That's waaaaay off base. Nobody is REQUIRED to cheer. Section 8 feels it's being mistreated (which from the information I have, I roughly agree with), this was a way to show the value of what they add....which seems to be lost on the people they are negotiating with.....and seems to be lost on you as well, since you certainly seem to be taking it for granted.
For obvious reasons we're trying to avoid running around to every forum and article with comments to answer every question. It's just not possible. I'll try and cover your questions by saying that the Fire was not agreeable during the Wednesday meeting. I can only say this so many times and in so many ways, but their response was extremely bizarre. In our 90 minute meeting on Monday, we itemized the events at the Chivas game AND a list of historical problems that, in our opinion, amounts to obvious racial profiling. The Fire's response on Wednesday didn't even address racial problems. Their written document with a bulleted list of responses to our concerns didn't even have a bullet point to cover any of the racial concerns we raised. When pressed verbally, the response I received was, almost verbatim, "What racial problems are you talking about? I kind of remember you saying that everyone that worked for the Chicago Fire is a racist." Obviously we never accused everyone that works for the Chicago Fire of being a racist. That's absurd. And them pretending we never raised any concerns of racism was extremely bizarre. It made no absolutely no sense. We have been in almost daily contact with someone from the FO since the story broke. We're going to resolve it at some point. I'm fully convinced everyone wants to find a resolution that, as I said in an email before the Wednesday meeting, is a mutually agreeable solution. At the Wednesday meeting, I would simply have to say that the Fire weren't yet ready to work towards that solution.
You don't see a difference between a player's actions on the field, which are subject, to some extent, to the other players on his team and the opponent (and for which no apologies are necessary) and a calculated (or three-times calculated, if you prefer) slam at the paying customers, many of whom you're paid to bring in in the first place? Just sayin'. I am not sure that's the strongest analogy ever.
Why can't the rest of the stadium get into the game? Why does it have to be two sections out of the entire stadium?
I tend to take post-game comments, particularly after a frustrating loss, with a ginormous grain of salt. Like everyone else, I would have preferred him to say no comment, but I really don't give a rats's ass what he says in a post-game discussion when questioned about something he's probably tired of being asked about. Yeah, it would have been great if he melted down on the press and called them all kinds of shit for asking questions that have no relevance to his responsibilities to the team, but the PR wouldn't have been any better. And with the whole situation, at this point, asking the players (any of them) for support, (which I'm sure all of them do support the vigorous prosecution of racism out of the entire organization or the organizations that it hires) is going to be putting them at odds potentially with the people who cut their checks and decide whether or not they get offered contract extensions or get traded. That's probably a lot easier to do when you're not a person competing for one of the 252 roster spots available in MLS. Put the pressure for change where it belongs. On the Front Office.
Technology reaches Fire fans There's some other new inventions: the Inner Tube & the youtube! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L34JTdo3ORw
A) Sector Latino weren't misbehaving. It started with a ticketing issue - 117 is general admission, but the front office has apparently also distributing tickets with seat numbers. Sector Latino was kicked out of their usual area because some people claimed those seats. That's how the abuse started. B) Section 8 went to the Fire and not only did we get brushed off, but their response was to take away almost all of the privileges we had negotiated over the past decade. Complain about security? We'll take a section from you and ban flagpoles, etc. Nice message they sent. C) Sorry if you think we ruined the game - after all, the Fire pay us handsomly for our services, and the other 19,000 people at TP must have had laryngitis on Saturday.
Sigh... The rest of the stadium isn't there 'to create a dominant in-stadium force unseen in any American team sport and to establish a home-field advantage whenever the club plays.' Section 8 (supposedly) is. I applaud Section 8 for standing up for what they believe in, I just wish they would have found a better way to do so. Sitting silently for 45 minutes to protest a security force that would like nothing more than to see you sit silently is kind of stupid, imo... It certainly seemed like the section took much of the second half off as well (I didn't hear much from minutes 60 to 90) and it certainly did nothing to establish a home-field advantage on Saturday. Sure the rest of the stadium sucked as well, but that's just what the rest of the stadium does. Sucks that the whole stadium sucked for this game, I can only hope that it yields the desired result for the Section.....
We can't fulfill our mission when we're being harassed by security and the front office ignores the problems. We can't fulfill our mission when they take away the tools we need to do what we want to do. Sometimes you need to take a step back to take two steps forward.
Let me get something clear: I am from Dallas, and I have worked for DCU, so I have ties to the two teams that hate you and that you hate. HOWEVER, this mistreatment is unacceptable. You have to have the backing of your FO, and when you don't get it, this is what happens. I am sorry for yall, and I hope that it get settled swiftly and quickly. Support your club to the best of your abilities and keep your head above this crap. Good luck.
That was in response to the 'you guys ruined the game' sentiment. When it all comes down to it, we're just fans like anybody else. We don't get paid for what we do, and the front office treats us like little children. We don't have an obligation to carry the atmosphere while those in charge do everything in their power to force us out. As for the second half, get used to it since the front office is trying to make it impossible for us to operate as we had in the past - probably no more capo stands, possibly no drums, definitely no flags.
