Seriously great comments. I'm as stoked for soccer as I've ever been. The Superdraft is coming up, I get to go watch the USA destroy Mexico in Feb and then the Sounders kick off! Gawd it's a great time to be a NW soccer fan!
Not that you were watching the league before now, but the Toronto fans sold a few tickets as well. So your ticket sales being something unheard of until the Sounders ponied up the expansion fee is a bit of a stretch. I've been watching Toronto soccer (live) probably back when you thought your Mom's nipple was the center of the universe. That's an unfair assumption, but was too good a sentence to remove. For what it is worth (and I confess not much) I can point to generations of soccer players in our family, I was raised in London, and can point to a grandfather that wore the Arsenal uniform professionally, (albeit for the youth squad). He gave up soccer to build airplanes to defend England from Nazi tyranny. Not bad. My father organized, and helped finance youth soccer in Canada and I've supported the sport the best I can for decades. I played for the city team until I realized, in my teens that the competition around me was ascending to heights I could never hope to reach. But, go ahead and keep making assumptions about me based on a few lousy paragraphs of text, shows a wonderful side of your prejudice. Also the fact is, Seattle's sold more season tickets. Of course, you could raise the point Toronto's ticket cap is lower, but still the fact remains, and thus my statement wasn't a stretch, especially considering it came from someone who graduated high school and college in Toronto, and called it home for nearly a decade, and is fully aware of what Toronto FC, both good and bad. But that's not what disturbs me about your reply, because you rightly point out Toronto's success, which is admirable. What bothers me, is your assumption that I am somehow an inferior breed of fan, "new" to the sport, and inattentive to the league, simply because I posted a fact. Since you don't know anything about me, why not focus your argument on the issue that Seattle is indeed a greater soccer town than Columbus, and that our pride and witticisms here, are indicative of our civic pride and the rich history this city has with the sport, for which the reaction of some Columbus fans were outrageously ridiculous. Because if you think I'm some kind of newbie to the sport of soccer, you could not be more wrong. My connection to this sport is rooted in my family 3-generations deep, actually 4 if you count my children. This doesn't make me superior, or really anything at all, but perhaps, you should at least recognize that we in Seattle know the sport well, love the sport dearly, and shouldn't be assumed to be neophytes, just because it is convenient for you to decree so. Stick around, and you'll soon see our soccer community here is enviable, and we are rightly proud of it, and we refuse to apologize or play second-fiddle to anyone. We are also knowledgable fans, with a deep sense of history, and although we pound our chest like gorillas over the pride of our team, we are also reasonable, fair-minded contributors to this forum and others.
Can you explain to me how your family history changes the fact that your MLS team has not played one game?? So much bravado from so little experience. I couldn't care less who your father, grandfather, mom or whoever played for unless is means something on the pitch. There is no doubt there are fans in Seattle that follow the sport and know what they are talking about. The debate on who had a better 'soccer town' seems to be a little one sided in our favor. See, there is a Cup we won in the fall that is living here for a while.... Bring your USL team and your gimpy DP in to Columbus Crew Stadium and we can discuss who is better.
I'd love to see the massive Columbus pro soccer museum pages dating back to 1974. Can you point me in their direction, Mr. 'Soccer Town?' Sounders FC are the new kids on the MLS block, but Seattle was doing pro support when Columbus was a no-pro village.
There is a history of soccer in Columbus before the Crew http://www.dansoccerzone.com/SoccerGuide/guide.php?id=8 But really, let's look at what you have in your museum. We have the first soccer specific stadium. You have....... a football stadium. It's nice but it isn't a soccer stadium. We hold WCQ's against our biggest rival. You host.... Trinidad & Tobago? And lastly, we have a US Open Cup as well as two Supporters Shields AND a MLS Cup. You have a USL Title? Maybe, I don't really care. Fact is, the Sounders have great support in your community which is, by all systems of measure, a much, much larger community. I am proud of what we have built here in Columbus and it is you, Souders fans, that should want what we have.
