The Passion of Christ (R)

Discussion in 'Movies, TV and Music' started by Alberto, Feb 16, 2004.

  1. Alberto

    Alberto Member+

    Feb 28, 2000
    Northern, New Jersey
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Okay so the film opens on Ash Wednesday. Apparently, the film has upset a lot of groups, specifically Jewish groups, some of whom have labeled Mel Gibson as anti-Semetic. Strong words any truth to it? I haven't read anything as to what the issues are with the film. Anyone know what's up and how is the film?
     
  2. sch2383

    sch2383 New Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    Northern Virginia
    As I understand it, none of the major Jewish groups called the film anti-Semetic, rather they feared that it could cause anti-Semetic feelings from people who took it the wrong way. I have read reviews on aint it cool and everybody has said it is a great film in and of itself, they all said it was powerful film and these people include a Rabbi, a Catholic and an atheist. It will be interesting to compare this movie to the other big religion movie among college kids, and I ofcourse I speak of Dogma.
     
  3. ricv56

    ricv56 New Member

    Jan 4, 2003
    Bellflower
    I've been following the development of the movie pretty closely for a few months and I saw a rough cut of it at a screening in early January.

    The scene, phrase actually, that's caused the firestorm was when the high-priest Caiaphas exclaims "Let his blood be on us and on our children!" Gibson defended the line's presence in the film by citing that it is found in the Bible (Matthew 27) but recent accounts say that Gibson is removing or has removed that line from the film's final cut.

    Anti-defamation league chairman Abraham Foxman seems to have softened a bit on his stance regarding the film, and like sch posted, said that he didn't believe Gibson or the film to be at all anti-Semetic, but feared that it would spark anti-Semitism.

    The movie itself was unlike anything I'd ever seen, it grabs you from the very outset and doesn't let go. I thought it being done in dead languages would be a serious hindrance, but the imagery was so stunning that you almost forgot about it after a while. Thinking about it, the fact that it was done that way beats the smack out of it being done in English accents.

    ricv56
     
  4. BadAzzSnowboarder

    BadAzzSnowboarder New Member

    Jan 14, 2003
    Malibu, CA
    Looks great. Can't wait.
     
  5. Excape Goat

    Excape Goat Member+

    Mar 18, 1999
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Re: Re: The Passion of Christ (R)

    I cannot stand this movie!!! I did, however, enjoy the Last temptation of Christ. I thought the film made Jeaus Christ more human.
     
  6. Davids26

    Davids26 Member

    May 31, 2000
    Anyone that goes and sees this movie and comes out with anti-semitic feelings already had those feelings.
     
  7. sch2383

    sch2383 New Member

    Feb 14, 2003
    Northern Virginia
    As I understood it from the interview last night, Gibson didn't remove the scene or line, rather he removed the subtitles for that line. Since the entire movie is in Laitn and Aramaic, he effectivly removed the line from the movie and all most people here will be the crowd yelling.
     
  8. Foosinho

    Foosinho New Member

    Jan 11, 1999
    New Albany, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't for a minute believe that the film, or Gibson, is anti-Semetic. However, I do understand concerns that some (already anti-Semetic) people will take the wrong message from the work. That is not a reason to ban, edit, or censor, IMO.

    I'm atheist (raised Catholic), and this film looks interesting to me. I'll probably see it, but I'm not planning on going out of my way to do so.
     
  9. Malaga CF fan

    Malaga CF fan Member

    Apr 19, 2000
    Fairfax, VA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Much like the passion plays that sparked Anti-Semitism in Nazi Germany or gave Hitler more of a reason or propaganda to prop up his Anti-Semitic campaign/attrocities. People have used the Bible, not just the passion story, to excuse every sin listed in that book and justify awful acts of brutality and hatred. I don't think this movie will be anti-Semetic, but someone could use it as an excuse to prop up their own agenda or bolster their own feelings towards the Jews.

    As a Christian, I know the Jews didn't kill Christ. His blood is as much on my hands as on Caiaphas the high priest's or Pontius Pilate's hands, they were just witnesses and actors in the events that changed history. I believe most people will see this film more for a personal experience of Christ and to see a different reproduction of the Passion than any other that has been attempted before. I'm looking forward to it.
     
