We did pretty well Tuesday in the 4-4-2 diamond/ 4-3-1-2. The question is where does Landon go in that lineup? An immediate idea would be to throw him up top in place of Altidore or Buddle. No matter who gets swapped out, we end up with a striker partnership that has size, strength, speed, skill, ability to link up with the midfield, good movement, and at least one trustworthy finisher. My only issue with that sort of lineup is that we lose his influence in helping us work the ball through the midfield. We could have Dempsey play as a striker with Donovan underneath him and one of Altidore or Buddle, but again, Dempsey looked good in that role underneath the strikers, as good a finisher as he is. One thought I had was to instead use a 4-3-2-1, or something resembling it. A shape along these lines: https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=180 It's a mix of a 4-3-2-1 and a 4-2-3-1 really. Johnson defends as a central midfielder, but makes runs to the right flank when the USA has the ball ( a role called a "carrilero" - check this article by Zonal Marking for some good reading on the role http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/03/03/analysing-brazils-fluid-system-at-close-quarters/ ). This allows the rest of the USA midfield to narrow up a bit more, although Donovan can certainly drift wide left himself. I know mentioning a one-striker formation is practically begging for a gun to the head after we finally get a win in a two-striker formation, but we haven't seen what we look like with both Clint Dempsey and Landon Donovan on the field. That's bound to make noticeable difference, no matter what shape we play.
http://www.soccer365.com/news/u_s_news/u_s_national_team/6524/does_the_u_s_mnt_team_need_donovan addresses the same topic (sort of).
I agree somewhat with the article. Still think LD is first XI material though. But not sure he has it on "lock" like he used to. Not with how unpredictable JK is. For all we know, JK could hold the "comfortable in MLS" tag against him, as he wants all his NT guys to be challenged as much as possible, and could also hold not going to Fra against him, right or wrong. JK didn't appear happy about it. Even BB brought him off the bench twice in the GC, when he was healthy. LD simply needs to find a way to not float in and out of both NT and club games, which is happening more and more frequently.
Age alone in a physically demanding sport will dictate he will not be a 90 minute starter every game as time progresses. He has been very healthy for most of his career but with age some injuries has been creeping into his game. We are developing some attacking depth if everyone is healthy so that's encouraging. He's a winger or a forward in my mind and can play both depending on the variability of who's healthy, in form, and who we're playing. I want alittle speed up top so try him there first with Altidore and Dempsey behind them.
I think Landon has looked his most influential in a role as the left midfielder. The position really utilizes all of what he's capable of, in my opinion, mostly because it allows him to search for space in more than one way. Landon is great at finding space, should it be there. He can either drift in from the left immediately, or receive the ball on the touchline and cut inside. Either way, it allows him to, as he stated it, "face the field", allowing him to make intelligent plays with the ball. He can still get in behind defenses from that position, he can still shoot from that position, and he can still cross from that position ( check Jozy's goal against El Salvador. That's why I like that 4-3-2-1ish shape I posted - it allows him to search for that space.
The bigger question: Push up the defensive line and keep the possession? Or play reactive counter attacking soccer?
I'm going to have to agree with that. We finally have one - one - fairly decent game without him in the lineup and now people are wondering where he can fit in, or in the case of the soccer365 dude, not in the lineup at all or else a super sub? Yes, LD has had a poor year. That coincides with the US National Team also having a poor year (look at the 2011 statistical thread). It's not a coincidence. It's good to develop options and players who can step in and step up, but it's a little early to retire the guy. If he's fit and healthy (he's been hampered by both disclosed and undisclosed injuries for several months now), he's in the starting XI for an important game. RM, LM, support striker, or right behind the strikers, doesn't matter.
Its impossible to really evaluate donovan without him playing several games with the true first team. I still want to see what this 1 fwd formation would look like with bradley dempsey and donovan on the field at the same time
If we play a lineup that basically doesn't use wide midfielders like the one from last game, then obviously he plays somewhere else, probably either the CAM or one of the two forwards. I don't think the positions Bradley and Johnson played are great fits because they move him farther from the goal and have more defensive responsibly than he should probably have (although I think he could handle it, but I would prefer him more free to create), the article talking about leaving him out completely is way off base, as he is still easily one of our best players and versatile enough to play any number of roles.
