03/18/23 Seattle Sounders vs Los Angeles FC Lumen Field (4PM ET) REF: Ismail Elfath AR1: Jeremy Hanson AR2: Kevin Lock 4TH: Ramy Touchan VAR: Geoff Gamble AVAR: TJ Zablocki Atlanta United vs Portland Timbers Mercedes-Benz Stadium (7:30PM ET) REF: Ted Unkel AR1: Corey Parker AR2: Ian McKay 4TH: Ben Pilgrim VAR: Jair Marrufo AVAR: Jozef Batko CF Montréal vs Philadelphia Union Stade Olympique (7:30PM ET) REF: Nima Saghafi AR1: Lyes Arfa AR2: Oscar Mitchell-Carvalho 4TH: Filip Dujic VAR: Daniel Radford AVAR: Craig Lowry New England Revolution vs Nashville Gillette Stadium (7:30PM ET) REF: Jon Freemon AR1: Logan Brown AR2: Adam Garner 4TH: Marcos DeOliveira VAR: Kevin Stott AVAR: Rene Parra New York Red Bulls vs Columbus Crew Red Bull Arena (7:30PM ET) REF: Timothy Ford AR1: Ian Anderson AR2: Brian Dunn 4TH: Guido Gonzales Jr VAR: Jorge Gonzalez AVAR: Jeff Muschik New York City FC vs D.C. United Yankee Stadium (7:30PM ET) REF: Mark Allatin AR1: Andrew Bigelow AR2: Matthew Nelson 4TH: Chris Penso VAR: Sorin Stoica AVAR: Jonathan Johnson Orlando City vs Charlotte FC Exploria Stadium (7:30PM ET) REF: Armando Villarreal AR1: Nick Uranga AR2: Brian Poeschel 4TH: Tori Penso VAR: Kevin Terry Jr AVAR: Eric Weisbrod Toronto FC vs Inter Miami BMO Field (7:30PM ET) REF: Alex Chilowicz AR1: Micheal Barwegen AR2: Stefan Tanaka-Freundt 4TH: Gianni Facchini VAR: Luis Guardia AVAR: Fabio Tovar Chicago Fire vs FC Cincinnati Soldier Field (8:30PM ET) REF: Fotis Bazakos AR1: Chris Wattam AR2: Adam Wienckowski 4TH: Lukasz Szpala VAR: Younes Marrakchi AVAR: Tom Supple FC Dallas vs Sporting Kansas City Toyota Stadium (8:30PM ET) REF: Pierre-Luc Lauziere AR1: Ryan Graves AR2: Jeffrey Swartzel 4TH: Ismir Pekmic VAR: Carol Anne Chenard AVAR: Robert Schaap Houston Dynamo vs Austin FC Shell Energy Stadium (8:30PM ET) REF: Drew Fischer AR1: Felisha Mariscal AR2: Diego Blas 4TH: Kyle Atkins VAR: David Barrie AVAR: TJ Zablocki St. Louis CITY vs San Jose Earthquakes CITYPARK (8:30PM ET) REF: Rosendo Mendoza AR1: Cory Richardson AR2: Walt Heatherly 4TH: Allen Chapman VAR: Edvin Jurisevic AVAR: Tyler Wyrostek Colorado Rapids vs Minnesota United Dick’s Sporting Goods Park (9:30PM ET) REF: Rubiel Vazquez AR1: Kathryn Nesbitt AR2: Brooke Mayo 4TH: Jeffrey Greeson VAR: Alejandro Mariscal AVAR: Gjovalin Bori LA Galaxy vs Vancouver Whitecaps Dignity Health Sports Park (10:30PM ET) REF: Victor Rivas AR1: Jose Da Silva AR2: Mike Rottersman 4TH: Corey Rockwell VAR: Geoff Gamble AVAR: Mike Kampmeinert
Honest question-how many ARs working as 4ths like Rockwell and Atkins are at least doing high-level collegiate middles? We know Corey does, and I have to assume someone like Atkins has done some level of whistles. While we never wish for injuries, it’s obvious that the fourth is one pulled muscle or collision away from being in the middle. If Corey does have to step in for Rivas (and again, I obviously don’t want to see Victor injured), I think he can safely retire having checked off all the boxes on his career.
