Official DC United vs Colorado Rapids PRE Match Thread [N&A]

Hopefully the familiar black shirts will mean the end of the gimp-tastic passing display that was offered on Saturday night.

 

anybody know the cRapids lineup? anybody wanna take a guess?

 

To build on that, who is on their suspended and injured list?

 

From the Colorado website:

Out: Pablo Mastroeni (L- Quad); Darryl Powell (L- Hamstring); Zizi Roberts (R-Knee); Jeff Stewart (R- Knee)

Doubtful: NONE

Questionable: Gary Sullivan (L- Leg Stress Fracture)

Probable Starting Lineup:

Peguero . Delgado

Cila

Chung . Beckerman . Henderson

Crawford . Kotschau . Borchers . De La Torre

Cannon
​

Subs:
DiGiamarino
Erush
Martinez
Spencer
Sullivan
Trembly
Vallow

 

IIRC, Colorado came in here a few months ago missing Chung, Peguero, Maestroeni, Borchers and a few others and still managed a draw against us..

I don't put any faith anymore in how many players are missing for the opposition because it just doesn't seem to matter..

 

I understand, but hey right now, a draw is better than nothing

 

I, for one, would be excited as hell with a draw. The way they've played recently, even that's hoping for too much.

 

Not at home, definitely not. I don't care if we lose 10-0 on the Road..we better do what we can to take all three Wednesday.

 

Depressing hmmm...maybe, discouraging, never.

How many things in history would have gotten accomplished if in the last final moments everyone said. "Well, maybe next time." If you follow through to the end and we are our consistent selves. Then at least you can say. I gave it all too! For United. if you say "ah never happen!", and something does break where will you be? With your back turned and your head in your hands.

So follow me and strap on your straight jackets, adjust the straps and repeat after me!
"2-1 LA falls aginast a surprise DC in the final, the country is shocked!"
"What time do we get the codeine?"

 

Re: ... a big long pent up post ...

some good stuff knave, if decidedly pessimistic. i have to say that i still hold onto hope in the players that we have and even the system they play in.

look at it as we've got 3 lines (fw,mid,df). At the beginning of the season, our mid line was outstanding and helped to not only control the middle of the field, but influenced how the other 2 lines were doing. the fw and df lines weren't that good. So we had 1 strong line to compensate for 2 weak ones.

After injuries, callups, people leaving, our mid line is now merely OK, holding their own against other mids and they aren't strong enough to influence our below-average fw and df lines. now we have 1 OK line and still 2 weak ones.

the question is (with mostly the same players) can we somehow rebuild our midfield enough to dominate the middle third AND influence the fw and df lines? if the answer is no (which i think is correct), then we have to strengthen either the fw or df lines to at least make us OK in one other area.

i think the way to do this is to move back into a 442. since the midfield is no longer strong enough to protect our defense, the defense needs enough bodies to take care of itself. If that means playing stokes, so be it. hopefully in a system he *seems* more suited, he will be able to perform better.

And knave, i also agree that there are certain players i want to see on the field for a variety of reasons. freddy, nana, stokes (yes, him), thompson, ara. we need to find out if these guys can play, not even for next year, but we need them for the stretch run now. i think jaime needs to take a seat for a while, and carroll/dema/benny all could use some "pine time" to heal/clear their heads.

 

Knave--of course the SJ match was discouraging. But that's in big part b/c the combination of the field and the tactics/team of SJ forces you to either have someone who can hold/create/see the field well (and we admittedly don't have that) OR have an entire team of players with superb close control. And we don't have that. Thus, our backline made repeated errors when pressured, our midfield got trapped on the sidelines and our forwards either got poor service or held the ball too long and drew a crowd. We looked dreadful. But that's very much a reflection of the circumstances. Although I do agree that we've got a team that is missing a lot of key pieces. And I also disagree with people who've said we don't hustle--I think the team works hard, very hard. But hustle doesn't get you very far against serious pros.

Colorado provides a very different challenge. We can bemoan our team but Colorado is going to bunker against us. That's their MO on the road and against any team regardless of who they play. Colorado has trouble scoring and won't even attempt to break down our defense. They'll play for 0-0 and hope that as we push forward we give them enough space to grab a goal on a break away. That's their game plan.