I'll leave that to the greater soccer historians on the forum, but I will say comparing the history of the sport in our two towns is like comparing champagne to Dr. Pepper...and to make matters worse, all your history takes place in the state of Ohio. And God, I hate Dr. Pepper, tastes like rusty nails. And you can't throw a rock in this town without hitting someone who ran away from Ohio to live here instead, and who can blame them? You've never been to Seahawks Stadium, if you had you wouldn't mock it. It is a great place to watch a match, a beautiful stadium, you can see the Olympic mountains from the beer vendors on the west side. You can see Rainier from the South, and to the North you can see the city landscape, the Needle parts of the Sound. Dude, our stadium is gorgeous, and is the loudest place on the planet, because it is filled with the most vociferous fans on the planet, that have sold more season tickets than any other team. Oh and we just hosted Brazil a few months back. Robinho scored the game-winner late, not a US qualifier to be sure, but not freakin' bad either. Oh yeah, and now we have your coach...and we're not stuck with a dumb name like "Crew", which sounds like an arena football team, or some LL Bean fan club. Seriously? Columbus Crew? Is that some kind of sweater that sailors wore on windy days? You root for a yellow team with no history from Ohio. Man, I admire the fact your ego can take such an awful bruise, and still carry yourself with dignity. You're a braver man than me. Hehehe, to be honest, I wish you good luck next year, and be sure to scream your lungs out for the US when the time comes!
I think what GS was trying to say is that historically Seattle has been better a soccer city than Columbus. Sure the Crew have had success in recent years but there isn't much history. A US Open Cup, two supporter shields and a MLS Cup are great, but I wouldn't use those accomplishments in a argument that Columbus has a great history of being a soccer town. Mainly because it has all happened in the last seven years. I checked out that link to the 'soccer history' in Columbus. Really? The Columbus Magic? They played on "Astroturf in the city's baseball-specific Franklin County Stadium" and "the team was never able to attract crowds sufficient to sustain their payroll and the club folded under unpaid debts after just two years." That's some great history there. I won't try to knock the Crew or Ohio, but Seattle has some pretty neat soccer history on its side. Whether that makes Seattle a better soccer town or not is.. well, it doesn't really matter I guess. I mean look at Portland, they call themselves "Soccer City USA", and who cares about Portland?
I wish the Crew well, especially at the gate. I was happy they won the 2008 MLS Cup. I was disappointed they only drew 14,000 fans to the semifinal. While the crowd was loud, the low numbers don't argue for Columbus being a 'soccer town' just yet. The Blue Jackets draw more for an average NHL match. Seattle has a longer professional history in the sport than many cities in the USA, and more than some in MLS. When Sounders FC take the pitch against New York on March 19 at Qwest Field it won't be the 'debut' of Seattle pro soccer. In fact, we've got a quarter of a century behind us. The match will mark the 26th home opener for a club called "Sounders." In this sport, in this country, you count years survived as highly as you do Cups won. We've got plenty of cups, but it is the years and years of surviving that show Seattle has soccer roots deep down in our Emerald City soil.
Fact is, you don't know me at all. I have spent quite a bit of time with relatives that live on Lake Tapps. I learned to waterski on Lake Stevens. I am a diehard Seahawks fan (which isn't easy, living in Columbus). I have been to Seahawks Stadium and it is a wonderful stadium, for football. I am curious to see how they configure it for soccer. When your team gets it's own stadium, give me a call. I was out last year to watch OSU beat U-Dub like a rug. The view for a visitor was beautiful both inside and outside the stadium. At least when your teams are getting spanked you can look at the beautiful mountains, that is if it isn't overcast.... I am glad you put value in years survived then cups because right now, your 'years' are all you have. If the Sounders ever win anything, will they include all your accolades from the USL? I think not. So on that wonderful, overcast with a chance of showers day when your team takes the field, it will be the FIRST day of real pro soccer in Seattle. Nothing you can say will convince me otherwise. Obviously Mr. Allen cares about Portland. Where is your NBA team playing this year? Are the Mariners still drawing huge crowds? They have a pretty nice place to play and the view is the same as Quest, right? Look, I wish you guys the best of luck until we meet on the pitch. Really! I have loved to visit Seattle over the years and I agree it is a beautiful place to live. I hope Mt. Ranier never erupts and the area stays as beautiful as it is. My point all along is that the MLS it a tough place. League rules almost ensure parity top to bottom. We have the same players, give or take a few, that we finished near the bottom of the table with and we win the Cup and the Shield. Go figure. It just rubbed me a little wrong when this new expansion club started talking smack without even having a team at the time. Everyone needs to calm down, take a deep breath and enjoy what you have. Success comes with patience in this league. In Sigi you have a great eye for talent, just make sure your FO lets him have the final say on players. If he stays more than a few seasons I know he can build something. We are the proof of that! So again, good luck next year. Expansion is good for us all. If you want to come see the history of the MLS in it's first home, drop me a PM and we can have a beer.
