I'm all for winning the Carling Cup. I think this season can be a success because of it, though none of us would have said that in August. Winning the trophy doesn't hide the fact that we played against Cardiff the same way we've played all season - dominant without much punch. By October/November the new regime will have had two summer transfer windows and training camps. If we open up next August/September with the same problems we've had this year, would anyone deny that there needs to be a change to the coaching staff? It's not all about the end result, it's about progress. Do you think we've progressed since the last half of last season? Are we progressing at a rate similar to our rivals? Have we really progressed from Roy Hodgson? I didn't expect the team to finish top four this year. If I did, I'd say fire the staff now. But if there aren't signs of progress by the start of next season then a change will be necessary.
I agree with Ken and Pikas. But I do think we need another pacy striker with skill to match with Suarez.
Good questions. Overall, yes but not by much. Yes, we progressed in Carling and perhaps the FA but in the EPL, not an inch of progression. We're still the same club that can't win away at Bolton, Sunderland, and Stoke so this hasn't changed one bit. Like Woy, Kenny's overspent on players that don't produce goals. And Kenny's made some maddening tactical decisions. Further, why did we not pick up a striker/offensive midfielder in Jan when it was apparent that we couldn't compete for the top 4? Am I ready to throw Kenny under the bus? No, not by any means, but the mid-table EPL form has got to stop. 3 years of 6th & 7th place finishes under 3 different managers is unacceptable for LFC. Is this 1994 all over again?
The league campaign has been a disappointment this year, but the calls for Kenny's head are over the top. He ain't perfect, some of his acquisitions have left me scratching my head but I'm not ready for another management roller coaster if it can be avoided. We don't have a finisher. Suarez is off scoring form and Carrol's been a bust. As others have said we need a pacy, modern striker. The midfield needs help. Gerrard's starting to show his age, Henderson and Shelvey need time, I'm doubtful about Downing and I don't want to talk about the Scottish guy. Let's make some good moves (for a change) and address these issues and see where we are.
The place of finish is not really as important to me as the talent in the squad and the intent of our play. If finishing 4th was fine before Spurs and City spent tons of money, why is finishing 6th now a failure? That makes no sense.
I said that if I am wrong then I need to be told where I am wrong and told what is right. If you do not want to indulge in a discussion then there is no need for those remarks. I told you and Grinners if you could change my opinion and provide a discussion I will gladly indulge but underhand comments?
While I think Kenny has some culpability I think Comolli should take some responsibility as well. He's heavily involved in player selection and simply hasn't done a good enough job.
I would blame Commoli more if he picked the squad on a weekly basis - and how it is used during the game - but that is not his responsibility. That falls to Kenny, and he has been a disappointment in that respect more often than not.
Right but Comolli is strategically responsible for much of the talent this season given he's signed the likes of Carroll, Adam, Downing, Henderson, etc. This is the primary complaint of a lot of people. The tactics - how they're used, motivated, etc on a weekly basis comes down to Kenny. Should we be better than where we sit? Probably. Could Kenny have done better with better players? Absolutely.
Better rename this thread to : "Welcome whiners, let's play the blame game." Pretty pathetic, really...!!!
One of the reasons I support Liverpool is because most of our supporters are not the kind of fair weather asswipes that support other teams. I am rapidly losing that reason.
It's just this board. Seriously. I lost my compassion and reason years ago with the people who only show up to piss and moan. Our club hasn't been great the last few years, but I still love it. And, I still feel like they played well on Saturday.
i think the frustration stems in large part from the fact that LFC can wipe up the pitch on any given day with the hind ends of the opponents and in the same breath lose points that looked to be in the bag. we ken that the talent is there, but will it show forth? who's minding the tiller??? frankly i don't like to see draws turn into losses when every advantage can be accounted to our side. to miss a penalty, hit the woodwork twicet, squander chance after chance and lose on the most precise volley in extra time seems a perfect commentary on the season so far, except for the wonderful passage through the Carling Cup ranks, with 5 straight road wins and just enough in the final.
C'mon guys. People feel hurt and frustrated after a result like the last one. Boards are great places to vent. So people vent. After they've lynched Kenny, Commolli, the owners and the tea lady they feel better and come back to reality. I'm guilty of it every week we don't get a result. Still love the club and the King and always will.
Getting into the CL = more revenues and we can attract better players. It equates growth. Winning the Carling cup and the FA cup every year gives us little else but metal cups.
