German National Team News & Discussion Thread - EURO 2012 & Beyond [R] II

PML is injured and won't play against Chile.

Kirsten, you alright, bud? Make sure the respirator is nearby.

All kidding aside, I was looking forward to seeing him get some playing time with NT. It would be nice to see what our other options will bring to the table considering Klose is really a massive question mark right now.

 

I actually think the process of Ozil adapting to a 4-1-4-1 has already started at Arsenal. Arsenal play a lone holder (Arteta/Flamini) and another transitional player in midfield (Ramsey/Wilshere), and Mesut has had to drop deeper to accommodate this. Wenger wants him to become more involved in the play, but he hasn't looked comfortable playing this role and acting as that transitional player, which is understandable considering it's a completely new for him. I agree with you when you say our players are smart and talented, but disagree that just because of this they should easily be able to perform new roles within separate systems. The only player that's proven to be capable of this is Lahm, and that's why Guardiola calls him the smartest player he's seen. In my opinion, there is a difference between understanding a role (which, as you've stated, our players are intelligent enough to do) and actually having the skill set to perform it on the pitch. We have to remember that everything happens so quickly on the pitch that there is hardly time for players to think nowadays, and players really mostly use their natural instincts to determine their play. In Mesut's case, his natural instinct (which has been shaped by Mourinho and Low for years) is to play direct and vertical. He's been developed this way during the most important years of a player's football progression (late teens-early 20's), and simply being talented or intelligent isn't enough IMO to allow you to change your game so radically to fit a new role and system's demands.

Ozil's genius is based on three virtues:
1. He has maybe the best final pass in world football
2. His decision making and composure on the counter attack which means he almost always makes the right play
3. His ability to slow down when others speed up, giving him the time and space to see and play the key pass

All three of these attributes would be severely affected if he were to play to play deeper and a more transitional role. In addition, his weaknesses (off the ball defending, stamina) will become more exposed as well.

When you consider the trade-offs that comes along with Mesut, a midfield of Lahm-Schweini-Kroos makes much more sense and provides more overall balance to the team and this is why I think there is a case for Mesut to be dropped or play as a false 9, which is a completely different role as well. Thoughts?

 

BPL = Bayen Practice League?

 

Lasogga out. According to Bild, he was going to start.

 

What's wrong with our training system seriously? Klose, Lars Bender and Lasogga all injured themselves in just a few days

Wanna know the severity of Lasogga's injury.but still glad to know Loew was gonna start him if he wasn't injured

 

U still need a plan B if the false 9 experiment doesn't work against certain opponents.

Klose, health aside, is still the most allround finisher we have in the entire national pool other than Laosgga.

Klose is a clinical finisher, never wastes chances, super efficient as a scorer, provide the lacked aerial ability and is experienced and probably the smartest striker in the game. Positioning and scoring instinct inside the box is needed , Klose can provide. And the key of Klose's game is while he can provide so many lacked attributes of the NT, he is also mobile and is an extremely creative striker who doesn't hurt our fluidity

Loew may still want a striker to complement our creative AMs/False 9. Don't forget Reus interchanges with Hanke, Goetze interchanged with Lewandowksi/Mandzukic. False 9 need a partner to complement their weaknesses (usually lack of size, lethality,in front of goal and poor positioning , aerial ability and finishing touch). In order to achieve synergy. Without an order player who can cover up the weaknesses and provide the lacked attributes, efficiency is an issue.

Klose is always playing at that particular role as a complement. Health and form is an issue so we are hoping Lasogga can be the successor

 

Its klopp!!!

 

http://www.kicker.de/news/fussball/nationalelf/600436/artikel_lahm_jeder-ist-austauschbar.html

Lahm says he enjoys playing on the 6 and he can envision himself playing there for years. He's also going to start there tomorrow.

 

Re: Lasogga. I would like to see what he can do. I agree with Kirsten, I think we need a plan B to the F9. I don't know if Gomez is the right plan B or an old Klose. A guy like Lasogga or Volland could be important, but they need the opportunity. Anyways, this is the team I would start for the WC

Götze
Özil Kroos Schweinsteiger Müller
Lahm
Schmelzer Hummels Boateng Großkreutz/Bender
Neuer

Joker: Reus


What do you guys think of otherwise going back with Boateng at LB and Hummels-Mertesacker inside? I know Boateng may be the best German CB this year, but we're pretty weak at LB. Stick with Schmelzer or play Boateng out of position? I have no preference, I also have no memory of how Boateng faired at LB so he may just be worse than Schmelzer.

 

This WC will either be a big disaster tactically (Loew just can't seem to make up his mind ever and stick to his own philosophy - don't even think he has is own. Or he is lucky and hits it on the sweet spot. I must honestly say I think its a very tough choice at this point to choose what system to play and who to field in the starting line up.
Just hope Loew has a plan and a back up plan or two for certain opponents.
The thought of fielding Schmelzer and Grosskreutz against top teams ... is very scary

 

How many active users are on the german forum still. Sure it will grow again when the WC starts. But can someone not create 2- 3 new threads for us for the upcoming world cup. We still using the Euro2012 and beyond thread .
THX

 

Everyone who feels like it can do it. Just do it!!