The city of Columbus, and the Crew, are lesser soccer icons in the USA than Seattle, and the "Sounders" are. This is without us ever playing an MLS match. Don't talk down to us about 'the history of MLS,' which many of us have followed since day one, when Seattle was already part of the talk. You've stated your opinion, and had a voice in our forums. Most American soccer fans would disagree with you. We have no rivalry with Columbus, and likely never will. We hired a coach that your front office let 'get away,' but that doesn't make a rivalry, just like winning one cup doesn't make a dynasty.
What a pompous, smug and utterly ridiculuous statement. Are you just cracking up as you write this stuff? As a city I could give two shits about Columbus, but as the current cup holders and site of former and future critical MNTfixtures, Columbus clearly is head and shoulders above Seattle. Might as well just bend over now and assume the expansion club position. It will be along time until anything close to your quote above is reality.
You should have said "In my opinion" which doesn't hold much water outside the remote NW. Sigi will 'get away' from you as soon as the USMNT job becomes available. Remember, he has as much history in Seattle as he did in Columbus. He is a So-Cal and is trying to get home. As for the rivalry, you have to have a team to have a rivalry. Last I saw the Sounders we a USL team. We can talk again when your MLS team makes it's pro debut.
Are you? We are talking history, not just our new Sounders FC club. In MLS. News flash: American soccer history goes back before 1996. You are going to be surprised, but we'll never know about it because you won't be posting then. These are SEATTLE forums. Where do you get off talking smack in our territory?
Again, we are not rivals with Columbus, and your recent soccer cup is to be applauded. Now back it up by supporting the Crew in Columbus until 2021 and then get back to me. Seattle > Columbus in US soccer history Crew > Sounders FC in MLS (until Seattle wins a championship) That's not such a radical statement to make.
You try to talk a little history of the sport on this continent, and you get lectures about water skiing. In MLS. News flash: American soccer history goes back before 1996 Guys who cheer for a yellow team, that resembles a Village People logo, probably have difficulty with that basic reality. And how on Earth did the paltry sports history of Oregon get thrown into the mix? Oregon is the Robin, to our Batman, always will be, always has been. It's a B-grade economy, and a C-grade sports town. Very nice public transit though, congratulations. Seriously, the Oregon inferiority complex just never ends, the poor souls. I am very sorry you are sandwiched between Washington and California, and therefore nobody pays attention to your quaint little state. Congratulations you're the one and only Pacific-coast "fly over". That's your legacy, wear it with pride. To get the point of it though: the fact is, Seattle has a richer tradition and link the sport than Columbus, Ohio, no amount of jumping up and down and wagging your finger at us while telling tales of your obscure childhood on waterskis will change this basic fact. Also we're not yellow, and called "Crew", that fact alone should be celebrated. Oh, the Arena League called, they want their nickname back.
So the rich history of your teams include the following.... The final will be in Tukwila, Washington, where the Atlanta Silverbacks will play the Seattle Sounders. The venue, Starfire Sports Soccer Complex, boasts an attendance capacity of 2000, leaving this blogger puzzled how they were then able to announce a crowd of 3107 for their semifinal win there over the Islanders. I'm also more than a little disappointed (though not surprised) that the USL is going to have their Champtionship Final in a rec/youth soccer field. It is a decent venue, and I have enjoyed many Timbers vs Sounders matches there (overall it far exceeds Qwest Field), but it's embarrassing that the final will be held at a rec field in the suburbs in front of 2000 people. You can read the rest of this pretty interesting article at: http://nerdword.blogspot.com/2007/07/usld1-attendance.html Congrats on playing championships in a rec field in the 'burbs because it is actually preferable to Quest. Great attendance numbers, too! On that note, thanks for the interesting conversation. I will now turn my attention to those that really play the beautiful game, not just talk about it. Cheers.
