to MLS. Ultimately the ONLY thing MLS could do is hook up the potential MLS owners with the owners of NPSL. Perhaps get them to the point they could compete in USL and act as their reserve team, though the owners of DCFC would lose out on being owners. Both sides could easily compete in the same market, there is something to say about having a cheap alternative for fans. MLS could try to swoon DCFC over to MLS, but a grass roots program would emerge at the announcement of a team starting in detroit. Just look at Atlanta, they had a couple of supporter groups, some of which have openly stated they will not transition into MLS. But then another supporter group starts up (probably consisting of some of the original groups) and their numbers are vastly larger than any attending the NASL matches.
I love puppy dogs, fairytales, the dew on grass early in the morning and I take Metamucil to keep me regular. I am pure and clean.
Just to be clear, I have absolutely no issue with groups like the Timbers Army or Screaming Eagles who are out there every day busting their butts to grow the sport. The work they do might not be as much fun as wearing a plastic army helmet and lighting smoke bombs, but they're rightfully proud of their MLS teams (even DCU) and are actually working in their community. Just to be clear.
I really don't get the premise here of their complaint. Nobody is forcing any of them to support an MLS team and its perfectly fine not to want to do that if they choose. It isn't like their team already plays in the division 1 league and another team is coming into their league to split the market share from them. I would guess there is a good chance an MLS team in Detroit would help trickle down to greater interest in their team anyway as new people try soccer and like it and go looking for additional avenues to watch it.