If some members of Section 8 (or anyone anywhere in the stadium) are acting up, report it to Monterrey or a Fire employee and they will handle it. That was not even close to the issue on August 2nd. Not my problem, and I don't care. That is what some hot shot in the Fire organization gets paid for. I pay to watch a match without getting called a "********" or a "**************" by employees contracted by the Fire. Depends on the terms of their employment, which you are no more aware of than I am. Some acts call for a warning and others call for termination. I leave that up to Monterrey to decide. However, I pay the Fire to watch the match and not get called a "********" or "**************," so my concern lies with them. Again, not my problem. What the hell are you talking about? We suffer because our members are being mistreated and the Fire can give two shits about it. Not singing for a half is the least of our problems. Says you. He did it himself. No one in Section 8 accused Blanco of anything. He said what he said for his own reasons. Sorry, but when I am treated like garbage, I tend to lose my ambition to sing my heart out for 90+ minutes. Go figure. But hey, since your such a good fan, why don't you get a group together and sing in our place? Just make sure you bring all your banners and musical instruments 2.5 hours before the match starts, don't bring any flagpoles, make sure your banners don't say anything against racism, make sure if your sitting in a general admission seat that it magically has the exact seat number you are standing at, don't tape any of your banners to the walls of the stadium and make sure you don't have any racially undesirable people in your section... unless they like being called by racial slurs, profiled and having aggressive searches performed prior to entering the stadium. Oh, and don't forget you have to pay to make all of those leader stands, banners and flags out of your own pockets. What the hell do you think we were doing on Saturday? We were supporting our team! We love our team and we don't want to see it go further down a bad path because of fear or indifference. We love them whether they win or lose, but that doesn't mean we ignore or accept incorrect and immoral acts done by either the Fire or their contracted employees. Oh wait, this is the "real world?" I thought this was Zero Tolerance Towards Racism Land. My bad. Someone call the MLS and let them know that they can stop being so mean on fans who make racial comments.
The original comments weren't after a loss, were they? They were in the Trib prior to the game (Thursday or Friday, right)? I take post-game comments about officiating, about the left back that's been kicking you in the shins all game long, and about the coach who took you off the field with 20 minutes left with a ginormous grain of salt. Have Luis go give Blanco the opportunity to extend and amend his comments after the next training session and let's see what happens. Just sayin'. I just thought it was interesting how quickly he chose sides. He could have stayed out of it. He could have been diplomatic. I realize that would make him more like David Beckham than he probably wants to be, and that we criticize athletes all the time for putting the same old pablum out there. But I think it's considered bad form to trash the paying customers if you're a player, innit? And you see the problems one has when one tries to serve two masters. Believe me, been there. But you can sidestep the issue without throwing either side under the bus. It just didn't seem like there was much agonizing about it on Blanco's part, given how quickly he chose sides about an event that he wasn't even in the country to witness. I don't think anyone's suggesting Blanco's name is first on the culpability flow chart here. Just that he didn't do himself any favors and he just added to the flavor of the whole thing. Every club has to vigilantly provide a safe, intimidation-free environment for the people who attend its games. When they don't, they need to be told that they're not. Not everyone who lodges a complaint about something in this day and age in America has an actionable cause, but not every one can be just dismissed out of hand, either.
After reading the other thread, it seems as though even Spanish speakers have a difference of opinion about what was said, how it was/should be translater and what was meant. So it wouldn't be fair for me, the Gringo, to say definitively that he threw anyone under the bus, or intended to. IF his intent was to go with the word of his friend/bodyguard (who has a bit of a conflict of interest, whether it's just perception or is reality) and to trash the fans, he deserves scorn from those he threw under the bus. A federal investigation? No. To be sent packing? No. But if you wanted to boo him every time he touched the ball the next time out, I guess that would be your right. Now he's in Mexico with the national team and I don't know that anybody there will ask him about it. Maybe they will. But when he gets back, someone should get a clarification. If you're the club that employs him, you probably have a chat with him yourself before you let him talk to the media to amplify his remarks, and I don't know exactly what impact that will have on what he finally says when all is said and done. But MM10S is right about at least one thing - the Blanco situation is just kind of clutter in the larger discussion, which is about every fan's right to feel secure and unthreatened at a game, especially when it comes to those who are supposed to provide that security.
To that end, I just called my ticket representative to let them know that I found what I am hearing about the treatment of section 8 troubling. I didn't cancel or threaten to cancel my tickets, I just let them know the situation has me upset and I want to hear more from the team on how they plan to resolve the issue before I renew my tickets.
That was the point, to basically show that the north end creates 99% of the atmosphere and by handcuffing and intimidating us the FO and Monterey are hurting themselves in the long run. It's a shame that to Bridgeview and their cronies the Fire/TP is nothing but a giant boondoggle. They could honestly care less about the team or the fans.