Why do you feel you need to defend the honor of Columbus here? Everytime someone posts you feel that you need to come back and respond. You are not going to win this argument in a Seattle Forum with some fans that have followed Professional soccer here since 1974. In terms of the 2008 Sounders, this is a team that defeated a few MLS teams in the US open Cup. The USL is not perceived as a Major league and operated on a shoe string budget and therefore did little to promote the championship. The stadium was expanded to be able to seat almost 4000 fans. I expect that is Seattle was in the MLS playoffs and final the attendance would be 6 times that much (at least) When you can sell out your own stadium for the regular season and playoff games then come talk to us about attendance. We have nothing against Columbus and have given your team and fans well deserved praise for what you have done. You accomplished a lot and yes you are right we would like to have what you have in terms of what you accomplished in MLS. One day we will. The fact not opnion is Columbus does not have as rich of a soccer history compared with Seattle. There is nothing wrong with that, You didn't have a top flight team until 1996. With that said, you have been creating your own history in the last few years and that is something you should be proud of just like we are proud of the history that we have been part of for the last 35+ years. Years down the road, you will be able to say that you were there when Columbus started. You can take your kids and grand children and be proud that you were part of the histroy of your team just like some of us can say that about our Sounders. Looking forward to next year!
All I am really stating is that you didn't eben have the best fans IN THE USL. The sounder fans have been telling everyone how great they are and I am just pointing out the facts. No harm, no foul. But please remember, you have a great MINOR LEAGUE history in soccer, just like Columbus has in baseball. When it comes to the big leagues, you play second fiddle to all the existing MLS teams. That is fact not opinion. Maybe someday you can sell the same amount of playoff tickets of those soccer rich communities in Portland and Rochester. I will now leave you expansion newbies to tell eachother how great you are. USL Division 1 2007 Playoff AttendanceTeamHome GamesTotal Att.Avg. Att.Montreal Impact11021710217Portland Timbers22040110201Puerto Rico Islanders2182109105Vancouver Whitecaps147614761Rochester Raging Rhinos142944294Seattle Sounders267473374Atlanta Silverbacks242742137Carolina RailHawks1923923
We do think we have the best fans. Don't you think you have the best fans and dosn't Toronto think the have the best fans and so on and so on... What is your point? Don't most cities toot their own horn in terms of fan support. Phillly may think they have the best fans and they don't even have a coach or team yet. God Bless em. I don't have a problem with that. What do you care about what we think about ourselve's anyway? Have you ever heard of the NASL? Did you know that Harry Redknapp, Geoffrey Hurst, Bobby Moore, Roger Davies, Mike England, played for us. Do you even know who they are? Do you know that we played a team before a crowd of 60,000 people when the New York Cosomos came to town in 1976 featuring perhaps the greatest soccer player ever, the legendary Pele. Do you know who he is? I was there, were you even alive then? Do you know that we played the LA Aztecs featuring the late, great George Best (Do you know who he is? )in a playoff in front of 55,000 fans and won to play for the 1977 NASL Championship against the New York Cosmos. I was there, were you? No offense Son, I admire your passion but you need to go back a lot further than the USL and do your homework... ; )
Are you even reading other people's posts? It doesn't seem like it, so I'll catch you up on what you missed. There was a soccer league back in the day, it was called the North American Soccer League (NASL). It was top soccer league in the country, like the MLS of today. There was a team in the NASL called the Seattle Sounders. The team had a huge following and was very successful. So when you say Seattle has "great MINOR LEAGUE history in soccer", it's true. Seattle was very successful in USL winning four league championships. BUT, when you say, "When it comes to the big leagues, you play second fiddle to all the existing MLS teams."It's not true. Unless your definition of history only goes back to 1996. But as far as I can tell most people are arguing that soccer history in this country predates MLS. Just look at goalseattle.com. Check out the museum. There is some mighty fine "big league" soccer history there.
I suggest we start a "Wall of Shame" thread so we can honor all the mindless trolls that visit our forum. Timber trolls like Fenerbace who wallow in their little brother complex is one that I nominate. We can pay homage to the d-bags that feel a need to spew their tripe by listing them on the Honor Roll of BS Trolls.
Look at you guys on here. So sensitive! I mention that Columbus holds the trophy and has a history of key MNT games and you guys get so upset. You're getting pretty liberal with the term "Troll" to seemingly include anyone who doesn't agree with you. You've got to have a thicker skin if you're going to follow an expansion team. I didn't even mention Portland - why must you always bring it back to that? Aren't you supposed to have moved on from USL rivalries? And please don't pretend that many Seattle posters don't also participate in Portland-oriented discussions. I personally don't have a problem with that. Come on - it's the holiday season for many of you, relax and maybe toughen up.
It's actually a pitiful thing that the USMNT has to bunker down in a SMALL stadium like the one in Columbus in order to limit support for Mexico. That is less a statement of Columbus (or any other city with a tiny stadium) being a good venue and more a statement of the limited importance that is placed on the Men's team as a whole. I wouldn't be so proud of that.