Given that, Moreno needs to be out there. And he can't be allowed to drift back into midfield. He needs to be the player who is close enough to the goal that when he gets the ball he can lay it off to someone else (Eskandarian, Adu, whomever) running into space. This is exactly the kind of match were Kuffour could have an impact--with his quickness, physicalness, energy, hustle and nice touch.

I don't get where Carroll needs a break. I don't see him dragging out there, or committing mental errors. Look--technically the kid isn't Maestro. He'll misplay some balls and make errors that younger players make. Given that our defense loses shape and makes errors with Nellie out, Carroll is being pulled in multiple directions. If he was dragging, looked dispondent then I'd say rest him. But that's not the case. We played a team on a field where first touch and offensive vision and ability to hold the ball were key. Those are not Carroll's strengths as a player and never will be.

 

Re: ... a big long pent up post ...

Overall I agree with your post but I disagree here. I think Nowak and we fans already know what all the players on the team will give us at this point. For instance we all know that Ara isn't ready to handle serious playing time as his reactions are too slow. We keep him on the team because he might just develop next year or the year after, which is often the case for rookies: taking a year to get used to the play (see: Nelsen). So if we want to win this year we keep playing Dema and Benny and Carroll in the middle (or somewhere) and keep Ara on the pine.

Thompson also looks too raw to take playing time away from Esky or Moreno or Adu.

Stokes? I'm not as down on him as so many others are here but he obviously isn't ready for prime time either.

Freddy on the other hand is showing that he 1) has a better grasp of the game than say Ara, and 2) he's improving, so you keep playing him. One wishes he were better now, but hey, we can't having everything.

Nana is the one younger player who will probably see his role on the team enhanced, but that's mainly because he's newer to MLS than the other rooks.


All in all we are seeing now how important Convey was to this team because he played a unique role: that of a midfielder who attacks down the middle (even from a wing position) So far he's literally irreplaceable- and folks that's not a slight on Gros who attacks very nicely on the wing. None of the other main cogs in the starting midfield- Stewart, Olsen or Dema- do what Convey does (bring pressure up the middle) and unfortunately they get hammered on the board for it unfairly. Convey's runs made Moreno more dangerous and vice versa. Now teams can concentrate on shutting down Jaime and until Adu grows up or Nana shows that he can take on Convey's burden or we get a foreign attacking mid who's decent our offense will be impotent.

(I also disagree that Olsen pre-injury would have been better in his role. Pre-injury he didn't show the inclination to spearhead the attack down the gut.)

 

Re: ... a big long pent up post ...

I feel your pain Knave - I faced the same conclusion that we are just a mediocre team at best. Losing Convey and having Nelsen hurt suggests to me that we should give up on the 3-5-2 and go back to a 4-4-2. Maybe we can sneak into the playoffs. Of course my outlook could change depending on who we get (if anybody) to help us.

-The Far Side

 

I think PN needs to change DC's formation. he should play with a 4-2-2-2 like the USMNT does until Nelsen and Petke get back to health.
Perkins
Prideaux------Namoff-------Hendrickson-----Stewart
Caroll---------Olsen
Adu---------------------Gros
Moreno--------Esky

Let Adu and Gros run free down the wings(like DMB and Landon do for the USMNT) and have Caroll and Olsen do the defensive dirty work behind them. Also Stewart should provide a nice attacking option down the right and he's also not a bad defender. ALlowing Adu and Gros to have free reign behind Moreno and Esky should give them the support and service that they need to be good strikers.

 

Re: ... a big long pent up post ...

You pretty much nailed it on the head.

Nowak's assumption, or gamble, call it what you will, going into this season was that the team was good enough to succeed with the existing players. His idea was to improve on the perceived faults of the Hudson era, ie an incoherent tactical approach and lack of accountability. Hence the emphasis on player discipline at the start of the season, and giving players a more defined role within a consistent tactical framework in the 3-5-2. Also by moving Olsen into the middle and playing Carroll as a holding midfielder he was hoping to maximize the strengts of the players available.