Correct, but that doesn't seem to be everyone's issue at this point. As one should. I bet you have his e-mail address. I really try not to criticize athletes unless they're doing something really stupid like doing a fascist salute or driving drunk or beating their spouses. Yeah, the make a lot of money but they live under a microscope that has only become more and more focused on every issue in their lives and it's only gotten worse with the advent of realtime "reporting" by any douche with a video cam on his cell phone. Probably. We all wish he'd just let it drop, but he didn't. Water is under the bridge, but this is all just a distraction from the real problem which seems to be the issue with some members of the Front Office making a total ********ing blunder of this. I wonder, not that I paid any attention, but did Tom Brady have to field questions about all the illegal filming of opponents? Too bad that the Trib thought that that was the best place to go. Agreed - 200% - Now, where should that complaint be lodged. I don't recall saying that they aren't, but to ask a player about it because he's friends with the owner of the company who's employees made these mistakes is pointless. I wouldn't blame him for defending Gaytan, from everything I've heard about him, he's a piece of shit at best, but he's probably made it alot easier for from Blanco to live here, and really, that's Blanco's concern.
All you really need to fulfill your mission is a working voice. Again, I respect the fact that Section 8 as a whole stood up for what it believed in and I think it's deplorable that MS thinks hurling racial slurs at people is best way to provide security for the team and it's fans, but as I said- by sitting silently for the first half of the game, you essentially did their job for them, while not fulfilling your mission of providing the TEAM home field advantage imho. I don't sit in Section 8 or belong to any of the groups that do, so it's not my call. In the end, as much as I enjoy what Section 8 brings to the game, I left bitter that the Fire lost, not that Section 8 was silent. That just left me bewildered, even knowing what the reason for it was. The 'you guys ruined the game' comment was someone's opinion, one which I don't share. Losing to DC United ruined the game, at least for me. You're right- you are fans just like everyone else- no one else gets paid to watch the Fire, do they? And no one is saying Section 8 is 'obligated' to carry the atmosphere either, it's just what they seemed to pride themselves on, for the betterment of the team in general and the players on the field in particular. Again, I have no dog in this fight, my loyalty rests with the badge and the players representing it, not the owners nor the fans. I understand that Sector Latino has faced less than ideal conditions, I just wish that Section 8 as a whole would have found a better way to show their support. I'll be the first to admit to armchair quarterbacking here, but I just don't see how doing nothing does anything but help MS- which seems to be the opposite of the protest's intent...
When any even pseudo-racist activity occurred in S8, those individuals have been dealt with harshly, on a self-policed basis. None have ever been condoned or had a blind eye turned to, and the particular incidents over ten seasons number perhaps two. It should be noted security and team staff did little to discourage the same activity in those situations. Anyone who knows the SL guys knows they're here for the long haul. They were here before Blanco. They'll be here after. And most of them don't like him anyway. This sounds like the assertion by Monterrey that "Sector Latino" was causing trouble at the Barca-Chivas match at Soldier Field. Many of them still don't grasp that Section 8 is a Fire supporters' organization and not a freelance soccer hooligan group that shows up to anything soccer related in Chicago. In any case, apparently Monterrey's "eyewitness testimony" of SL's supposed misdeeds at Soldier Field for Barca-Chivas hold more weight with the club than dozens of eyewitness reports of their racial profiling at Toyota Park.
I understand the point- just as I did with the 8 minute protest when PW was fired. That made sense because it was directed at the FO, who should have an interest as to the atmosphere in the stadium. I don't really think Monterrey gives a flip about the atmosphere Section 8 brings to the games and it's doubtful this FO does either. It seems like handcuffing and intimidating Sector Latino HAS gotten Monterrey what they want- a quiet Section 8...
Our concerns right now are with the FO as we believe they are the only party that can solve the problem. Andell Holdings is in the best position to fix this. We have no official, professional connection with Monterrey Security, Stadium Management does. We have no official, professional connection with Stadium Management, the Chicago Fire do. Andell Holdings is the top of the pyramid and is the only party officially involved with all of the interested parties. They are the hub of the interactions and the communication has to flow through them. It is up to the Fire to speak up on behalf of their fans.
Not exactly. Without the drums that we usually have, it's hard to keep that many people singing at the same tempo, and without the usual leader stands, it's hard to keep that many people singing the same song. It was basically a disaster. This cannot be true. They can't be this stupid. Right?
Fair enough, but it doesn't seem like they're too keen on speaking 'up on behalf of their fans'- or at least those involved in this particular debacle. It also doesn't seem like they're that keen on the atmosphere Sector Latino and Section 8 provide. My guess would be they care only about the $$$ that they provide- Andell Holdings is a business, after all. The best way to get their attention would probably be devising a plan that involves withholding money from them en masse. The business' main objective is to make money and, right or wrong, it seems that they feel they can do so w/o the atmosphere Section 8 brings. I understand that there wasn't much time to plan and organize as is probably needed for an undertaking this grand, I would just hope that next time (if there is one- which we all hope there isn't) it involves something that hurts MS or the FO directly (taking at face value your account that they can but choose not to fix this problem) rather than the players and other fans- who IMHO both suffered with Section 8 silent on Saturday.