  10. metrocorazon

    metrocorazon Member

    May 14, 2000
    I think that if anyone starts to hate jews on the basis of this movie/story they gotta be the biggest idiots to ever live. I mean what the hell do Jews in 1 A.D. have to do with 2004 Jews? You might as well hate Italians, English, Spaniards, French for all the stupid *#*#*#*# theyve cause people in the past.
     
  11. obie

    obie New Member

    Nov 18, 1998
    NY, NY
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
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    Maybe it's the greatest film ever, but I have no intention of seeing it. Gibson has played conservative Christians like a fiddle leading up to this, making the movie's success into literally a crusade for them, while shutting out of previews anyone who could possibly find fault with it (most non-conservative Christians). He's made it into a culture war, and I will never give him a dime of my money again for anything because I completely oppose his politics and his marketing.

    Then again, I live in heathen New York, where it's only going to be playing on something like five screens so it's not going to affect my life in the least. It's not even being marketed in the newspapers here. Compare that to places like Memphis and Dallas, where Gibson has bought out entire multiplexes.
     
  12. Malaga CF fan

    Malaga CF fan Member

    Apr 19, 2000
    Fairfax, VA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I believe it's called the law of supply and demand. We all know where the Bible belt is...
     
  13. bmurphyfl

    bmurphyfl Member

    Jun 10, 2000
    VT
    Club:
    Montreal Impact
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm a Catholic who attends mass regularly but I have zero interest in seeing this movie.

    With a 2-year-old and newborn at home, my wife and I might get a chance to see a movie about once every few months. Those times are rare and obviously precious. So, the last thing we'd want to sit through is something as heavy as the tale of Jesus' life and death. I know the story and its significance. I don't need Mel Gibson to tell it to me again. Give me a love story, comedy or some excitement during my brief escape from parental responsibilities; not a heavy handed tale.

    Murf
     
  14. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    Realistically, I think this is about right.Even if this film is antisemitic, I don't expect that all of a sudden Joe and Suzy American are going to exit the film and start hating Jews. It doesn't work that way, and the average American is a pretty shallow movie viewer anyway. If they go to watch the Jesus parts, the anti-Jewish sentiments, if they exist, will be an afterthought.They will largely discount it to "the way things were then" if they think about it at all.

    By acting like a rash of pogroms was suddenly going to break out, I think the ADL has really overplayed its hand here, sacrificing its credibility in the name of fund-raising. Given some of the things said about the film I can understand their concerns. But they've gone about it the wrong way.

    The bigger concern to me would be overseas distribution, to places where anti-semitism is part of the daily fabric. That is certainly a legitimate concern. So is the "JFK" effect, where down the road dumb kids seem to believe the truth of stupid theories put forth in movies.

    As a film, I don't think I've seen a bad or boring frame yet. That's amazing to say. While I have reservations about what I may think about it afterwards, I will almost certainly watch the film. I'm kind of excited about it, but also kind of apprehensive.
     
  15. joseph pakovits

    joseph pakovits New Member

    Apr 29, 1999
    fly-over country
    I hope nobody gives away the movie's ending in this thread because I might want to go see it.










































    Yes, that's a joke.
     
  16. ricv56

    ricv56 New Member

    Jan 4, 2003
    Bellflower
    That's a solid point, in conversations with my pastor (I work at a mainline church in southern California) he's expressed concern and skepticism with the degree to which Gibson seems to be relying on churches to publicize and promote his film. However, I think that conservative Christians are more than willing partners (accomplices?) to the whole thing.

    One of the things that is lamented in conservative Christian circles is the utter deficiency at any and all attempts at serious art. As a result, a lot of people in those circles were excited to latch on to something about Jesus that they found acceptable and would have credibility with the cultural mainstream, something easily lent by Gibson's name. Make no mistake, the conservatives have goals too and are every bit as savvy as Gibson as far as using this film to reach them.

    ricv56
     
  17. Malaga CF fan

    Malaga CF fan Member

    Apr 19, 2000
    Fairfax, VA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd have to echo that lament. When anything approaching serious art (wait and see with this film, no calling it that just yet) surfaces in the Christian community, it is almost hailed as the second coming, ironically. Guess that's what happens when you rely on fiddleheads like Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson to relate your message to the greater culture.
     
