PBP: 2015 MLS Playoffs - Conference Semifinal Leg 1 [Multiple R]

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by Macsen, Oct 30, 2015.

  1. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    Good question.

    Am I seeing a few posts quoting the wrong posts?

    ******** the Mets!
     
  2. JayRockers!

    JayRockers! Member+

    Aug 4, 2001
    ******** the Mets!!!!!
     
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  3. JayRockers!

    JayRockers! Member+

    Aug 4, 2001
    Hey Joe, is the soccer game over yet?
     
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  4. JayRockers!

    JayRockers! Member+

    Aug 4, 2001
    Exist.
     
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  5. RapidStorm

    RapidStorm Member+

    Jan 30, 2005
    Denver, CO
    #1130 RapidStorm, Nov 2, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2015
    Do you research any of this, or are you just content to pull shit out of your ass and fling it against the wall?

    There is no correlation between attendance, money spent, and results - none. The top 5 spenders tend to have the top highest attendances, but from there the correlation falls apart. And there's no correlation between either attendance and form, or spending and form:

    upload_2015-11-1_22-38-0.png
    upload_2015-11-1_22-53-55.png
    The most we can say is, some teams make better use of their resources than others do. It's not because of any freeloading or rigging of the system - otherwise, you'd expect teams like CHI and COL nearer to the top of the table, too, and SEA nowhere near the top. Some teams are just competent, and others aren't.

    Best example - compare Columbus and Colorado. They have similar attendances, similar salary figures, yet one finishes 4th, and the other 19th.If the system were rigged, that shouldn't happen.

    All you're proposing is to reward teams like NYC, TOR, etc. for incompetence in building a roster under the rules of the league. That is far more terrible than the system we currently have.
     
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  6. EmpedoxFCB

    EmpedoxFCB Member

    Apr 20, 2009
    New Jersey
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Who is your team?
     
  7. Gamecock14

    Gamecock14 Member+

    May 27, 2010
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Victory for America.

    The real tragedy is that Bobby Bonilla will not get a ring.
     
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  8. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    It's so weird that 1) they give the trophy to the owner and 2) that it's in a locker room. Do it on the field.
     
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  9. Gamecock14

    Gamecock14 Member+

    May 27, 2010
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    It probably is in the unwritten rules. Can't hurt the feelings of those pitchers and catchers.
     
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  10. sitruc

    sitruc Member+

    Jul 25, 2006
    Virginia
    The Camaro is on the field.:rolleyes:
     
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  11. cleazer

    cleazer Member+

    May 6, 2003
    Toledo, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So the reason that NYCFC can't surround Saunders and Poku with better players than the likes of Lampard and Pirlo is the salary cap? That doesn't add up. That's not how it works. I don't think you know what you're talking about.
     
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  12. RapidStorm

    RapidStorm Member+

    Jan 30, 2005
    Denver, CO
    Regarding the Ivanschitz goal...what's the rule on goalie punts again? From the replay, it looked like Frei was fully out of the box when he kicked the ball, and the ball was close to out of the box too when it was released.
     
  13. cthomer5000

    cthomer5000 Member+

    Apr 23, 2007
    Raleigh NC
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    If Seattle advances, i wonder what the plan is for scheduling. The Seahawks have home games on both Sundays.
     
  14. JayRockers!

    JayRockers! Member+

    Aug 4, 2001
    M-E-T-S

    Must
    End
    The
    Series!
     
  15. Macsen

    Macsen Moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 5, 2007
    Orlando
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bobby Bonilla got a ring with the Marlins, and actually played. Don't feel sorry for him. o_O
     
  16. MasterShake29

    MasterShake29 Member+

    Oct 28, 2001
    Jersey City, NJ
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I thought MLB had adopted that in recent years, but why maintain a practice that makes sense.
     
  17. BalanceUT

    BalanceUT RSL and THFC!

    Oct 8, 2006
    Appalachia
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is one of the more irrational things I've ever seen on Big Soccer... and we all know that's saying a lot. The salary cap is what keeps this league solvent. Period. You imagine a league such as the European leagues... but they are not fiscally sound. Remember that English Premiership sides do sometimes go into bankruptcy.
     
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  18. Mattbro

    Mattbro Member+

    Sep 21, 2001
    I noticed that and was thinking the same thing. I didn't remember it leading to the Ivanschitz goal, but yeah, he was clearly outside the box. Maybe it's like the footfault rule in tennis and it's just rarely called.
     
  19. Bluecat82

    Bluecat82 Member+

    Feb 24, 1999
    Minneapolis, MN
    Club:
    Minnesota United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    We would all have hover boards and flying cars by now if it wasn't for the Mets.
     