Fun fact, the 4O is not required to replace the referee should he be injured. Officials on games like these are being told ahead of time who will take over in the event of injury.
That said, Corey's already been the designated backup whistle for a game on which he was AR1 so I suspect he's been designated again today.
Elfath with a very solid game in SEA-LAFC. Things got very chippy late in the first half, but he got things under control. Cautions were at the right time. Just a very good performance in a big game.
Funny....my perception was the opposite (note that I'm a Sounders fan who was at the match, so saw what I saw live, not via TV replays). I thought he was very inconsistent. Early in the match, he let a lot of stuff go, which led to the huge mass confrontation at the end of the first half when someone from LAFC tried to kick the ball out of Frei's hands. Then in the 2nd half he started handing out cards fairly randomly, yet bent over backwards not to send Acosta off for a 2CT. And there was one incident where he signaled a foul in the wrong direction, sending the stadium into an uproar. Obviously, he landed the plane just fine, and there were no KMI's, but I did not think it was one of his better performances. Very inconsistent vis-a-vis what level of contact was a foul/YC. He was handing cards out in the 2nd half for fouls that he didn't even call in the first 20-25 minutes.
He also “bent over backwards” to keep Lodero on the field. No way Lodero didn’t deserve a 2nd yellow for stopping a promising attack on the second half.
Umm....Lodeiro didn't even get a first yellow.....I'm pretty sure you have him confused with someone else....Joao Paolo got a YC in the 1st half for a professional foul, but was subbed off around the 60th minute mark.
A bit of a mess in the end of the Montreal - Philadelphia game. Goal scored, VAR review, goal disallowed. Then... VAR calls the referee again because it turns out they missed a Philadelphia defender at the very bottom of the pitch. So he goes to the screen again and they reverse the previous check. It's interesting to me that they decided the offside decision required the referee to go to the RRA.
That's PRO's policy even though the VAR protocol in the Laws doesn't require it for this decision. This was almost a huge oopsie.
Let's be honest -- the fact that PRO does this is pretty much all that saved their bacon on this play.
Very complicated situation in Dallas at 90' (at least when the review occurred) but it's done correctly. Penalty and 2CT red card both annulled because of an offside where the fouled player is in an OSP ahead of the ball and then receives the ball (prior to being fouled) off a deflection from a defender. You wouldn't see this reviewed in England. I will also note that Unkel had no idea what they were reviewing, which I suppose speaks to how hard referee analysis can be in real-time with the pressures of the studio setting; she was literally talking about DOGSO and potentially a phantom foul when the offside decision was communicated. Also a good disallowance of an offside goal (interfering with keeper's line of sight) via VAR at 50' in Chicago
I get what you're saying, but I don't think this is true. The only thing that saved their bacon, so to speak, is that the broadcast showed an angle with the relevant 2LD in the frame before any restart took place. Either the VAR/AVAR duo saw that on the live feed and had their "oh shit" moment or the VAR/AVAR duo somehow caught it on their own while going through additional replays after Sagahfi had already left the monitor the first time. Either way, it's not so much MLS' process that saved things here but that Philadelphia wasn't able to take the IFK restart before the VAR team realized they had missing evidence. In theory, the exact same thing could happen with the drawing of lines. Put this in the EPL... VAR duo draws the wrong lines, tells the referee its offside. Referee says offside and raises arm for IFK. Prior to restart, VAR duo sees the angle with the relevant 2LD and they say "DO NOT RESTART!!!!" Same result, so long as the restart hasn't occurred. That's everything here. Watching the whole thing, two thoughts... A) Saghafi cannot be happy with Radford and Lowry. If not caught, that is an inexcusable mistake. But it's also inexcusable to give Saghafi incomplete information and put him in that position to begin with. Saghafi might bear some responsibility for not asking for the wider angle and/or remembering the defender would be there, but given everything on a referee's shoulders at that point, this is 99% on the VAR team and maybe 1% on Saghafi and AR1 (who could have piped up and said "guys, there's no way that was offside... in fact, now that I write this it is POSSIBLE that's how this got solved... Arfa might have been in everyone's ear and said "you guys are crazy because there was a player near the goal line."). B) Given the unorthodox nature of this event and the fact that there was already a long delay and already a caution to the technical area, I wonder if Saghafi could have short-circuited some issues by going over to the technical areas before he want back to the monitor to communicate what he had just been told and why he was doing what he was about to do. With Curtin and Losada (particularly given his volatility at that moment), maybe I'm engaging in a pipedream. But there is something to be said about preemptively trying to manage the teams and match overall when you know you're going to have to do something pretty wild that no one has ever seen. Side note: I love the announcers talking about how it couldn't be offside because it was off the crossbar. Experts in positions of perceived authority abound.