  18. patrickdavila

    patrickdavila Member

    Jan 13, 1999
    Easton, PA
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I have lost what little respect I had for ABC after watching that piece of "journalism" last night. ABC's anti-Christian bend was painfully obvious with every stupid and leading question Diane Sawyer posed. The so-called ex-priest theologian belongs to a group who sole aim is to debunk Christ of any divinity. These days it's so hip to portray Christians as right wing kooks. The film appears to be a very powerful interpretation of the The Passion. To quote some open minded individuals "If you don't like it, don't watch it!". I'm going to see it.

    Peace :)
     
  19. microbrew

    microbrew New Member

    Jun 29, 2002
    NJ
    There has been so much hype and publicity about the film (most of it free), I'm afraid to watch this live-action version of the Stations of the Cross and then be disappointed.

    I find this interesting: the film is independent, foreign langauge and subtitled, with an R rating for violence and blood. Nevermind that Mel Gibson is Catholic... the film is being heavily marketed to/with Evangelical Christians.

    The Economist brings up and interesting point about previous Jesus films:
    "Missing from all these films is any hint why Jesus in his day was regarded as dangerous."
    http://www.economist.com/books/displayStory.cfm?story_id=2441540

    And as footnote: Maybe "Luther" needs to steal a page out the "Passion" marketing book.
     
  20. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    This is apparently the first, or at least one of the earliest, reviews from a film person and not a hand-picked Christian/conservative luminary.

    http://www.mixedreviews.net/maindishes/2004/passionchrist/passionchrist.shtml

    Concerning the anti-semitism issue: It says basically that the ADL, et cetera are missing the forest for the trees. Says yes, there are moments that out of context could spark concern, but that concern can only come about by ignoring the sensibility of the rest of film. Christ is protrayed as a polarizing figure who garners the love of some of the Jews and the hatred and fear of others. As a film, he gave it the highest rating, saying it brings the weight of a "physical force" upon its audience.
     
  21. GringoTex

    GringoTex Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    1301 miles de Texas
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    No, Gibson has played conservative Christians, the secular mainstream press, the liberal intelligensia, and Jewish activists like a goddamn orchestra. You couldn't buy this much press with a billion dollar marketing budget. .
     
  22. Ylime

    Ylime New Member

    Jul 10, 2003
    Iowa
    I'm going. I'm looking forward to it too. Or as much as one can look forward to 'witnessing' Christ's death. I'm going to try not to look at the politics in this. I am in my 12th year at a Catholic school, and everyday we talk about how Christ suffered for us, how Christ died for us, but to actually see the pain, its going to be intense but will definately give many people a new outlook.

    As for the anti-semitism part. The actress who played Mary in the movie was Jewish and I heard she said that she didn't feel left out at all. We were talking about this in math class for some reason and my teacher pointed out an interesting perspective, instead of thinking of the Jews as the ones who killed Jesus we were to think of how if we were living back then it could easily have been us killing him. I don't know its just a different perspective to think about.
     
  23. peledre

    peledre Member

    Mar 25, 2001
    Sioux Falls, SD
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is it really necessary to have an (R) in this thread? I don't think any of us are going to be surprised by the plotlines.

    BTW, Monica Belucci is it this movie? That might be enough reason to go see it now. Who does she play?
     
  24. Ghost

    Ghost Member+

    Sep 5, 2001
    Man, this thing is polarizing critical opinion like no film since at least The Thin Red Line, Crash and possibly since -- dare I say it -- The Last Temptation of Christ, which split not only public but critical opinion when it came out, too.

    Here's the RT.com link:
    http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/ThePassionoftheChrist-1129941/

    The anti-critics seem to think it sacrifices spirituality and the Christian ideal of love for a blood-spattered ritualism. The pro-critics see its intense violence as a gritty baptism-by-fire.

    I personally usually think of polarization as a good thing, rather than go watch the Lord of the Rings which every critic loved but has little to say. .And I personally think that "art" has grown too passionlessly remote from the artist, so the things this film is priasd for --- intensity, commitment --- are traits that inherently draw me in. But I'm a certified wincer who doesn't like gore. So I basically don't know what to think, or whether I want to lay down eight bucks to see it.

    PS: Monica Belucci plays Mary Magdalene.
     
  25. GringoTex

    GringoTex Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    1301 miles de Texas
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    A whore, I hope.
     

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