Official 2007 All-Star Game thread

Discussion in 'Baseball' started by riverplate, Jun 26, 2007.

  1. Walter3000

    Walter3000 Member+

    Apr 8, 2004
    gainesville, Florida
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Its a good thing more people dont make decisions based off of a half season or one at bat, there are plenty of guys having bigger seasons right now than Pujols or even say David ORtiz, you'd still be an idiot to pick someone like Roward to winy ou the game over a hitter like those two.

    And if La Russa's excuse for not hitting him there, is lack of confidence(based off of one at bat or his first half of the season), even worse. "You're my best player, but I have zero confidence in your ability to get this hit."

    Francona would hit ORtiz everytime, Torre Jeter, Sciosca Vlad, etc etc etc. Only the dumbest of the dumb, would not only pass up one of the greatest hitters of his time, but also one of his own players down to their last at bat, because of potential(if we dont lose here) defensive problems.

    No brainer.
     
  2. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    If Torre chooses Jeter over A Rod against a righthander, or if Francona chooses Ortiz over Youkilis, Lowell, maybe even Pedroia against a left hander, they will lose baseball games and ultimately their jobs. ALL baseball decisions are to at least some degree brainers.

    Scosia on the other hand has only one first rate hitter, so unless somebody else is hitting .500 against a particular pitcher, Vlad will be the choice, whichever side the pitcher.

    The greatest hitters of a time do a lot of things exceptionally well, but they do not do all things better than anybody. Pujols is going to the Hall of Fame; Rowand, its too early to say, but it won't be with as many votes as Pujols if he does. But I'd use Rowand in this case-- unless I needed PUJOLS for his defense. (That's the third time I've written that-- will you get it backwards again?)

    Let me try this a different way; is there any situation in which you would bat Edgar Renteria over Pujols, needing a run? Rob Mackowiak? Jason Bay? Adam Dunn? Carlos Lee? Geoff Jenkins?

    Jason Kendall?

    Well, you better---- if the pitcher is Carlos Zambrano.

    Pujols---------220-313-488
    Renteria-------387-500-484
    Mackowiak-----306-419-556
    Bay------------364-447-939
    Dunn-----------262-396-690
    Lee------------343-410-860
    Jenkins---------295-347-523

    EVEN KENDALL-- 346-393-346.
     
  3. Walter3000

    Walter3000 Member+

    Apr 8, 2004
    gainesville, Florida
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No, your stats are meaningless because you fail to grasp the concept of the game's situation:

    Last out, bottom of the 9th, down a run, bases loaded. At this point your stupid splits are thrown out the window and your best hitter is the one you always want at the plate. Or to put it simply, you want Albert Pujols everyday of the week over Rowand.

    None of those managers, in a clutch situation such as this would ever pick anyone over their guy, especially Rowand.
     
  4. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If you need Pujols for his defense, that shouldn't affect your choice of batter in this situation. If you prefer Rowand as a batter, send up Rowand, and Pujols can still be insterted as a defensive substitute in the potential 10th. If you prefer Pujols as a batter, send him up, and now you have to put him on defense if the 10th comes to be.

    As it was, if Pujols would have batted and it ended up tied, then there would have been a makeshift but not completely ridiculous defensive lineup in extra innings. Keeping Rowand in the game was the preferred move from a defensive standpoint, as he was the only true centerfielder remaining, but that has to be weighed against offensive considerations, since there might not be any more defensive innings.
     
  5. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Yes of course-- when I initially raised the issue of defense it was to indicate that I didn't know exactly where that stood and wasn't able to include that in the question, not having seen the game or reconstructed it from the box score. I also didn't realize from the game story on Yahoo that the bases were loaded... I thought it was two on.

    Nor was I entirely clear-- one would also have to consider "Rowand bats, scores one run no out, now Pujols bats" versus "Pujols bats scores one run, no outs, now Rowand bats" as you say, along with whether one or both stays in the game, etc.

    I also don't know who Leyland had left to bring in (if anyone) after the first hitter if the game were now tied, and what the splits might be there... all I was really trying to say is, purely on offense and situational stats, I'd rather have Rowand there, and was not surprised that LaRussa thought so too.

    As for the poster who believes that the game situation was so intense that normal managerial considerations should be discarded and Rowand's talents disregarded in favor of an overriding worship of Pujols'; well he's entitled to watch games that way, if he wants.

    But he'll probably have more fun at football games. And he can even blame everything on the quarterback there... :D
     
  6. 655321

    655321 New Member

    Jul 21, 2002
    The Mission, SF
    No, that would be the MLS All-Star half time show.
     
  7. BenReilly

    BenReilly New Member

    Apr 8, 2002


    I pretty much ignore specific hitter vs. pitcher numbers because the sample size is so small.
     
  8. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Well I didn't choose any 5 at bat cases; and of course they are not samples per se-- they are the whole story.

    But I understand your point to a degree-- "They're not rules so much as sort of guidelines..." I certainly wasn't suggesting that Pujols should always sit out against the Cubs or anything. But if you are starting a four game series against the Cubs and you want to get Pujols a day off I'd certainly pick Zambrano's start...

    And let me ask you this--

    In a pinch hit game situation:

    Your famous guy is 4-30 against the pitcher the other manager will use, all singles, with six strikeouts, no walks and a GIDP.

    Your journeyman is 12-20 with 4 walks, 2 homers and 3 doubles, 2 K's, no double plays.

    Would you really use the star?
     

Share This Page