 

Deutschland: Neuer - Großkreutz, Mertesacker, Boateng, Schmelzer - Lahm, Schweinsteiger - Götze, Kroos, Özil - Klose
Loew Said that Kroos will definitely start so looks like Oezil on the wing probably subbed by Schurrle or Poldi later on.

Who is missing from this team:
Reus, Bender and Muller - minor injuries
Gomez/Howedes/Hummels - Out of form
Draxler ???
Gundogan, Bender and Khedira - long term injuries
At least 10 players that we were still all sure a few months back would go to the WC.

 

I think barring further injury, Low will go with Boateng and Mertesacker in the middle. I don't think he's ever fully trusted Hummels which is a shame, because Mats is probably our most naturally talented CB. Personally, I don't think Schmelzer is as much a liability as most. He's played in many important Champions League matches in recent years against big sides and hasn't looked out of depth, and provided key moments as well. I don't think he will be the reason we don't do well at the WC.

Regarding your lineup, I think Reus is a much better fit for the left midfield role than Mesut. If you want to keep that same personnel, Gotze and Ozil should switch, as Mario is also more comfortable out wide. Mesut's only realistic positions in a 4-1-4-1 is as one of the transitional midfielder or false 9 I think.

 

Bild.de says that oezil could be on the bench tonight to get a "rest"... That means
GK..Merte..Boa..Schmelzer
.....Lahm........Schweinie.....
Schurrle..Kroos....Goetze
...............Klose........................

Seems Loew wants to stick to the 4-2-3-1

Can you imagine WC time and our Midfield is only bayern
...Lahm.......Schweinie......
Muller---Kroos..........Goetze

 

Wow, what offensive midfielders do you have...but you don't have a clinical strikers...well, it's klose, but has 35....Or maybe Low will play at the WC without a clasic striker? Or Schurrle can play as lone striker?

 

I don't like Kruse and i don't think he's the solution, Volland has much potential....but he's still young

 

I think its the right decision to either start without Oezil, or start him as false 9. He just doesn't fit as a transitional player in a 4-1-4-1, and he provides far too little defensively in a 4-2-3-1, which leaves the double pivot facing a 2 v 3 situation.
Personally I would start him as a false 9, especially given our striker situation. He makes intelligent runs, has the creativity and movement to open up spaces for our wing players like Mueller, Schuerrle, Reus, Goetze, etc to get into scoring positions.

 

All options are false 9s with similar style, we need a better complement. Not only as a plan B if False 9 experiment fails against certain opponents, but to provide something lacked in the system: back-to-goal, aerial ability, physicality, clinical finishing n better positioning/scoring instinct inside the box

Reus n Hanke interchanged back in his Gladbach days when Reus was a false 9; Goetze always had Lewandowksi/Mandzukic to play beside him.

Klose is always needed because he has all the attributes this team lacked while his mobility, intelligence and build-up game doesn't hurt the fluidity of our attack. Klose works like a complement to our, skilled but not so lethal, attacking midfielders.

The interchange between a complement and a false 9 will create synergy. Not a false 9 with another skilled midfielder.

I think people here are really underrating the importance of back-to-goal and diversed scoring skill-set especially for this team. I think those are some attributes u can't ignore and overlook for a frontman nowadays. See Mandzukic has scored so many goals in the air( headers, bicycle kicks n volleys)


Loew brings in Klose and Lasogga for a reason. But too bad the latter was injured during training or else he can be the best option to be Klose's successor. Not exactly the same type but Lasogga also have good build-up game n mobility especially for a player of his size, but I think Lasogga is even more physical and aggressive.

 

Kirsten, it looks like Loew is thinking with a plan B in mind. He is bringing both false 9 types and traditional strikers. The only question now is whether or not plan A is the traditional 9, or the false 9.

 

Loew wanted to start Lasogga had he wasn't injured.

Answer is simple, preferably he wants a traditional 9 who can also complement our skilled but not so lethal AMs and provide the missed attributes in back-to goal, clinical finishing, aerial ability, physicality n Better positioning/killer instinct inside the penalty box. But the key of the traditional 9 is he also need to have the required mobility n build-up game which fits our philosophy n emphasis on fluidity.

Klose is a perfect complement when he's healthy; or else I like Lasogga's game A LOT n I think Laosgga can play a Mandzukic role(for Bayern) for the NT. Third option is probably banned but Kiessling's style can also help the NT. Volland is another strong (tho little undersized) but very smart and clinical allround striker which can do well

Interchange is important but how to interchange is also the key. Interchanging among 5 AMs with very similar strengths and weaknesses do not form the synergy; but when one can provide the lacked attributes and bring in another elements/dimensions to the game, the interchange will give us more flexibility up top.

N I seriously prefer that than having 5 similar type of AMs interchanging without a complement n cover-up

 

Neuer
Großkreutz Boateng Mertesacker Jansen
Lahm
Götze Schweinsteiger Kroos Özil
Klose

or

Neuer
Großkreutz Boateng Mertesacker Jansen
Lahm Schweinsteiger
Götze Kroos Özil
Klose

is my guess. I hope he goes with the 4-1-4-1 though.