NY Red Bulls @ FC Dallas Sa-April 12, 2008 at 8:30 PM EST [R] Pre, During, Post Game Thread

I understand what you are saying but Osorio never wanted the team to have to chase the game to score goals but they had no choice because Leitch screwed up his whole game plan 50 seconds into the game.

 

I see your point, but there's a lot to learn and a long season to go better f*ck it up now then later eh?

 

Leitch is not a central defender. Mendes should has been the one in the middle.

 

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1) Clearly Mendes is gone. Done. Off the squad the nanosecond Innes is signed. If he can not beat out either Goldthwaite or Leitch in the CB position in a 4-4-2, it's time to find a new line of work.

2) Dear JCO,

It would have saved you a ********load of time if you had taken the time to stick those post-it notes up your ********ing ass and watch every single ********ing Metro game from last year when Chris Leitch played in the center in a 4-4-2. For ********'s sake, even Arena didn't stick with that more than two games. Dallas thanks you for the three points BTW.

Toodles,

Me.

3) Borman = Richards West Side. Lot's of shake and bake, nothing in the cross. I do hold out hope he eventually gets better and wouldn't mind keeping him around. But he's not ready yet

4) This isn't ********ing Hoosiers and that's not Gene Hackman or Shooter on the sidelines. YOU DON'T HAVE TO PASS THE BALL FOUR ********ING TIMES IN THE BOX BEFORE YOU TRY TO ********ING PUT THE ********ING BALL ON ********ING NET!!!!!!!!!!!!


A couple of brainfarts on defense and some very , um , questionable finishing techniques (sounds like one of my dates, but I digress...) and it's a loss.

Hey JCO, you said we needed a CAM, LM, and D. Then added a DM. We still need the CAM, LM, and CD. We're still waiting. Git'r done chico. We aint making the playoffs as currently constituted.

 

THAT...JUST...HAPPENED!

 

With Osorio electing not to start Mendes in the middle, this game was doomed from the start since he is the only person other than Parke, who can play in the middle of the defense.

The score was misleading since Red Bull controlled more of the action. The last 20 minutes of the game saw a lot of guys passing up good shot opportunities to make an additional pass.

From a TV coverage standpoint, a shame that coverage again is from the studio. The half hour pregame show and once a week feature shows on Thursday's two years ago are greatly missed. No mention of deGranpre departing until late in the first half.

 

Mendes has been a solid contiributor in MLS for years yet now he is benith the lowly Leitch and Goldshitz? WTF??? What have I been watching the past few years?

We need about 3 players to help us be legit. How can a guy from S africa be so bad passing and a s american guy be so bad shooting? Borman and Etchevarry are one dynatmite pair, that is for sure. These are our improved players form last year? Oh boy.

 

Uninspired, boring, lack luster play. Guess Juan Pablo Angel is the heart of this squad, Etchevery looked awful and Jozy was a shadow of what he was last year. I know its only his second game but unless he steps it up those dreams of moving to Real Madrid will remain just that. Once again, JP Angel proves his worth even when he's not in the game.

 

damn that was ugly....I cant believe he didnt play Mendes at CB, slid goldy to LB and allowed VBD to play as the left winger. Borman's performance was horrendous.

 

Mendes was decent at best in 2006, a backup in 2007 and terrible in the preseason of 2008. If you're surprised he can't get a game now it's because you haven't been paying attention.

Leitch was bad on the first goal and deserves to be roundly criticized for it, but holds no responsibility for the second. Van den Bergh is the one who kept playing Dallas attackers onside all night, and Metro were bound to pay sooner or later. Frustrating yes, but even VdB doesn't really deserve the blame - this one's actually on Osorio. You can't take a midfielder and tell him to play in a flat back four with no practice and not ******** up the onside trap. You simply can't.

I remember asking JCO about this at Stout two months ago before the Sweden game, when he said he'd be playing 3 in the back at home and 4 in the back on the road, and he dismissed it as a concern. Maybe over the course of the year he'll be proved correct, but I doubt it. The sort of tinkering he does simply will not work over the course of a season.

And finally: Those of you suggesting Goldthwaite should have played at left back simply don't understand soccer. This is the second week in a row he's been the best player on the field. It's time you recalibrate your perspectives.

