Netherlands - USA [R]

Turned the game on just in time to catch the ball hitting Bornstein in the hand in the area (44'). No call from the ref or AR. Commentators seem to think that it was handling, but I'm not entirely sure that it was intentional. The ball seemed to jump up on him as he was turning and the hand seemed to be in a natural position resulting from his turn. I might be convinced otherwise, however.

 

Comparing that foul to some of the straight red fouls that have been defended by this board in the past only confirms my suspicion that the credentials for a red card have gotten so soft that most tackles are by definition red card, leaving an expectation that the red card will not be shown consistently. As such, what is and what is not a red card becomes a matter of subjective thought and personal preference.

This means that ticky-tacky reds like the one Bradley received in South Africa can only be defended by people who either have no expectation in a game called "evenly" or by people who fully expect multiple red cards in every game.

 

I would be interested in hearing the opinions of some of those I respect on this board. I thought the whistle was somewhat inconsistent. A couple of players went down untouched and fouls were called. For me, De Jong's actions after the tackle were those of a man who thought he was being sent off. For him to have only received a yellow is laughable.

On Donovan's handball in the attacking third during the first half (where he brought it down with his shoulder) - did anyone notice if it was the AR or CR who called it?

 

I'm leaning yellow. It looks like deJong's tackle was mechanically sound, but Holden cut so deJong slid past Holden and clipped him with his trailing foot.

I would go red if the contact was with the lead foot or if it looked like he moved his trail foot in a way that made it more likely to get Holden. I didn't see either of those things happen.

 

I don't think that was the contact. If it was then deJong should have been sent off. I'm pretty sure that the leg that appears to hit Holden is actually closer to us and continues past Holden with no contact. The foul is from the other leg that has not yet entered the picture.

Note that the sole of de Jong's foot is even with Holden's calf, not his shin. That would only be possible if de Jong's foot is between Holden and us or if de Jong's foot had passed through Holden's lower leg.

 

First Half:

07:49 DeMerit pulls on Kuyt under armpit outside pf penalty area, won ball, Kuyt falls, fans boo, Harkes says not foul, Kuty "off balance". Tough to see clearly but DeMerit should have been called for foul.

09:04 Netherlands #3 deliberately puts arm on Donovan's face and pushes him away, should have been a yellow, no word from referee.

09:40 Mystery call against Altidore, but obviously the two players were tangled up a bit.

11:27 Clear foul by DeMerit on Sneijder, correctly called, which Harkes says "looks like a fair challenge".

11:41 No back pass called on Torres for strongly hit ball cleared over the bar one yard out by Howard. No comment from either commentator, and no obvious signs of discontent from Netherlands. Very odd.

26:24 Robben pulls down Holden, no call. Not an easy call to make, though.

29:30 De Jong tackle on Holden looks like a text book red from certain angles but none of the angles make it absolutely certain. Very mysterious how De Jong avoids even a yellow on the play, despite the referee seeming to pointi out De Jong's jersey number to the sideline.

38:38 Bornstein tugs slightly at Sneijder in the penalty area, which Dellacamera declares "gotta be called". IMO, this is the type of play that gets called far too often in top level soccer. The tug itself was so slight that had Sneijder stayed on his feet, it certainly would not be called. Sneijder clearly dove. Sneijder should have been carded, and no PK should have been given. This is the type of play that makes me sick to see as acceptable by the soccer community. Granted, Bornstein's play was really dumb, and in real time, I probably would have made the same call. But winning PK calls by diving is unacceptable to me, and soccer needs to find a way to discourage it.

44:06 Good non-call on Bornstein's handball. Harkes got this one dead on. Bornstein clearly handled the ball, but was probably surprised by the high bounce the ball took, and may have slipped a bit on the turn. It certainly seemed as if he expected the ball to go under his arm, and he had no motive to play the ball with his hand.

 

The replays from ESPN360 are great. Closely examine the one at 29:54 (game time) [pause it at 47:54 video time].
De Jong fully extends his LEAD leg and catches Holden in the middle of the shin with his studs. This is a text book red card tackle.

Also instructive is that despite the close proximity of the referee, his view is obstructed by #2 in white.

 

The match report shows a caution on de Jong.

 

Somehow I missed that. I also missed what Torres did to get his.

 

I agree 100% with your analysis...Bornstein's foul did not cause Sneijder to fall. However, it takes me back to discussions we had on this board during the Confederations Cup. Why do our players continue to do things like this?

On Torres' backpass, it certainly looked like Torres hit it when I first saw it. That being said, it was difficult in real time to tell if the Dutch player had not made contact with it as well or if Torres was trying to clear it to Howard's right and it took a deflection. I think the ref got it right, because it was impossible to tell exactly which of those scenarios actually took place. The fact that the Dutch player didn't argue indicates that maybe he did catch a piece of it.

 

Actually, we have no idea if Netherlands protested or not, so "no obvious signs of discontent" was a bit misleading. Lengthy replays did not permit us to see Netherlands' reaction.

I still don't think there was a deflection, but I can't rule it out with 100% certainty.


Second half:

47:10 Huntelaar is called for a foul which should have been called against DeMerit.

53:04 Probably not a good call against Bradley on the sliding tackle into de Jong. Initially it looked like it was going to be much more dangerous than it actually was.

