Sporting Kansas City hires BBC announcer, Callum Williams to do play-by-play and weekly show

This 100%.

The bar has to be raised and the culture of the game grow before young Americans grow into that role.

 

My only point is that a 21 yr old doing regional BBC games is bringing more experience at a higher level than 99% of young soccer announcers in this country. Outside of BS posters, who else is even evaluating a young announcer for what, a D-2 team or college soccer? Compare that to the evaluation process with the BBC. Apples and oranges. Very few American announcers can put that on their resumes.

Arlo White has been fantastic for the Sounders, knows the league well, does his homework, and comes prepared. I don't care that he is English, he is getting the job done, and KC was not. Now, could we seriously not find an American PA guy?

 

First of all, every argument makes assumptions, and you can seldom if ever prove them all.

The operative assumption here is on what kind argument is credible. You're implying that everything that isn't disproven is credible. (And basically anything you imply that you haven't stated outright is an assumption. That's a good methodological definition of the word.)

I'm arguing you're wrong, that in real life there's a lot one can't prove or disprove that's still highly dubious. I suspect you'd actually agree with the general statement, but you haven't offered one way or the other.

I'm arguing there's bias in their hiring practices. The word 'prejudice', it seems to me, was put here to mush the difference between something much worse. Bias is something pretty close to universal (like assumptions), and often not aware of itself.

I doubt SKC had the kid hired before they actually heard him (the rigorous definition of 'prejudice'). That's not the same thing as saying that an American with the same background would be given a serious chance. Often, it comes down to hearing the same thing and thinking it's better, and not realizing that's because a different person said it.

But you're not listening. I'm not purporting to tell you how he was hired--I'm purporting to tell you how others weren't. And that is that soccer teams don't hire 21 year old Americans without a degree and with only a smattering of experience to be their #1 TV PbP, because they aren't looking for them, and they aren't looking for them, because they walk in with the bias that they aren't there to be found. You can, in fact, look around, and see whether that's the kind of person who gets hired in this business to either confirm my claim or dispute it.

Let me put it another way: there's a vastly better chance that the best American announcer out there is 21 and has done only a smattering of work, then there is that that kid would be discovered an elevated in that way.

 

I'm sorry, but you're really starting to look like someone who knows some 20-something kid who wants to be a soccer announcer and you're just mad that they didn't get the job but Cal did.

Frankly, you're being quite silly. Sure, nobody here can really tell you for certain that the fact he has a particular accent played no significant part in his hiring - it definitely is a possibility... but in the same respects, do you really think that SKC put a job posting on Monster that said "Soccer Announcer wanted, British Accent required"?

I'm sure JP was totally interested in doing PBP in Kansas City though and was even willing to work for the same pay, but SKC ignored all of this just because he didn't have the right accent. Don't even get me started on the recent influx of young American announcers we've had in the city recently... not that it mattered, I've also seen the bin in the SKC mailroom labeled "non-British announcer applicants" on one side and "paper recycling" on the other.

 

Really, you're now arguing about how theoretical people didn't get hired?

 

This stupid conversation is all predicated on the unfounded idea that Sporting went looking for Callum or somebody like him.

 

This isn't really a conversation for you is it? Just something to spoil with your presence.

 

It's not so much the opinions but how strongly you seem to feel about it. Granted, I may have gotten you mixed up with Stan conceptually here as well (it's the green, what can I say?), but even so - why do we need to be making such accusations about whether or not the guy got in on his 'good accent' alone before we've even let the guy have his chance to prove himself?

Anyone who says there _isn't_ a chance that where he's from had any impact on his hiring (without knowing something more concrete than what most of us have to work off of) is being silly.

In the same respects, even if there is a pattern and MLS teams and US sports media are, for the most part, simply ignoring the American talent pool and looking abroad, that doesn't necessarily apply here. Sure, it's understandable why it would get lumped in, but all I'm asking is to hold off with the conclusions until we at least get to see the kid in action, how the team uses him and, better yet, any discussion made available as to why exactly he was chosen.

We'd just hire him as a real-time, improvisational voice actor filling a part which requires a British accent.

Whatever, I'm really quite done defending the whole rebranding bit. Like it, hate it - but I honestly believe that people saying it was all just to be more 'euro' will be eating those words in a few short years... just like those who were calling for 'move KC' a few years ago _should_ be doing now.

 

Exactly. While I have absolutely no information myself to back it up, I would find it really surprising if SKC made the first move in this situation. As many have said, why would SKC be looking for someone like Cal (or someone like him) when there are other announcers 'more qualified' or 'more experienced' out there?

Rather, I would probably expect someone who describes themself as "a very determined individual"1 to have made first contact and been the pursuer.

 

I just wanted to officially announce that the number is 2,782. That is in fact how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

 

Ding Ding Ding somebody has a brain....

 

Trust me, I really hate that I'm taking this position. The idea that Brits might be inherently somehow better disposed to be soccer announcers is something I find personally revolting and offensive. But, I've come to not be quite so quickly judgemental, is basically all I'm really saying. If he sucks, THEN we burn him, but I'll wait to see.

1. I was hoping nobody would bring up JP Dellacamera and ESPN. Never underestimate the capacity of people to make bad choices. I'll admit that undermines my position, but I'm not at all saying there's a direct causal link either way, or that it's an iron clad law, only that the cultural context is important. I don't see how it's silly to say you're better equipped to make chili because you've been exposed to good and bad chili your whole life, whereas I might never have tried anything other than Nalley's from a can. That's some mighty crappy chili, in case you're wondering. Being exposed to something being done really well, or properly executed, isn't totally a prerequisite for being excellent at it, but it sure helps.