 

easy there, I was one making that suggestion, tho solely to have VDB play LM...and keep borman on the bench. Goldy was fine but after the way VDB played in midfield last wk its nuts that he wasn't there tonight....

osorio didnt have the personnel tonight to play a 4-4-2 and his tactical mistake hurt us. It should have been goldy-mendes-leitch in a back 3 and pack the midfield with 5...

 

I was dumbfounded when I saw the starting lineup. Did Carlos Mendes do something wrong that Osorio decided he couldn't be on the backline and in the middle of the defenders. I mean he is a central defender. He could've put another defensive midfielder and stayed with the 3-5-2, or he could have made it a 3-1-4-2. Two outside defenders in the middle of the backline was asking for trouble. Osorio & the club paid for that mistake.

We can also blame Jeff Parke for this as well. His double yellow = Red Card hamstrung Osorio. This should never have happened. But at the same time I think we can say that FC Dallas was due for a win, since they drew their last two.

All I can say is the club has a game in hand on the rest of the east and hopefully Angel will be ready for next week. Just get this loss out of the memory banks and face a Twellman-less & Ralston-less Revs.

 

I'm not trying to start anything here (after all, it seems like you all agree), but how long has Borman been playing professionally, and how long with NYRB? Besides his pace (which I'm guessing was the reason a lot of your play came down that side), he really was awful tonight, a big reason why you came away with nothing. I don't think he had a single cross come anywhere near Altidore or your other players, and in fact the majority were probably out of play before even reaching the near post.

 

That's Osorio for ya. Good coach, terrible at game management.

Good thing Wanchope has taken another job, otherwise you never know, he Osorio might have gotten him to come out of retirement and started him over one of your other 2 strikers.

 

Guess i don't know soccer as I thought Mendes was always solid and did not see that Goldshitz was our best player in the great central defense we had last night. I will correct my rose colored glasses today so next week I can see that. Funny how Shepp was saying how slow the Dallas defense was when to me it looked like they were always blowing by us like we were in quick sand. Guess I saw that wrong also.

 

I'm whit Fina on this, we have three months of training plus practices between games week after week to see the progress, adaptation and condition of the players to find out which one is ready to play and what position he can play the best and, ...if Mendez can't win over players like Leitch, Borman, etc... the only option is send him packing and bring that Central defender that we being talking for so long.... Now, one thing is certain, Leitch have to go...and pronto...

 

Yeah, I couldn't believe it either. It's amazing to me how far down the pecking order Mendes has fallen. It was very apparent from the meeting with the ESC that Osorio had a couple of months back that he's not a Mendes fan. Man, to have had Innes and Marmol yesterday! Also, I can't recall our team being beaten so many times in the offsides trap. I hope this JCO experiment never happens again.

I was also dissapointed in Echeverry's play yesterday. The guy couldn't put a decent shot on goal. I'm thinking it should have been Woly starting. Also, we need a true Creative Midfielder. Reyna and Magee are not the answer. I can't believe that Osorio hasn't seen the light on this yet.

Borman was putrid yesterday. He's a rookie but clearly doesn't have the skills of someone like Dane Richards who, in my opinion, had a tremendous rookie season last year (no matter what Devil500 says). That was the single worst display of crossing that I've seen since Petter Villegas.

 

Leitch can't play CB; Osorio should have known that. I don't understand the hate fest, though. You can never say Chris doesn't give it everything he's got. That's not necessarily true of other guys we've had out there.

If Mendes was on the bench in favor of Leitch, there must be something going on that we don't know about. It didn't make sense.

The worst one out there last night was a rookie - Borman. Since he is a rookie, and not effective, why did he play 90 minutes?

Seth, I love your tenacity. But please practice your passing; it's at best 50%. And you are in danger of crossing that very fine line and picking up a rep as a thug; be careful.

 

I've never been that angry while watching a RBNY game. They really played like shit. I was unimpressed by Borman and Sassano. Etcheverry just could not take a shot that didn't end up 30 feet over the goal. Jozy should have had a PK in the 1st half but that's all we could complain about for the ref. Every other time we got in the box, all we would do was just pass the ball as many times as they possibly could before getting it stolen and cleared. NOBODY ever looked to shoot. Oh and by the way, our back line was an embarrasment last night but we knew that was coming so...