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  20. BalanceUT

    BalanceUT RSL and THFC!

    Oct 8, 2006
    Appalachia
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    False dichotomy. Nobody here is suggesting that. Beating a dead horse, you are. Plonkable, you are?
     
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  21. BalanceUT

    BalanceUT RSL and THFC!

    Oct 8, 2006
    Appalachia
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #1146 BalanceUT, Nov 2, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2015
    Nobody forced the Man City group to buy into our league. They knew the constraints before they signed, or, if they didn't they are idiots (and I don't think anyone believes that).

    I think some folks imagine that the transfer market of world soccer is some kind of perfect free market, a la Adam Smith. It is not, for several reasons both specific and non-specific to soccer.

    ALL leagues have rules that constrain who they can bring in. Some of the rules are labor and/or immigration laws of the nation. Some leagues mandate a certain number of the players must be of their nationality. Other leagues disallow 3rd party participation in contracts (UK) such that it must be resolved prior to a transfer. (Spurs were not able to bring in Motinho due to 3rd party who couldn't be bought out in time to allow the transfer: http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/footbal...-scuppered-spurs-move-for-moutinho_43823.html). Etc.

    Your arguments that all MLS needs to do is get rid of the salary cap and all would be better is faulty because of the fact all clubs in every league in the world must figure out how to operate in their local rules domain and how those rules interact with the international domain. There is no idealized league or collection of leagues in which players naturally find their best price and teams naturally are able to buy their best players based on their financial wherewithal.

    Anyway, even in the esteemed highest leagues in the world, the finances are often not so rosy. This is what MLS is trying to prevent.

    Serie A is crumbling under financial failure. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-26351331

    Specifically, Parma FC is bankrupt and now relegated due to finances, being unable to play matches last year. "However, more astoundingly than that, Parma are broke. Well and truly broke. Penniless. This has led to two Serie A matches, against Genoa and Udinese, to be postponed as no money is available for security and electricity. Thankfully, the home match against Atalanta over the weekend was played as the other Serie A clubs voted to give a five million euro loan to the Gialloblu. Interestingly, Cesena was the only club to vote against the loan while Napoli, Roma and Sassuolo abstained." http://worldsoccertalk.com/2015/03/10/the-malaise-of-parma-f-c-is-a-saddening-italian-soccer-story/

    The EPL has seen teams go into bankruptcy. Portsmouth, most recently.

    MLS is not perfect on this, obviously. The closure of Chivas USA must be pointed to. But, the way it was handled was so much better than the way it would have been elsewhere. The team operated by the league for a year, players knew it was a swan song year. The players got their paychecks. Therefore, they had time to prepare to transfer to other teams rather than a mad scramble. The league absorbed the situation rather than cut it off. Kinder for all the human beings involved.

    Players actually getting their paychecks matters a lot. There are a surprising number of teams that simply don't make their payroll week-in week-out. The top Euro leagues rarely fail on this, (however, see Portsmouth, above). But, top division outside of Europe do see this happen a good bit.

    You can make all kinds of claims that it might somehow be better if we'd just get rid of that pesky salary cap, but it would be a very bad idea to do it.

    The soccer would become more boring because everyone would know which teams were going to win each year (read the Serie A article above about how it is losing appeal, and attendance money, because of lack of top to bottom competitiveness). The league would be in financial trouble because of out of control bidding for a few top players willing to come to the US, which would further unbalance the league.

    MLS has a very solid plan. It will become a financially solid, and world class soccer league within 15 years, more or less, because of this plan. Rather than fight it, enjoy the ride.
     
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  22. Tony in Quakeland

    Jan 27, 2003
    Pleasant Hill, CA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He can be anywhere as long as he doesn't handle the ball outside the box. Most keepers carry the ball forward and release it right at the line so that the ball is actually kicked outside the box. That's legal
     
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  23. AutoPenalti

    AutoPenalti Am I famous yet?

    Sep 26, 2011
    Coconut Creek
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Most disappointing match? All of them.
     
  24. cleansheetbsc

    cleansheetbsc Member+

    Mar 17, 2004
    Club:
    --other--
    Trifling. The ref is free to not call the foul if he feels it has no effect. You may observe it, but in terms of game management, you give the GK a warning.
     
  25. Deadtigers

    Deadtigers Member+

    Jul 23, 2015
    Independent Republic of the Bronx, NY
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ghana
    Ease up on my Metsies!! I am watching the DC v NY game now. I noticed MLS has gone out of its way to not show the travesty from the DC v NE game and just touches the Boswell incident. Just saw the Zubar tackle, DC can't complain about ref calls at the moment.
     

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