2. I'll admit we have some fine commentators, but great? To me it seems more important to have good quality announcers, rather than worry about their accent. That's what will be more likely, in more cases, in the long run, to develop the talent.

3. "And we won't develop them if we're importing 21-year-old announcers from the UK." This point seems unsupported by evidence or logic. A handful of instances in a tiny data sample isn't even evidence of a trend. Besides, this isn't a closed development system where there's limited international or domestic spots. Does being 21 matter? Is there a specific domestic announcer you believe was denied his chance here?

4. "You make it sound like a binary choice, that you either employ some import or some NBA announcer. It's not." I'm trying to say the opposite, that there's lots of gray areas and exceptions. Poor job on my part if I gave that impression. I've been more equivocal in this response.

5. "Other teams have slightly better eye for play-by-play talent."
"...but he proved that the people who made that call over at FCD knew what they were doing. But I guess that doing something similar would be unthinkable for you and the Kansas City muckety mucks."

I'm willing to admit that SKC, and FCD, and yourself, and most BigSoccer posters, are probably much better equipped to pick a great soccer announcer than I am, so I will just have to wait to actually hear him call a game before I pass judgement on what a crap decision they've made.

 

I hope Cal works out. But along these lines, what I'd really like to see is ESPN/Fox bring in a Brit to direct a few games. The Premiership has the best broadcasts in the world, and it isn't just the announcing crew. It's the camera selection, knowing when to broadcast a replay, etc.

Whatever happens, we can be assured that Cal will be better than Marcelo Balboa.

 

http://www.majorleaguesoccertalk.com/grant-best-interview-mls-talk-podcast/8857

 

Well, I'm a 22 year old professional meteorologist and my forecasts (both recorded and live) are broadcast on major radio outfits across the country, in major metropolitan markets too. Does that mean that I used my Long Island accent to my advantage? Youth doesn't mean he isn't good at what he does. I say that as a guy who consistently gets skepticism thrown my way from "Talent" that hasn't actually heard my work.

The same folks normally shut up after they realize that 22 doesn't mean incompetent.

 

The Cauldron made a ridiculous request for him to stop by our event tonight.

Any guy that flies from London, to Dublin, to Chicago, and THEN comes to a KC Cauldron Meet the Players event as soon as he lands is getting some leeway from me. I'm sure you're fast asleep at this point, but it was really stand up of you Cal - much appreciated.

 

You don't like Arlo White?

 

Where is that icon that has a whoosh of air going over a head when you need it?

 

You missed your calling in life.

 

Sounds great to me. If the KC fans like him, then it really doesn't matter what the rest of us think.

[If I have to sit thru Taylor Twellman and John Harkes stumble thru basic English sentences for much longer, I'm just going to have to watch the league in Spanish. New blood of any kind is much appreciated. If you've had so many concussions that your eyes are permanently crossed, then you can't be an MLS broadcaster. Sorry...............]

 

Interesting thread. Let us all look at this in a reasonable way. Is it not true that MLS, as it stands now, is a league where a young player can come in, play at a decent level, and make a name for himself? We as MLS fans do not like it, but we are a springboard in the career of some players (Montero, Adu,) and a place for some to find out they just are not good enough to work at a higher level. So as an 18 year old if I have the skill and drive to want to play in Europe but am not on the radar yet MLS looks like a good place to make a name for myself. I join the league for a few years, work my tail off, make that name, and hopefully get picked up for my dream job overseas.
Now, if I am a young announcer for the BBC and my goal is to announce in the Premier League, does our league not look like a place to come make a name for myself and build up my resume? Could Callum be here for the same reason as some of our players? Making a name for himself and building his skill set in hopes of one day calling games for a big club in europe?

Just a thought I had. If I were in his shoes I would hope I would have the drive and courage to leave the BBC and pursue my dream.

 

One last note on the "english accent" thing. There is some merit to the argument, but its justified. How many lead play by play announcers did ESPN go through in their world cup coverage over the years. We had Bob Ley, Jack Edwards, Dave O'Brien etc. These are good and talented broadcasters that came from other American sports but all who loved soccer at some level and wanted the job. We all bitched mercilessly about each of them and they never really caught the imagination of the viewer.

Well, last summer they got it right. "Howard will grateful take it. Distribution. Brilliant. Are things on for the USA here?" Not only did they find a truly great professional but Ian Darke was a guy who captured the viewer as well. After a couple of decades of trying, they got it right.

Now, right or wrong, what happens when something like this works? People try to duplicate it. Yes, the accent plays into that. It happens. Ultimately, Callum and any others will be judged on their quality. But its pretty pointless to fight the trend for the time being because success is always copied.

 

There is nothing to not like so far, met him a couple of times this week at training and we've gabbed on about football for an hour or two now. He doesn't seem anywhere as young as a 21 year old. Speaks well, clearly all the time - sharp - very intelligent, enough so to keep me on my toes and I don't feel like many people do that.

He knows the game, very driven and motivated. He wants to grow MLS and soccer in the USA. Spent a lot of time at training the last two days, armed with a clip board, pen and a pad of paper yesterday - studying, been hitting the stats preparing for this weekends broadcast.

First impression is this guy is no ********ing joke. He is very impressive irrespective on his age, maybe more so because of it. I'll be in LA for our first game but I am looking forward to getting home and checking out the broadcast.