Its telling that Nowak's tactical approach relied on using a kind of brute force approach to winning the midfield, with Ben, Dema and Carroll more or less acting as 'destroyer' type players. This itself was a kind of admission that we weren't really all that good. Pre-Convey departure, the creative flair (if any) was going to have to come from Convey, Stewart and Moreno, with Adu as a wild card. Of those, Convey is gone, Stewart is having a mediocre season, Jaime is a little better but inconsistent and Adu is still not quite there yet.

In fairness, Nowak couldn't have predicted that Rimando and Petke would have had such poor seasons. The defense was probably the reason Hudson's team made the playoffs last season with our appalling scoring record. Thank god for Troy Perkins, but otherwise the defensive lapses have really hurt us.

On the whole it might be fair to say Nowak's changes have probably improved the team but have been offset by injuries and sh!ite form from several players. Still the fact remains we have done no better in terms of results than Hudson did, at this point in the season. All the optimistic talk about accountability and improved locker room morale has faded away (as usual).

I think there is a way forward. It requires the coach and GM to accept that the team isn't good enough and start to consider trades for hitherto untouchable players. I'm talking about Olsen, Petke, Rimando, for example, and Stewart if he is still around. This will be a process that might take a couple of seasons. Probably the aim should be to build around this week's acquisition and Freddy Adu, with the assumption (hope ?) that he will become a credible force in this league by the time the 2006 season rolls around. In other words, we bag this season, next season is consolidation and rebuilding, and 2006 is our big year. Oh, forgot it is World Cup year, but anyway.

 

May be onto something there, I'd switch Carroll and Stewart though, we need better distribution in that formation than Carroll can provide.

Switching gears, I think with the presence of Nana Kuffour becoming ever increasing, it's time for Nowak to rethink the Moreno-Stewart connection we've seen teasingly effective on the wing. In view of his style of play, Earnie seems to have the same impatience(teams pace), although much more seasoned, than Convey did. If Kuffour can hold down the right wing, or even if Adu gets inserted opposite Gros, only 3 other players than Nelsen rate wearing the Captain's armband,(IMO), Olsen, Moreno, and our choice last match, Earnie. As such, I say hand HIM the reigns to run the middle.

Our other players are too occupied with their tasks to recognize when something's not working. Someone on the pitch needs to recognize this, and pull the switch. Someone who, when this decision is made, the rest of the team falls in line with. Playing Earnie centrally, if done early enough this week, could anchor us to ride out this spell. Just hope I'm right in assessing his vision.

To Knave, and any others feeling similarly, here's a look to hopefully allow you to step back and view a bigger picture.

United's records- recent win/undefeated streaks vs recent loosing streak

Date Wins Losses Draws
06/05 03 05 03
07/10 05 06 05
4 game unbeaten streak incl. 6-2 vs Metros ended
07/17 05 06 06
08/07 05 08 06
3 game loosing streak

I point this out with 11 matches to play this season, with plenty time left for Nowak & Co to right the ship. Can they do it? Certainly, with 6 of them coming at home. What's unnerving is to see us on the downward trend just as we get set to face our division in 9 of those remaining 11.(yikes)

I predict the next 2 matches will be pivotal in determining the team's course come playoff time. Hopefully, we see a bit of improvement teamwide along the lines of 1) organization 2)distribution &wider vision, and given these, 3)finishing. The closet revealed a few shortcomings, hopefully we take the motivation from that loss into getting ready for the stretch run.

note to front office: a full roster, one that fulfills all recent promises of acquiring a player along each line,(d,m,f), and allowing our injured/wounded to finally get on the DL/IRR would help immensely. QUIT STALLING AND GET TO IT ALREADY!!!!

 

To some extent, but what circumstances are we going to encounter in playing a league match where we can realistically expect to win without either a creative playmaker or a closely coordinating team? We don't have offenseive firepower, either good poaching, good long-range shots, or creativity; we don't have a solid defense; and we have lost the coordinated, dominating control in midfield we were showing flashes of early in the season. What else *is* there?

And doesn't that say it all? We're facing serious pros, and we just don't have 11 to put out on the field ouselves.