 

Not what I was expecting in our second match.

Now for my Sunday Morning Captaincy Report ;-)

Leitch and Goldwaithe as our central defenders is a disaster, as the first minute showed. Conway had no chance when Dallas waltzed pass Leitch. neither are acceptable as it is, together in the center they are suicide.

Conway played well, and that break-away save was fantastic.

Borman is another Dane Richards, but I have no hope he will improve. If we end-up with Richards on one side and Borman on the other, we will score only on lucky set pieces.

Jozy needs to have an adult lpaying with him up front. Etch and Jozy do not have the collective experience to manage our front line. They do not have enough experience as a duo to lead a charge up front.

I think Reyna did a good job TRYING to manage the teram from the pitch, but without maturity up top, he has nobody to whom he can move the ball to set-up the finishing.

DvB was (again) a joy to watch and I am hopeful that he will have a strong year.

That must have been Stammler's evil twin playing last night, because it was a shadow of the guy who played so well against Columbus.

Sinisia and Sassano played well-enough.

Woly (I know it sounds insane to say this) should have started at the top with Jozy or Etch. He has experience. he is a vet. There has to be some experience at the top.

No comment on Magee. God bless him.

Did I miss anyone?

Let's hope we can step it up a notch against the crippled NE side next weekend.

 

They were blowing by us because three guys were constantly pushing up for the offside trap, and the fourth was always keeping the Dallas attackers on. If I'm moving forward and you're running past me the other way, then no matter what I'm going to look slow if I turn around and try to catch you.

We didn't lose the game because of anything physical last night. We lost it mentally and tactically. That's on the coach.

Innes is a guy who was very recently in the Scottish third division, and captain of the worst team in the history of the Scottish Premier League. Judging by Caig and Deucher's performances thus far, I'm not convinced Innes will be MLS quality.

I've never seen Marmol or any of his teammates play, so I'm less willing to pre-judge him. But I will say this: Osorio has said he believes Echeverry could challenge Altidore for a starting forward slot. Which is shocking to me, and indicative (in a profoundly bad way) of his talent evaluation skills. So until I see Marmol standing out on the field, I am beyond skeptical that this guy is going to be an improvement.

It's not an experiment - it's how his teams play on the road. He did it last year in Chicago and said he'd do it again with us all year this season. Get used to it.

32 goals in 12 professional years as a forward. And Osorio thinks he could start over Altidore.

I'm not confident.

 

It isn't fair to blame Leitch for either of the Dallas goals. On the first, he was marking another player, and for some reason the NY defender to his right, who was marking Alvarez, simply let Alvarez go. Leitch originally went back just following the path of the ball, and found himself next to Alvarez.

On the second, Cooper may have been offside, but if he wasn't, it was only because of the NY defender (VDB?) on the left side who held up his hand hoping for an offside call while not having a Dallas player anywhere near him or make any effort to help Leitch.

Also, the Altidore "PK" was a good non-call, as Dallas cleared the ball well before Altidore tripped over the Dallas player.

 

No, the Dallas defense was slow. How may times did we blow past them only to dicker around with the ball or send a lousy cross to no one?

Their offense however was beating the crap out of our offside trap all game wrong. I haven't seen it this bad since KC ran over and through us last year. The problem isn't so much the jumping to and from the 4-4-2, it's having a wingback who is not used to commanding the backline trying to run the trap. Having DVB loiter around didn't help either.

Hard to say if Goldthwaite was our best player. If he was, it is clearly by default because everyone else stunk as well.

I'd like to get rid of Leitch. Of course, It woudl help if he played at his natural position out right a couple of more games.

 

He won't be Taylor Graham or Canero bad. He was also captain of a squad that moved from the Third to the second to the premiership in consecutive years and was acknowledged as their best player. Right now, if he shows slightly better than Parke, I'd be happy to take him. I doubt he will be an All-Star though.

I do agree that has mancrush on Echeverry is very frightening. As is his inability to realize that we need a CAM pronto.

 

If he's in the same class as Parke I will be both elated and flabbergasted. Parke was one of the top four central defenders in the league last season. I just can't imagine a guy from a terrible Scottish Premiere League team - and for those of you who don't watch a lot of Scottish soccer, that means USL-1 quality - being a MLS standout.

*shudder*