http://www.suntimes.com/output/soccer/cst-spt-soccin12.html says he is pushing for 2004 but garber would prefer 2005. there is also a nytimes article but i can't find the link. he mentioned also in one of the articles that it will not be houston.
Here's the NYT link: http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/11/s...00&en=def9353b00b88bcc&ei=5062&partner=GOOGLE And the snake-oil salesman's observations about Houston:
Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe Sounds to me like a little toddler didn't get his way when McNair said he wouldn't speed up expansion...now he's just jealous and trying to spin the rejection. Told you it wasn't going to happen.
Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe McNair can take his time because he negotiated in 2001 for a right of first refusal on MLS in Reliant that runs through the end of 2005. So as a practical matter, no one else is going to try to put an MLS team in Reliant while his right of first refusal is still in effect. Of course, no one else may want to put a team in Reliant in any event. But anyway, I have no idea why he would want to rush to do an expansion deal for 2004, or even 2005 for that matter. He has all the cards in this game and there's no reason why he should play his hand so quickly.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe Why would he wait? He has the experience in running a (successful) soccer team, what benefit would he have in 2005 that he can't have in 2004?
The start of the 2004 season is almost 1 year away as is. If he has an agreement with MLS (MLS cashed his check) then he is probably already putting together the team and staff necessary to run a team.
"It will not be in Houston. There are only 700,000 Mexicans there and the culture of Texas is completely different than California or New York, for example. The people in Houston are less passionate about soccer. And we're interested in buying a new franchise, not taking over one that already exists." -- Jorge Vergara, owner of Mexican club Chivas, who plans to run an expansion team in MLS as early as next season. (The New York Times) like this quote ... sounds like they're pretty serious. where do you think it'd be?!? san diego maybe?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe Do you mean Vergara? I can see why Vergara could go in 2004. But I don't think McNair has any incentive to go sooner rather than later. McNair may want to wait because time should be an advantage for him in a negotiation with MLS. No one else is realistically going to do a deal to put an MLS team in Reliant before the end of 2005 (because he holds a qualified right of first refusal). So, if MLS wants to expand in 2005 or 2006 in Reliant, then they have to deal with him. When you're in that position, you sit back and let the other side make you an offer you can't refuse. You still deal reasonably, but you can certainly take your sweet time about it.
11 MLS most likely won't allow just one team (chivas) to join in, making 11 teams, in 2004. Even if chivas is ready to field a team in 2004, they will have to wait until another expansion team is ready, which won't until be 2005 or later.
When did Houston get a team that he doesn't want to take over? Also with it only being a little under a year til the 2004 season, if they want to play then shouldn't they get a stadium deal done and soon, so that other things aren't booked, and wouldn't we have already heard something if they had gotten a stadium deal.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe Maybe that he would then be able to find a few more mexican nationals with US citizenship? Is there any info out there that says he wants his team to be all Mexicans? No big deal I guess... could he pull it off? S-I = Senior International - three right? T-I = Transitional International - 2 or 3? DISC = Discovery Player - say 4 or 5 DEV = Developmental Player - maybe 2 GC = Green Card Holder - only one in the league now, maybe a couple more by 2004. P-40 = Nike Project-40 - any out there born in Mexico? Even giving him 15 players in this set-up... he'll still need a US keeper to compete.
"other Hispanics" The miracle-potion peddler may have a point in there somewhere: Shift seen in Hispanic growth: New chamber president embraces a cross section of Latin Americans, Houston Chronicle.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe I think that DISC is how a player is acquired, NOT how he is classified in the league. Same with P-40s. A P-40 who isn't a green card holder or American citizen (is that even possible???) would count as a TI. A DISC would count as an SI.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe The MLS site has the list at the bottom of each team roster as a classification key for the 'status' of each player. A P-40 has to have gone thru the USSF system (ODP) but not be an American citizen. Pretty sure Dema Kovalenko was drafted as a P-40... now he's GC. It would appear that if they were born in a different country they don't count immediatly as a TI. Ah, who knows... we're probably going to see another MLS rule change in order to get Chivas money in the league, eh?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe Um, that's wrong. Tim Howard was P-40. So was Bobby Convey. And Demarcus Beasley.