I think the team plays fine and even some of the more disappointing players haven't been as much of a hindrance as people think. We are dominating teams but are not putting chances away. Kenny can only set up a team to create chances and stifle the opposition. Professional players missing shots or hitting the post from a few yards away isn't in the perimeter of Kenny's responsibility. It is the players letting us and themselves down. Not Kenny. If we had scored half our penalties and half the shots against the woodwork went in we'd be challenging for the title. I know, people are saying that it has become a problem within itself and you can't blame luck anymore. IMO you can. You can be incredibly unlucky. This is even more unlucky than the season we came runner up with Rafa. That was a season where it was a tactical problem - we couldn't create great chances with all that possession at times. That is where the whole 'we need attacking full-backs' argument came from. With Rafa we dominated possession but didn't have half as many goal chances as we have now. Right now, it is luck and little else that is stopping us from a top 4 finish. We really should be cruising this league. It is just that when it stops going in, again and again, you become disheartened. But the way the team has played has been fine overall.
I am proud to be a supporter of LFC, I have enjoyed supporting the club through the worst and the best. Carling cup success was well deserved historically people only remember who won, not how well the winners played. Similarly we can argue that we are better then Arsenal but at the end of the day they nicked three points from us. We played well but we do not get points for playing well. I am glad that the hierachy of this club from Henry down to the receptionist at Melwood are all in it for the good of the club. So are the fans. When people moan and groan during the first few games of the season you can call that stupid and unreasonable. However here we have a team which is collectively deserving the blame and apart from Skrtel, Suarez, Agger and Reina there has been very steady improvement from the rest. I never thought we will win the league, I never thought that Totenham will remain in the top four, Newcastle will perform beyond expectations, nor did I see the problems at Arsenal and Chelsea. I would openly apologise and say sorry if I come out as moaning and groaning, but just like the rest of you we want to move forward. Onwards and upwards YNWA.
If you're referring to the league and the European cups, sure. The others, maybe in the past; not anymore. They're nice to win, but given a choice it is a no-brainer top 4 > domestic cup.
Been there, done it....and agree. It's beyond infuriating, looking back at many of the matches over the last five or six years, when both or teams were robbed by woodwork, or a deflection that would have bounced the other way 8 times out of 10....and then, at the end of the season, to know that, with a little luck, and if only 3 or 4 of them had made it, the season would have ended differently. There's the 'new' reason for 'if only'...and that's the ref. But let's not even get started on that one. So, yea, I agree with you, it really should be remembered that the TEAM, has played well, but sometimes the Gods of Football, are complete, and utter bastards. So all that we, as fans, can do... is never give up
I get stuff wrong too, except for all the stuff I get right. http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/mar/05/liverpool-luis-suarez
Bingo. Many players opt to join us because of our prestigious history and its good for them to add to that history rather than make the accountants happy. I dont know if it was in Fowlers, Gerrards or Carra's autobiography but they mentioned that it was a huge relief winning the 2001 League cup as it meant no longer playing in the shadows on of the past. Since Reina(the queen) has been here he's won the FA cup and League cup. In the same space of time Arsenal have won nothing but participated in the Champions League 2 more times. Ask Reina what he would rather have and then tell me its a no-brainer. Ask a Man City fan what they were happier with last season winning the FA cup or qualifying for the Champions League. At the time some might have said the CL, right now i'd say slightly more would say the FA cup and in 10 years all would say the FA cup. Being in the Champions League is great for revenue but its prestige is very fleeting. Its like a kid asking for the most expensive fashionable trainers and them going out of fashion a couple of months later. The season before Kenny started we'd finish 7th, when he took over us in the league we were in 12/13th position. The great outfield players of the Rafa era have either done one(Torres/Alonso/Masch) or have declined in ability(Gerrard/Carra/Kuyt). Of the starting 11 in the Final 6 of them were newish players. Its going to take time. P.S. Had we been knocked out by Exeter like we'd been knocked out by Northampton and Reading in previous years I can guarantee that this laissez-faire attitude towards domestic cups would of been replaced by bitching about us not being good enough.
I'm sorry, but you're kidding yourself. Ask any top player where they'd want to go: a club that promises CL football or one that wins a domestic cup but fails to get into the CL. Ask Ian Ayre or the yanks or Kenny what they'd rather achieve. It's a no-brainer. Sure, a cup win looks nice on your CV in retirement, it's a historical mark to point to, but a top 4 finish is the most important thing for any big team in English football these days. If we want to get back on top it is through getting CL football and attracting the best footballers. Ironically, we'd probably be better placed at winning the cups also. But the other way round - meaning cup victories but not getting CL football - is a ceiling. Maybe worse; we get good players, win cups and they go to clubs winning bigger things.