Rochester Lancers not returning for 2014-2015

Discussion in 'Pro Indoor Soccer' started by PepsiAddict, Aug 2, 2014.

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  1. Jim Bob Rhino

    Jim Bob Rhino Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    Rochester Rhinos
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sam obviously felt that playing SPS was a non-starter for him.

    It's also possible that Sam felt like he got bait-and-switch'd with regards to the scoring system as he has been consistently for MPS all along and that likely had him dig in even more.

    Doug seems much more willing to give SPS a try and see how things go. But, I don't know if he has enough time to raise the money he needs to get the Lancers on the turf for 2014-15.

    A big factor will be how many sponsors were in it for the Lancers versus just in it for Sam.
     
  2. Jim Bob Rhino

    Jim Bob Rhino Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    Rochester Rhinos
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  3. SoccerMan25

    SoccerMan25 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    Thanks for all the updates Jim Bob Rhino; much appreciated.

    As an old school indoor soccer fan, I must admit, that I am on the side of Soccer Sam. Clearly he felt misled and is taking a strong stand. I applaud his stand on principle. Look, I have been around this game for a long time. And while people will give you numerous reason why indoor soccer isn't as popular as it was in the 80s, there is only one main reason. Indoor soccer doesn't have enough Ed Hales, and Soccer Sams to invest, grow and keep the game going. Having minimum standards in place that are agreed upon and not broken is important. Now since it appears that sps is in place, fine. Most of us are fine with it, but lets not change again.

    Rochester is a vital market in the MASL and over the past week, we all have a new found respect for that fact. I also understand that Kevin Milliken is in a tough position, with having to get 23 strong personality on the same page. The commisioner, so far has done a decent job. However, lets hope that he has more in the tank for the internal battles to come.
     
  4. cardshopmd

    cardshopmd Member

    Sep 9, 2008
    Baltimore
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sam opened his first pizza store when he was 18 , Now look at the empire he has built . He does not believe in SPS so he left and took his ideas and money with him . There is 6 more owners of the lancers anyone of them could take over the team but Doug Miller is the one stepping up and trying to make it work .
     
  5. cardshopmd

    cardshopmd Member

    Sep 9, 2008
    Baltimore
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I spoke to Sam on Sunday and he told me that the the league made promises and then they got changed . He also told me about the issues with the arena and a few other things I don't care to get in to . But scoring is not the main issue at all .
     
  6. skipper60601

    skipper60601 Member

    Aug 12, 2005
    Club:
    Hibernian FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Cardshopmd, the above two posts of yours contradict one another.
     
  7. mng146

    mng146 Member

    Jul 19, 2011
    Rochester, NY
    Is that what Sam is doing? Can't imagine how I missed that o_O
    I don't know who you think "we" are, and how can it be a vital market for a league it was never part of? Reported attendance numbers that were often phony and heavily papered doesn't make a team vital. Although it was officially called a merger, the MISL folk joined THEIR league, and you don't walk in the door and start telling them how to do things your way, and then get mad and walk away when they won't. I don't have any respect for that, new or old.

    I also don't believe for a second that it wasn't and still isn't a publicity stunt.
     
  8. mng146

    mng146 Member

    Jul 19, 2011
    Rochester, NY
    Sam probably taught him that trick ;)
     
  9. SoccerMan25

    SoccerMan25 Member

    Jun 28, 2014
    I hear you. All I'm saying is whatever promises were made, keep your word. Also, with there being a limited number of decent owners in this sport, why do something/anything to chase one of them away.

    Soccer Sam put buts in the seats. However he did it, he did it. Paid/comp, whatever. He ran one of the most successful franchises and deserve a lot of credit. The PASL, for all its talk of being the last league standing, can learn a whole lot from the 6 joining MISL teams. No need to be arrogant because those 6 teams average more than most of the 20 team PASL; and those numbers don't lie.
     
  10. IndoorSoccerNews

    Nov 28, 2010
    Maryland
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Both sides can learn from the other, and neither is choosing to do that.

    I don't have much hope for this league. Quarreling owners, different business perspectives, low budget versus high budget teams = less competition, a bad brand that isn't nationally recognizable. These are all great starting factors for a new league!
     
  11. mng146

    mng146 Member

    Jul 19, 2011
    Rochester, NY
    It's basically an old, low rent league with a fresh coat of paint slapped on it. Couldn't agree more with your first sentence, but unfortunately too often, king-sized egos get in the way. A little compromise can go a long way. In Sam's case, he has done a lot of things right, but this is also not the first bridge he's ever torched.
     