Exhibit B was Kyndra de St. Aubin at the start of ATL-POR saying how she cannot see how a Portland attacker directly between Williamson (the shooter) and Guzan while in an offside position can be called for offside. From the moment of the shot, I was thinking offside. The angle in the stands behind the goal made it very clear and obvious. She did not cover herself in glory at all trying to explain that one.
An added wrinkle. Victor Wanyama says he went to the fourth official and asked him to ask the crew to check the eventual equalizer again, because there was no offside. Wanyama claims the fourth official agreed to do that. #MTLvPHI #CFMTL #doop— Jonathan Tannenwald (@thegoalkeeper) March 19, 2023 It’s possible some version of this is true. But it still involves the VAR duo then seeing it and saying “oh shit don’t restart.”
Mendoza did a great job in STL:SJ last night. Very impressive command. Squashed the nonsense immediately.
I wonder that top, for VAR checks do the ARs get involved with the discussion? I also wonder where they get the feed from, because that should have been an easy spot from a better angle but the only angle shown on the replays was the one that had Wagner missing. Nearly a disaster but VAR reversing the VAR decision, even though it was right to do so, isn't a good look. (The replays and feed from apple was absolutely terrible all night, they completely missed the red cars in live time because they were showing some random footage so I hope VAR gets control of all cameras)
ARs and 4ths are essentially instructed to shut up during checks and reviews unless they have something critical to add. You’ll hear a lot of ARs, at the beginning of a check, describe a key bit of information (e.g., “he was in an offside position but I couldn’t tell who played it last so kept the flag down” to help guide a check or review). But not much more after that. It then becomes a referee-VAR communication. Unless, or course, they have something vital. Like could be the case here. Though that would be a stretch because he should/would be saying that earlier in the process, more likely. The scenario where something from the MTL bench prompted the 4th to tell everyone they might be on the cusp of self-immolation isn’t that far fetched.
And by not "far fetched" I mean "basically accurate." Montreal's knowledge that there was a player on the line was what prompted the VAR to look again. Whether it actually came from Wanyama initially and whether it was directed to the fourth aren't things I can discern, but a re-look was prompted because "they're saying there was a guy on the line" or something to that effect made its way into the comms. All that said, the VAR duo and Saghafi should not have missed this the first time. Even on the camera angle initially sent down, the relevant 2LD was visible right at the end. This was absolute disaster (barely) averted.
https://proreferees.com/2023/03/20/pro-statement-2023-mtl-vs-phi/ This kind of begs the question, if one doesn't have video that shows that wider angle, how can one make a conclusive judgement of offside in the first place?
But they did have video that showed the wider angle. And, in fact, this story isn't quite right--even on the video sent down to the monitor, the relevant 2LD was eventually visible at the end of the loop. Everyone just missed him. VAR is only as good as its personnel. There was human error here. You can say they chose the wrong angle to focus in on or you can say they focused too much at the goal area and didn't consider the foreground. Or you can say both, really. But it was very easy to make a conclusive judgment about offside with the available video. It was a 90th minute equalizer and things got rushed and they made a mistake. That's really about it here. It would have been a massive mistake if it didn't get caught in time, so everyone can just count themselves lucky that it was.