I expect that we will play Buddle and Altidore the next match given how well they did in passing, holdup, creating chances, and applying high line pressure. Donovan slots in at one of the midfield slot likely RCM/AM-R. Donovan has been a good defender at the right mid slot over the years and that should continue. The formation flexes between a 4-1-3-2 and a 4-3-3 during the game depending on Dempsey finding space. ............Howard.......... ......Boca......Gooch...... Chandler................Dolo .............dog fight........ Johnson............Donovan .............Dempsey........ ......Buddle.........Altidore Dogs(Beckerman,Edu,Williams,Jones,Bradley,Holden,Torres)
The conundrum here is that his strength is running at defenders in space, yet as he loses a step, you don't want him wasting his energy tracking back in midfield. So play him as a second forward, but give him the freedom to switch wings and ghost around the top of the 18 the way David Silva does at Man City. Devote 3.5 positions to attack (Jozy, Dempsey, LD, and Fabian coming in from the left), while Bradley holds down the other flank and pinches in so Dolo (soon to be Chandler) can overlap more often than the LB. As Dolo ages and gives way to Chandler at RB, the LB position will again become one in which you can play a stay-at-home type behind Fabian. ------------Altidore------------- --------------<<<Donovan>>>--- ------------Dempsey----------- --Fabian----------------------- -------------------Bradley------ ------------Jones--------------- ---------------------------Chandler^ Boca(Lichaj)--Gooch--CG-------- Donovan gets interplay with Fabian on one side, Chandler on the other.
I think we cross the "lose a step" bridge when we get to it. Certainly for 2012 it is Buddle and Altidore up top with Donovan, Dempsey, and Johnson the level behind them. Those 3 can swap, interchange and find the game as required.
To me Donovan has already lost (or a bit of it) a step. He is not slow by any means but he has lost a tiny bit of that extra gear imo.
Donovan is the team's most field-aware player who sees opportunity way before it happens. He still has this, but has lost the young player's drive to leap into the fray and find instant success, beating defenses on pure acceleration and speed. So, IMHO, his best position as a contributor to team success is behind Altidore and Dempsey, allowing him to use his distribution skills and ability to attack from a deep position. Plus, he will be able to rotate through the nominal positions occupied by Johnson, Dempsey, just as they will rotate through his nominal position. Huge flexibility, plus it leaves room for both another midfielder with attacking skills (Bradley) and a dedicated defensive midfielder (TBD).
I think Donovan is going to be most useful to the US as a two way player. He's our best option to keep the ball when we win it in our own third, and our best distributor from wide or central spots in the middle third. With guys like Fabian, Brek, Jozy, and Clint to run at defenses, we can use his skills in other parts of the field. That's why I see him as a wide midfielder in the classical sense of the word. Get up and down the wing, defend, link, attack, cross, occasionally go at goal. Donovan still has the motor to do all these things effectively and doesn't need to be the playmaker in the final third every single time.
We're not going to play this formation every game, mostly because we don't have a dynamic enough DM to do it against most teams, not to mention a strong enough defense. Most teams don't either, that's why you see a lot of 4-2-3-1 now. One DM to break up attacks and one to distribute. I see Landon playing up front in the diamond formation and wide right if we have one forward. I would love to see this diamond formation in home qualifiers and against weaker opposition, let's take the game to them.
slight correction. the real answer is "wherever Klinsmann wants." (with the realization that "wherever Klinsmann wants" will likely always align with "wherever Donovan wants.") As long as Klinsmann is the coach (and possibly beyond that) I have a tough time imagining that LD would be struggling to get first team minutes or to "fit in" somewhere appropriate/useful.
Where does that leave Buddle who was the prime reason along with Johnson for the increased offensive output against Slovenia?
Let's see... when Klinsmann was asked what the US needed, he said it needed 11 Landon Donovans. We have traditionally looked like crap and created and scored very little without Donovan for years. He just lead the top team in MLS in scoring and assists. He is considered by pretty much any team that faces us as our biggest threat. But, we score three goals in a game one time without him and now he's going to struggle to get on the field? I can't say for sure where Klinsmann will play him, although Klinsmann played him at forward at Bayern and has said he likes him closer to goal and more in the center of the field. But Donovan is still our best player at a couple positions and he'll not have trouble getting back on the field for us. (although I would not be shocked if Klinsmann gave him a little smack down and subbed him infor a game or two for not playing against France) Oh, and whoever wrote that article says he just can't take Donovan seriously until he plays in Europe for a full season? Well, I can't take whoever wrote that article seriously until he can recognize who our best player is and has been for a decade now.
This is after my post so not sure who this addressed to but I have Donovan slotted into the wide midfield which is his preffered position!
If you figure that JK would go with 4 backs and one defensive mid i.e., 5 defenders and 5 on attack, and he wants to put Donovan in I suppose he would replace Buddle. How he would re-arrange the 5 attackers I don't know. Against Slovenia we had ---------------------Buddle---------Altidore----------------- ---------------------------Dempsey-------------------------- -------Fabian-----------------------------------Bradley----- --------------------------Beckerman------------------------ -------------x-------------x--------------x----------------x------- If that formation is used I suppose Landon goes into Dempsey's spot and Dempsey replaces Buddle. i.e. -------Dempsey------Altidore----- ---------------Donovan--------------- ----Fabian-------------Bradley----- My preference would be -------Dempsey------Altidore----- -----Fabian--------------Donovan- --------------Bradley-------------- Because I think Donovan's style in International play is suited to the RM. With a lead, we would take Altidore out and put Shea in with a 4-1-4-1 I wonder if there is any speculation that Shea will go to LB. Don't know how long he could last on long runs against international right wings. Who knows, maybe Shea is the answer to our prayers at LB.