Agreed. Carroll, Perkins, Gros, maybe Ben, Esky, and Namoff: those are about the only players right now who are providing consistent play. Not just hustle, but effective play on a regular basis. Some of the other guys are too injured, too tired, or not being played where their talents really lie; the rest are just not pulling their weight. And I'm grateful that Peter isn't making excuses and that the players aren't making excuses; it's good that they're conscious that they're not getting the job done. But that's only the first step. Now they need to work on how they *can* get the job done. And the front office needs to stop with the platitudes (or platypusses) and give Peter the tools he needs, dammit.

 

Interesting. One suggestion to play Earnieas a defender and one to play him as a central coordinator. I think he has the leadership skills to play centrally, and the speed and distribution skills and the vision; I'm not sure he has the holding skills and the agility to do it. But it might be an interesting experiment. I think he'd do well as a defensive wing player, sort of like what Milton Reyes played; again, he has the speed, and he has the defending ability. I'd really like someone there who had better crosses than Earnie, but right now beggars can't be choosers. Prideaux-Stokes-Ezra-Stewart sounds much better than Prideauz-Ezra-Stokes.

Amen!

 

I think the move as Earnie to a Full-Back would help our midfield. Frankly, Earnie doesn't get far post. And I believe he'd be more dangerous if he could overlap at full-speed past a player like Kuffour or Gros. Since both Gros and Kuffour are excellent on the dribble and rather fast.

A 4-3-3 is not impossible for this club. Its just depends on what type of 4-3-3 FLAT or w/ a Triangle in Midfield.

 

I'm curious why you think Moreno has to be out there. Granted, he is the only player except for Adu that can hold the ball in traffic. Freddy gets knocked off the ball easier, but so is Jaime, particularly as the season goes on. He's never been good at taking a beating (he was better in '97, '98). Recently he's drifted to midfield and has been ineffective. Some would blame the lack of central attack, which I can agree with to a point. But in the end, he's lost speed, quickness, his runs and passes are not as decisive. Other than early in the year, when did he have a semi-dominant role in a game. I think he needs to be used less, maybe even as a sub.

I like the idea of Earnie playing the outside back and I too would like to see more of Nana and Adu, whoever it effects.

Yabo

 

INJURY REPORT: D.C. UNITED - OUT: FW Thiago Martins (L knee surgery); FW Eliseo Quintanilla (R fractured fibula); FW Santino Quaranta (adductor surgery); DF Ryan Nelsen (abdominal surgery); GK Nick Rimando (R knee surgery); PROBABLE: DF Mike Petke (L quadriceps strain). ... COLORADO RAPIDS - OUT: FW Rey Angel Martinez (L toe); DF Pablo Mastroeni (L quadriceps strain); MD Darryl Powell (L hamstring strain); FW Jean-Philippe Peguero (abdominal strain); DF Jeff Stewart (R knee); FW Zizi Roberts (R knee swelling); PROBABLE: DF Gary Sullivan (L leg stress fracture)
INTERNATIONAL ABSENCES: none
SUSPENDED: DC: Bryan Namoff (through Aug. 11)
YELLOW PERIL: DC: Josh Gros (18 CP); Ben Olsen (17 CP); Mike Petke (19 CP) ... COL: Kyle Beckerman (20 CP); Darryl Powell (18 CP); Nat Borchers (20 CP)


Namoff is out for the evening, seeing Gros, and Olsen on the Yellow Peril is un-nerving, not at all surprising but un-nerving.

 

I think this game, and the next, will be a moment to judge not only this team -- but our new coach.

With the desparate situation we are in -- falling fast, missing players, playing lousy -- we're going to need some change. Some of us want a change in players who get to play, some of us want a change in formation and tactics. But we do need change.

As stated earlier, a good coach recognizes the strengths and weaknesses in his players and adjusts his formation and tactics to play to the strengths of his players, rather than trying to force the players into positions they're not used to or good at. Good players are better when they are comfortable.

The problem I have with Novak this season is that he seems to have made up his mind on where everyone is supposed to go early on, and the crappy play of Moreno isn't getting him subbed, and the good play of others isn't getting them put in any earlier.

Novak needs to make some changes in tactics, formation, and staff. I like some of the ideas on this board, but Novak needs to surprise me, his players, and his opponents by trying something more interesting. What's happening now ain't working.

 

since its game day does anybody know who DC is actually starting?