http://www.mlsnet.com/about/regulations/ "FULL ROSTERS Each team’s full roster will consist of a maximum of 18 “senior” players, plus a maximum of six (6) roster-protected players. The home team may dress a total of 20 players for an MLS regular season game. The visiting team may dress a total of 16 players for an MLS regular season game. Three substitutions plus one goalkeeper may be used in any regular season game. INTERNATIONAL PLAYER/ROSTER LIMITATIONS MLS teams are allowed a maximum of three (3) international players on their active roster. U.S. Soccer, the sport’s governing body in the United States, has established that a player is considered an international unless he meets the following criteria: • The player is a United States citizen • The player is in the United States as a resident alien (green card) or under asylum protection, regardless of eligibility to play for the U.S. National Team. In accordance with United States Immigration and Naturalization laws, MLS shall not limit or restrict the number of lawful permanent or temporary residents, asylees or refugees permitted to play on any team's active roster. Green card holders therefore count as domestic, and not international, players. For the purposes of determining whether a player is an international player, his eligibility to represent the U.S. National Team is irrelevant. For the 2003 season, MLS will allow up to 20 league-wide places for young international players, who need not be distributed equally among all MLS teams. These youth international players will be considered Transitional Internationals. Each MLS team will be able to carry six roster-protected players, with the six comprised of any combination of Nike Project-40 and developmental players." and "2003 MLS PLAYER STATUS DEFINITIONS Rosters For the 2003 season MLS Rosters will include 24 players, six of which must be signed to either a Nike Project-40 or Developmental contract. Up to three Senior Internationals can occupy one of the 18 remaining roster positions. Nike Project-40 Players Nike Project-40 players are developmental players selected by teams through the SuperDraft or, if signed after the SuperDraft, through the lottery system. Nike Project-40 Players do not count against a team’s salary budget until graduation from the program. Players signed to Nike Project-40 Contracts receive an educational stipend. Player Classification Senior Internationals: Any non-green card holding foreign player 25 years of age or older (during the season under consideration) will be considered a Senior International (Some international players younger than 25 can be considered Senior Internationals due to their contract structure). Transitional Internationals: Any young international player will count as a Transitional International until the beginning of the year in which they are due to reach the age of 25, at which time they will be re-classified as a Senior International. Developmental Players (domestic or international): Each team will have six Developmental Players on its roster. The contracts for these players will not count against a team’s salary budget. In addition to Nike Project-40 signees, a team’s roster-protected players can only include those 23 years of age or younger during the season in question. Means of Player Acquisition Allocated Players These players are allocated to teams through the League office. Each year, additional allocations are decided upon and made by the League’s Competition Committee and based upon players lost and the teams’ on-field records in the previous year. Allocated player spots may be traded. Drafted Players These are players drafted by teams in the annual MLS SuperDraft. These players include college players, Nike Project-40 players and Youth Internationals, among others. The draft order is based upon the teams’ on-field records during the previous year. Drafted players and draft picks may be traded with league approval. Discovery Players A team may request that the league sign a U.S. or international player who is not currently under contract to MLS and assign the player to the requesting team. A team may add no more than two senior roster Discovery players by request in any calendar year, and shall have no more than four Discovery players on its senior roster at any time. Teams may trade Discovery players but may not trade Discovery player “spots.” Teams will have unlimited discovery opportunities for Developmental players." Assuming that MLS Chivas needs to fit into this structural set up, the only way that the team would have any real Mexican flavor would be if all three SIs are Mexican, there are some Mexican players out there who happen to be Green Card holders, and the team gets some of those limited TI spots (which, I assume would jump to 22 if MLS adds one team) and uses them to signs young Mexican players. Frankly, I seriously doubt that, under these rules, Chivas MLS would have an ethnic mix all that much different from ay other MLS side. OR the league could just jettison it's structure in order to accomodate a new investor. Somehow, I just don't think that's going to happen. And after reading Wagman's latest (linked to in another thread) I, once again, am douting all those rosy expansion predictions. Expansion needs to be about new investors and appropriate stadia in new markets. Vergara, it seems to me, has other things on his mind. I wonder how deeply commited he'd be to MLS if, say, 10-12,000 show up regularly to watch his team in Qualcom Stadium. I mean, you and I know there's a HUGE difference between on-off soccer events in the US (which can draw very large crowds) and the MLS regular season (which draws ... er, somewhat more modest crowds). I wonder if Vergara really understands that. I understand that they guy's not stupid. But it gives me pause when he states that his focus is on San Diego of the Mexican population and the weather. For example, has he ever mentioned his intent to provide a SSS? I mean, MLS has tried the renter in an NFL stadium business plan before. It doesn't work very well.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Chivas 2004... maybe A P-40 has to have gone thru the USSF system (ODP) but not necessairly be an American citizen. How's that...
Thanks Minnman... I just thought the idea was worth floating. I agree with your take on expansion... but it could be that under NAFTA there is some sort of subsudized program for foreign investors for renting ballparks... or maybe Vergara has a deal negotiated with Arnold (the Terminator - for Govenor), eh?
in a time table to start working and get a plan of acion ready: 1/ will you see chivas USA involved the next draft? 2/ Will they be able to hire and scout players as sonn as MLS finds the 2003 champs? 3/ Team colors should be the same as parent team? no one has those colors in MLS 10 teams yet..... 4/ Name coach and assistant first? or at least by the end of jan/04 5/ Present the new squad and jerseys by the all star game 6/ play double headers after the all star game, to introduce the team to MLS 14k current fans per city? 7/ roster ready by jan/05? any chances they get to play in 2004