Yanks at Fulham

Discussion in 'Fulham' started by dstriker, Jan 3, 2007.

  1. dstriker

    dstriker Member

    Aug 12, 2006
    Texas
    Being a relatively new fan of the EPL living here in the States It's hard to tell what you read on the net is pure speculation, gossip, or fact, so I figured I'd ask.

    1. What are the chances of the Dempsey thing going through the tribunal and him actually going to Fulham? 50-50?? 70-30??
    2. I've read in many places that Fulham are also after Gooch...is this true?? Who knows because I've seen him linked with everyone.

    If Dempsey does indeed end up at Fulham this season I would be ecstatic. I love McBride and Dempsey....and for them to be together in the EPL would be fantastic from an American's point of view...And if by some twist of fate Gooch ends up there as well.....wow! I would be marking it on the calender everytime Fulham was on the tele.
     
  2. tomwilhelm

    tomwilhelm Member+

    Dec 14, 2005
    Boston, MA, USA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Dempsey thing is entirely dependent on the results of an upcoming tribunal to determine if he can play in England, since he doesn't QUITE qualify on percentage of national team games (due to injury).

    The Gooch thing is totally in flux. More info here: https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=457583
     
  3. Vicious Lhasa Apso

    Vicious Lhasa Apso New Member

    Aug 8, 2006
    My calculations say Gooch also falls short of 75%. Can he get anything UK-wise for being Nigerian? Would Coleman risk two tribunals? They are strong candidates, obviously, more so than Wolff, but it's a risk.
     
  4. giggshasscored

    Jun 5, 2004
    Omaha
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    varied thoughts:

    1) Dempsey falls short of 75%, but they are asking anyway. I believe they can claim he played in over 75% when he was healthy enough to do so. What is the precedent for this in other cases.
    2) If Gooch falls short of 75%, doesn't the same injury scenario apply..if i remember correctly he missed some games to injury.
    3) If Gooch comes, does that mean less minutes for Bocanegra and/or that Bocanegra has a short future at Fulham?
    4) How long does McBride have at being a player good enough to start in EPL? I think he's been a great player, but have been waiting for him to lose his starting place forever, although this season he's easily leading Fulham in goals scored, so am I just expecting his demise too soon?
    5) Has Chris Coleman and Fulham found an untapped goldmine in getting underrated Americans?
    6) this last one is for fans of Fulham and EPL that aren't too familiar with Dempsey and Onyewu: Which one intrigues you the most or think will have the biggest impact at Fulham? Both have played well for their clubs and US NT, and both are considered to be short of their potential... many consider these the two best young US prospects.
    7) why is there the 75% rule in the first place, and even if you argue it makes sense, doesn't a value of 50% make more sense since a player can still be a key part of a NT and fall just short of 75%

    thanks for any replies
     
  5. Jabinho

    Jabinho New Member

    May 29, 2004
    He's not Nigerian.. He's American.. The question should be does he get anything for his parents having been born there.. ;)
     
  6. Vicious Lhasa Apso

    Vicious Lhasa Apso New Member

    Aug 8, 2006
    The rule says "when available" and I think you can try and explain injury absences.

    "Work permits will be issued to international players of the highest calibre who are able to make a significant contribution in footballing terms to the development of the UK game at the highest level," is how the UK Home Office explains its work permit program. This statement is put into effect by requiring 75% caps and national top 70 ranking. The latter constraint is not an American problem so it's not oft-mentioned. The former, given our tendency to rotate players, has been a problem.

    I'd say that the 75% rule is based on a notion that the nation's best are turned out for all important games, something not always true here. They might find it amazing a nation wouldn't have its best out there 75% of the time, even if they skip a game or two. [Frankly, I wish we worked more on developing an 11 with chemistry, rather than constantly trying out peripheral people.] Of course, their situation is different. They have two qualifing seasons, where we have but one. We don't have to qualify for our continental championship. The rule only applies to qualifiers and tournament games, but qualifiers and tourneys like the Gold Cup are not the same tests here as in Europe, and we can afford to experiment. If England experiments too much, they might not make the next Euro Champs or World Cup. If the US experiments, we might suffer for qualifying position, or we might win anyway. Different contexts, and thus perhaps different assumptions about personnel choices.