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  12. kinznk

    kinznk Member

    Feb 11, 2007
    They should divide the league in two and have pro/rel. I've read on other boards that it guarantees increased competition and investment and is a sure fire way to grow a league into national prominence.
     
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  13. mng146

    mng146 Member

    Jul 19, 2011
    Rochester, NY
    We should listen to them, shouldn't we? 25 pages of posts and counting, those boys know their stuff! What could possibly go wrong? :D
     
  14. Rampage

    Rampage Member

    May 8, 2012
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  15. KidFlash

    KidFlash Member

    Jul 13, 2011
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    Rochester Rhinos
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sam being open and honest about his health issues, and apologetic for the way he handled things last week is a good start. Was legitimately surprised Miller was not on as a guest, and the implication that they're more or less ending the show unless the Lancers come back is surprising. (Jim Bob would know that better than I, obviously.)

    His constant railing about the sports media here is a lost cause, frankly. The amount of people who care just about local sports teams are few and far between, sadly. We're in a tough spot, between the NFL/NHL and NCAA strongholds in neighboring cities. Our media reflects that, and the days where the Amerks, Red Wings and Rhinos were top dogs went away when access to the bigger sports nearby became much easier. It's what most people prefer, and ignoring that interest is the path to a shuttered media organization.
     
  16. EdD.

    EdD. Member

    Jun 10, 2013
    Dallas, Texas
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, you can't simultaneously claim that it doesn't matter that a huge chunk of Rochester's attendance was free kids and comped tickets and that it does somehow matter that this inflated attendance number was larger than the paid attendance of other teams. Teams like Monterrey, Dallas, San Diego, and others are putting out a product that people are willing to pay for. Sam was giving his product away and claiming this as a successful model.
     
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  17. WPSL

    WPSL Member

    Apr 7, 2008
    Club:
    Cleveland
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If it was just a hobby and he didn't want to continue with Lancers why didn't he try to sell the team? Maybe Doug Miller would step up sooner like Soccer Sam wish that he did when Doug call him in Florida. But it is what it is, I wish Soccer Sam the best of luck in whatever. I hope Doug Miller can save the Lancers and play in 2014-15 MASL season.
     
  18. skipper60601

    skipper60601 Member

    Aug 12, 2005
    Club:
    Hibernian FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Although he doesn't like "Facebook geeks" telling him how to run his business, Sam sure feels free to tell journalists and arena operators how to run theirs.
     
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  19. Kit

    Kit Member+

    Aug 30, 1999
    Herkimer, NY, USA
    Club:
    Everton FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Are you saying that I am the only one who ever paid to see a Lancers' game in Rochester?
     
  20. kenntomasch

    kenntomasch Member+

    Sep 2, 1999
    Out West
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, I'm sure many people have.

    Just not as many as you may have originally thought.
     
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  21. soccerFrank

    soccerFrank Member

    Dec 11, 2011
    Club:
    Rochester Rhinos
    :thumbsup:
    Bingo !!!... couldn't of said it better myself sir
     
  22. cardshopmd

    cardshopmd Member

    Sep 9, 2008
    Baltimore
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The reason Sam did the show alone is to explain his side of things and to say goodbye to the follower's of Kick This
     
  23. cardshopmd

    cardshopmd Member

    Sep 9, 2008
    Baltimore
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The reason he did not sell the team is because he is not letting letting the lancers name and logo GO , He will let Doug Miller and the Lancers have use of it . Selling the team with out the name and logo takes away any value the team had .
     
  24. KidFlash

    KidFlash Member

    Jul 13, 2011
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    Rochester Rhinos
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Right, I get that. Sam's worst enemy is often himself, and doubletalk plus bluster is just par for the course. Certainly back before his medical issues, and now.

    But if Jeff Diveronica had been there, perhaps he could've focused the show a little more and maybe pertinent questions would've been asked (why now? why not put out feelers to see if others were interested? why the impulsive move, instead of sleeping on it?). But then, that's a case where their friendship gets in the way of the story. It's probably not a surprise that the Democrat and Chronicle writer who penned the most revealing piece on Sam wasn't Devo, but fellow sports writer Leo Roth, who covers outdoors all year and the Bills beat in the fall.
     
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  25. Jim Bob Rhino

    Jim Bob Rhino Member

    Jan 17, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    Club:
    Rochester Rhinos
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Lancers without Sam running them isn't going to be bought by anyone.

    Replacing Sam as the owner will be a lot easier than replacing Sam as the person that put in a ton of hours, got a ton of the sponsorship deals done, and ran the team.

    Sam downplayed the hours he put into the Lancers on the show. Replacing that will be the biggest hurdle that Doug, or anyone else, would have in running an indoor soccer team in Rochester.
     

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