58:31 De Jong feels Beasley's hand on his back and drops to the ground. Beasley is called for de Jong's dive. Despicable aspect of the game, IMO.

59:10 Seemed like a fair header challenge by van Brockhurst against Beasley, but call goes against van Brockhurst.

The rest of Cakir's calls seemed pretty good. The call Beasley got which set up the US goal was very iffy, and probably would not be called in MLS, but I'll give Cakir the benefit of the doubt on that one.

Netherlands' #3 is Heitinga.

 

Having watched the play between de Jong and Holden, it was one of those borderline calls between red and yellow. Sad to note that Holden fractured his fibula, so in retrospect the send off should have been issued, not that there is any consolation to Holden or the US Men's national team. I wil note, that I do find it interesting that in many of these so called borderline decisions the US is always getting short straw. If the tackle had been committed by Bocanegra we probably would have seen a red card issued to Carlos and that is not fair. If the referees will err on the side of caution, de Jong should have been sent off.

 

38:38 Bornstein tugs slightly at Sneijder in the penalty area, which Dellacamera declares "gotta be called". IMO, this is the type of play that gets called far too often in top level soccer. The tug itself was so slight that had Sneijder stayed on his feet, it certainly would not be called. Sneijder clearly dove. Sneijder should have been carded, and no PK should have been given. This is the type of play that makes me sick to see as acceptable by the soccer community. Granted, Bornstein's play was really dumb, and in real time, I probably would have made the same call. But winning PK calls by diving is unacceptable to me, and soccer needs to find a way to discourage it.
44:06 Good non-call on Bornstein's handball. Harkes got this one dead on. Bornstein clearly handled the ball, but was probably surprised by the high bounce the ball took, and may have slipped a bit on the turn. It certainly seemed as if he expected the ball to go under his arm, and he had no motive to play the ball with his hand.


Let me take those one at a time....The first bold: Bornstein made a HORRIBLE decision to put his arm on a player in the area. That's a foul in the midfield, and it's a foul in the area, even as you think, not at this level. Can a defender be any more stupid?

Bold 2: Please stop with the idea of a motive. Referees are not mind readers. I think it was a penalty. If your reasoning is used, a defender would NEVER have a reason to play the ball with his hand.

 

He did break his leg. Stu is out at least 6 weeks.

I'm sure, though, because an established European star playing for a highly ranked European team made such a tackle that we will be repeatedly told that it shouldn't heven have been a foul on De Jong.

 

Holden's leg is broken, BTW. As someone has pointed out.

Here's a good video of the De Jong challenge. Looks pretty bad to me.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayEt24YOF5I"]YouTube- Stuart Holden injury vs Holland (3-3-2010)[/ame]


I guess if you try to give the ref a hug, he forgives you.


*Edit: You can see in the 3rd replay (about 0:38) that De Jong clearly makes contact with his leading foot, which causes Holden's leg to bend.

 

Leg extended, sole exposed, shin high and into the player... why is that even ambiguous? Regardless of intent, those tackles are extremely dangerous, resulting in the horror break on Ramsey and the lesser fracture on Holden.

Frankly I think it should be automatic red.

I will say in the refs defense is that he does look screened from the play. I think De Jong should be given an additional ban though for the tackle by FIFA.

 

Sneijder let himself fall easily I.M.O. I don't like that exxageration. However that does not mean it wasn't a penalty. Sneijder was pulled by the US player and was thus disadvantaged in a way that violates the rules. It was a foul. Just a stupid mistake made by Bornstein. Blame him, not the referee. Bornstein is lucky it's just a friendly. Such mistakes just cannot be made in an official match if the US aims to win games.

 

I think the penalty could have gone either way. To me it looked to be over-zealous hand check on Bornstein's part. The rest was a combination of Sneijder's momentum and "gamesmanship"

It seemed the ref gave the US the benefit of the doubt on the handling call. From the left post angle replay, it looked like Bornstein had already turned and the ball really did suprise him. It seems that would be the most relative to the referee's angle

 

Watching it, I don't see it as jumping out to me as being an obvious red-card horror challenge like some of the others that we see pretty much every week. He goes in toward the ball and seems to win it. But that being said, it was a bad challenge -- sliding thru the opponent, somewhat with both feet, studs up, straight-ish leg, over the ball and into the opponent's shin -- and it really needs to be a red card. Until the sendoff rate for challenges like that increases, and players become worried that they could be sent off for going into a tackle this way, too many players will keep doing it.

This type of challenge is definitely a danger to the safety of the opponent -- broken legs can and do happen from these. And 'endangers the safety of an opponent' is a criterion for a sendoff.

Hopefully Holden will be healthy in time for SA2010.

 

I already stated it was a horrible decision. I don't think an opponent would dive like that at midfield, and without the dive, I don't think it would be, or should be, called a foul. If you think otherwise, then obviously it should be a PK.

There is a difference between having a motive and having an advantage. If a Dutch attacker was standing 5 yards from Bornstein in the path of the ball, Bornstein certainly would have had a motive to handle the ball, even though he might still be better of letting the ball run to the opponent than giving up a penalty. The "accidental" nature of his handball would be looked at with much more suspicion than in this case, where it appeared, to me anyway, that there was absolutely no threat presented by an untouched ball.

 

all true.