    Fulham previously had Hahnemann and Lewis, so it's not altogether new for them to pursue Americans.
     
  7. giggshasscored

    Jun 5, 2004
    Omaha
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    thanks for the clarification about the 75% rule. also, I got the impression from another thread that being above 75% allows for automatic approval for work permit, whereas it doesn't necessarily have a damaging effect if that isn't met. But at the same time it has always seem with work permits in England that there isn't much consistency.. players get them when the thought was it would be tough, and then others never get granted a permit when the thought was it would be easy for them and no real reason as to the denial comes out.
     
  8. shinzui

    shinzui New Member

    Dec 2, 2005
    Gulf Shores
    If Onyewu and Dempsey can't win on appeal you could argue that there isn't a single American that would. If Dempsey is denied then MLS is closed entirely to all English clubs looking for players. A negative decision in this case would be devastating for MLS when they go to battle with leagues in Denmark and Norway and elsewhere over American college players and teenagers.
     
  9. giggshasscored

    Jun 5, 2004
    Omaha
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yes.. I certainly would expect Dempsey to be approved, but it does seem like the issue of work permits at times has no rhyme or reason.

    i wonder what the dempsey fee will be. teamtalk.com & 4thegame.com mentioned 1.5 mil pounds, and mlsnet.com put up 4 mil dollars.. that's about a difference of 1.1 US dollars
     
  10. tomwilhelm

    tomwilhelm Member+

    Dec 14, 2005
    Boston, MA, USA
    Club:
    Fulham FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As far as I'm concerned, no one has the right to ask that until he starts showing any signs of deserving it. He's the heart, soul, and engine of the team right now. Yes, at 34.
     
  11. Vicious Lhasa Apso

    Vicious Lhasa Apso New Member

    Aug 8, 2006
    The 75% is automatic and objective; the appeals process is subjective and about whether you meet the vague Home Office standard in the eyes of your particular appeals panel ("international players of the highest calibre who are able to make a significant contribution in footballing terms to the development of the UK game at the highest level").
     
  12. ffcseptic

    ffcseptic New Member

    May 9, 2006
    I live by the river
    probably contingencies to do with number of games played, goals scored, etc
     
  13. Trackman20

    Trackman20 Member

    May 14, 2003
    New York City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is the same board that granted ManU the rights to Tim Howard after he was clearly not qualified to do so on paper......right?
     
  14. giggshasscored

    Jun 5, 2004
    Omaha
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yes, which is why i like to say that there is no rhyme or reason to when they approve/disapprove. But then again, they denied a work permit for Jovan Kirovski to Man Utd on multiple occassions, and that obviously proved to be wise and he is barely good enough to play in MLS
     
  15. Wolves1935

    Wolves1935 New Member

    Jan 28, 2002
    Prospect Heights
    Didn't Tim Howard have dual citizenship?
     
  16. Blue Eyed Soul

    Blue Eyed Soul New Member

    Jan 22, 2003
    Gilbert, AZ USA
    Nope.

    It was ManU's big pockets doing the talking there.
     
  17. Mr. Bee

    Mr. Bee New Member

    Feb 2, 2005
    Buzzing Around
    Club:
    Wolverhampton Wanderers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tim Howard couldve gotten in through some Hungarian EU deal
     
  18. Vicious Lhasa Apso

    Vicious Lhasa Apso New Member

    Aug 8, 2006
    I understand he is now Hungarian and need worry no further re: permits.
     
  19. giggshasscored

    Jun 5, 2004
    Omaha
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yes. at the time Hungary was about 9-12 months away from joining EU, so they went ahead and granted a little early based on knowing this excemption would soon apply
     
  20. england66

    england66 Member+

    Jan 6, 2004
    dallas, texas

    wrong. he apparently has US/Hungarian citizenship
     

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